What if they turn back to abortion?

WEBVTT100:00:00.560 --> 00:00:06.440I Am Yours, I am yours, I am yours and me, Lord,200:00:06.919 --> 00:00:10.910I am yours, and welcome tothe Gospel Center pro life podcast.300:00:10.990 --> 00:00:14.230In this episode we're going to talkabout what to do if a mom that400:00:14.349 --> 00:00:18.550you thought chose life turned back onthat decision and had an abortion. How500:00:18.589 --> 00:00:27.620do you minister to them? Staytuned. I felt show passish, touch600:00:28.059 --> 00:00:37.770your heart. Use Me. Welcomeback to the Gospel Center pro life podcast.700:00:38.130 --> 00:00:42.329Appreciate you guys joining us and wewould appreciate if you guys would share800:00:42.329 --> 00:00:45.210this podcast with others. Let itbe a blessing to them if it's a900:00:45.250 --> 00:00:48.969blessing to you. If it's not, then let us know. If these1000:00:49.009 --> 00:00:53.280podcasts have not have been a blessing, we've covered subjects that have no application1100:00:53.399 --> 00:00:56.799to you, then please reach outand let us know what subjects we can1200:00:56.840 --> 00:00:59.880cover that could apply to you.That would help you. But we trust,1300:01:00.200 --> 00:01:03.950because we've gotten some positive feedback,these episodes I have been a blessing1400:01:03.989 --> 00:01:08.189and we're trying to answer questions thatpeople have and we're trying to cover subjects1500:01:08.629 --> 00:01:12.510they really come on our radar fromour counselors, from our missionaries across the1600:01:12.549 --> 00:01:18.269nation, from our local counselors fromourselves and our own experiences as things come1700:01:18.349 --> 00:01:22.180up. Yeah, pretty much.You know, you get to write in1800:01:22.219 --> 00:01:26.739an article and then we talk throughit and then we do a podcast based1900:01:26.780 --> 00:01:29.939on it. So that's what thisis for. That's what the foundation of2000:01:30.019 --> 00:01:34.129this podcast it is. It is. It's one of our missionaries that contacted2100:01:34.209 --> 00:01:37.890us and was in the situation we'regoing to talk about today and said,2200:01:37.930 --> 00:01:40.530I just don't know how to handlethis. Yeah, what should I do?2300:01:40.890 --> 00:01:45.010Yeah, so jumping right into it. What is that situation? Well,2400:01:45.329 --> 00:01:49.159she had counseled a woman who choselife. Okay, counseled her extensively2500:01:49.560 --> 00:01:53.040for quite a it sounds like fora few weeks in fact, okay,2600:01:53.599 --> 00:01:57.239and the woman was very committed tolife, going to church and everything,2700:01:57.400 --> 00:02:02.069and then all of a sudden choseto go have an abortion. Wow,2800:02:02.150 --> 00:02:07.310and I don't think she told themuntil after she had had the abortion.2900:02:07.229 --> 00:02:14.389And so that missionary there were tworeal issues. First of all, her3000:02:14.430 --> 00:02:19.379own anger grief. She said shefelt betrayed. She said she just wanted3100:02:19.419 --> 00:02:23.539to condemn and scream. She wasshe was hurt, she was angry.3200:02:24.139 --> 00:02:28.939She knew that would not be theproper response. But but that was where3300:02:28.979 --> 00:02:32.169she was emotionally. She had pouredinto this woman and on the other hand3400:02:32.729 --> 00:02:36.689she was thinking, well, whatnow? Weird, where do you go3500:02:36.930 --> 00:02:39.969now? Do you just stop contactwith this woman? What's what should we3600:02:40.009 --> 00:02:46.479do? Yes, a Gospel centeredprolife ministry. Yeah, well, first3700:02:46.479 --> 00:02:50.400and foremost, I'll say it mightbe easy to kind of look at the3800:02:50.479 --> 00:02:54.039success stories and think that all thestories that we have our success stories.3900:02:54.120 --> 00:02:58.710We talked about that, as wetalked about, I think, dealing with4000:02:58.830 --> 00:03:05.590discouragement and when success is not alwayssuccessful. I think was some been a4100:03:05.669 --> 00:03:07.789while back since we did that.We talked a little bit about this.4200:03:07.870 --> 00:03:10.189But this, this experience, isa reality that you're going to deal with.4300:03:10.229 --> 00:03:13.500It is yes, if you're outthere, babies are going to be4400:03:13.539 --> 00:03:16.219saved, lives are going to bechanged, praise God. But people,4500:03:17.379 --> 00:03:21.939even if they choose life, ifthey don't surrender their lives to Jesus,4600:03:22.180 --> 00:03:27.020m still our centers and they're stilltempted to go back on that decision.4700:03:27.139 --> 00:03:31.849So the fact that a woman choselife in that moment does not always solidify4800:03:31.930 --> 00:03:36.210that choice right and it is notalways mean that she's not going to turn4900:03:36.250 --> 00:03:38.889back. That's why we talk somuch about discipleship and getting them plugged into5000:03:38.889 --> 00:03:44.120a mentor mentorship program, get themplugged into a church, because we want5100:03:44.159 --> 00:03:50.719to surround them with the body ofChrist and be really with them and walk5200:03:50.800 --> 00:03:53.639with them so that when the devilcomes with his lies, when the boyfriend5300:03:53.639 --> 00:03:58.310who pressured her to have the abortioncomes back around with his lies, then5400:03:58.349 --> 00:04:00.750we can help squash those lives withthe truth of God and remind them that5500:04:00.870 --> 00:04:04.150we're here for them, remind themof their choice for life. Right.5600:04:04.310 --> 00:04:09.069And one of the things, anotherlittle addition to the story, was the5700:04:09.150 --> 00:04:14.419woman then, if I did admit, yes, she had abhorted and kind5800:04:14.460 --> 00:04:17.540of put on fake grief, itwas like, but it was. It5900:04:17.699 --> 00:04:21.220was sad, but it was reallyfor the best, right. And so6000:04:21.540 --> 00:04:27.889going back then, as though noneof the counseling at all had it sunk6100:04:27.970 --> 00:04:30.970in. No, this is notfor the best. Killing your baby is6200:04:30.089 --> 00:04:35.410not for the best and you knewthat. So it was part of what6300:04:35.689 --> 00:04:43.079that missionary that talked with me wasgrappling with. was there's no remorse.6400:04:43.120 --> 00:04:46.879Yeah, and that added to theanger that there was fake remorse. Right,6500:04:47.160 --> 00:04:50.920it was not more like the worldlysorrow. That's right, more like6600:04:51.040 --> 00:04:56.470a human just regret. Yeah,I regret that. I I regret that6700:04:56.550 --> 00:04:59.029I made a good decision for myself. It's like it is. It makes6800:04:59.029 --> 00:05:01.910it sense R now. It didn'tadd a godly sorrow. There's not a6900:05:02.110 --> 00:05:08.420true repentance. Yeah, now.And so we thought about this, we7000:05:08.579 --> 00:05:12.899talked about this and we wrote anarticle about this. But but one of7100:05:12.939 --> 00:05:15.379the things that I know is true, because I've done a little bit of7200:05:15.420 --> 00:05:17.420research about it, is, well, a lot of research about it actually,7300:05:17.459 --> 00:05:24.810is that post abortive women, theoverwhelming initial response is relief. Yeah,7400:05:24.889 --> 00:05:29.730and that can last a year,maybe even more. Yeah, and7500:05:30.129 --> 00:05:36.000what's interesting is so many of thepro choice studies about abortion post abortion say7600:05:36.519 --> 00:05:41.279the women feel relief, they don'tsuffer from abortion. But if you look7700:05:41.279 --> 00:05:44.720at those studies, most of themare very short term following the abortion.7800:05:45.079 --> 00:05:49.910They're not long term follow up studies. And the longer that a woman is7900:05:51.069 --> 00:05:58.389from that act, it seems thatthe Morse grows, the grief grows,8000:05:58.509 --> 00:06:01.750the recognition of what they did Gross, especially if they had had no children8100:06:02.149 --> 00:06:08.139and then they have children and therecomes then crashing down on them what they8200:06:08.259 --> 00:06:12.779really did, or if they come, like in my situation, from no8300:06:13.060 --> 00:06:18.170faith to coming to faith and thenthe recognition of what you did. So8400:06:19.410 --> 00:06:24.170what our missionary was asking is avery important question and I think that there8500:06:24.209 --> 00:06:28.129are strategies, there are things wecan and should do, but I think8600:06:28.170 --> 00:06:31.879it's important to understand that dynamic.Most of these women really do just feel8700:06:31.959 --> 00:06:39.759relief and it's going to be difficultto bring them past that to from well,8800:06:39.759 --> 00:06:43.560the Bible talks about going from worldlygrief to godly grief. Yeah,8900:06:43.879 --> 00:06:48.790and to a repentance of these tonation. When we oversimplify things, and9000:06:48.910 --> 00:06:53.949this is what I have seen insome of the pro abortion studies and statements9100:06:54.790 --> 00:07:00.189that talk about women don't regret abortions, is they oversimplify human emotions. Yeah,9200:07:00.269 --> 00:07:03.660and they imagine, or at leasttry to try to pretend, like9300:07:04.339 --> 00:07:10.540it's true that you can't have reliefand regret at the same time, but9400:07:10.660 --> 00:07:14.259you certainly can, and we knowthat right. Yeah, I mean even9500:07:14.339 --> 00:07:17.370just simply like buyer's remorse is oneof those things where you you have relief9600:07:17.449 --> 00:07:20.850that you've bought this thing you've alwayswanted, then you got remorse because now,9700:07:20.850 --> 00:07:25.370I gotta say for it's been thatmoney right. So, just pro9800:07:26.009 --> 00:07:30.079speaking, relief and regret can becan really happen to the same time,9900:07:30.480 --> 00:07:33.839alongside of each other, and soI will agree with pro aborts to women10000:07:33.959 --> 00:07:38.199feel relief. I won't say allwomen feel relief, because we know that10100:07:38.319 --> 00:07:41.560not to be true. So thenwe see immediate regret that it's probably more10200:07:41.600 --> 00:07:45.269the exception. Oh Yeah, I'msure, but just to imagine then that10300:07:45.350 --> 00:07:48.509I mean, I would say inone sense that woman who feels overwhelming regret10400:07:49.509 --> 00:07:54.670probably feels a little bit of reliefand maybe, by that same token,10500:07:54.750 --> 00:07:58.939that woman that feels maybe your overwhelmingrelief, likely feels a little bit of10600:07:59.019 --> 00:08:03.060regret. And I'll say that thathas actually borne out in my experience and10700:08:03.259 --> 00:08:05.500even what you're talking about with thisyoung lady. It seems to be the10800:08:05.620 --> 00:08:09.259case with her, because after all, it was just relief and abortion was10900:08:09.379 --> 00:08:13.410no big deal. Why is shetrying to justify it? I know,11000:08:13.529 --> 00:08:16.449why is she? Why is shesaying things like well, I know it11100:08:16.569 --> 00:08:20.209was not the right decision, butit's for the best. Yeah, we11200:08:20.410 --> 00:08:24.449know what she's doing is she's tryingto convince herself that what she did was11300:08:24.529 --> 00:08:28.759okay, that it wasn't wrong.And but even with that convincing like,11400:08:28.920 --> 00:08:31.960we're not convinced. We know thatit's wrong and they know that it's wrong,11500:08:33.000 --> 00:08:35.840which is why you're saying something tothe effect of God will forgive me11600:08:35.879 --> 00:08:39.559anyway, because that's what you heara lot of times to yes, God11700:08:39.000 --> 00:08:41.669give me. It is it's notsin. What is he forgiving you?11800:08:41.750 --> 00:08:50.070Of? Exactly exactly. And sofirst at first of all, help that11900:08:50.629 --> 00:08:56.740counselor to work through her feelings,which you're very valid. She has been12000:08:56.820 --> 00:09:01.100betrayed in a sense. This thiswoman made some sort of, if not12100:09:01.259 --> 00:09:05.700a promise, a kind of acommitment the councilor at port or her heart12200:09:05.940 --> 00:09:11.129into that little baby, and soit is natural to to be hurt,12300:09:11.370 --> 00:09:16.370to be angry, to feel likewhat happened? Why did you do this?12400:09:18.970 --> 00:09:22.009But I don't think that's where Idon't know how much of that is12500:09:22.289 --> 00:09:26.320is a good idea to share withthe mom. Maybe some, maybe some,12600:09:26.480 --> 00:09:28.320would be okay to share with her. I've had those situations. I12700:09:28.440 --> 00:09:33.440know you have to, and ina lot of ways you've poured your life12800:09:33.559 --> 00:09:37.480out for them and you've dug forresources for them. You've they've Crod on12900:09:37.559 --> 00:09:41.669your shoulder, not on your telephone. Right. They've they've got things that13000:09:41.750 --> 00:09:45.509you've talked with him through. You'vekind of built a relationship and a fringe,13100:09:46.149 --> 00:09:48.590right, and it is, inone sense a betrayaler. It could13200:09:48.629 --> 00:09:54.179be if you've built that relationship overa period of time, and I think13300:09:54.259 --> 00:09:58.340to voice that is not a badthing. Yeah, and really I think13400:09:58.340 --> 00:10:01.779it could bring that that real senseof conviction that you know what. This13500:10:01.820 --> 00:10:05.259is a big deal. Yeah,yeah, as and it of course it13600:10:05.539 --> 00:10:09.210should not be all about the counselorit. It should be about the baby,13700:10:09.889 --> 00:10:13.490which she did the the that,but it is. It is a13800:10:13.850 --> 00:10:18.049a and affront to the councilor whohas has befriended her, and I know13900:10:18.169 --> 00:10:20.639when it has happened to me,if I do have a relationship, I14000:10:20.759 --> 00:10:24.159care with this Satan year old I'vebeen counsel seen forever. She's due now14100:10:24.240 --> 00:10:28.000in a month. I don't knowwhat I'm going to talk about when rinch14200:10:28.080 --> 00:10:30.879finally has a baby, because she'sso of so many of my stories.14300:10:30.879 --> 00:10:35.029But there were many, many periodsof time when we'd been friends. Now14400:10:35.110 --> 00:10:39.830I'd been counseling her hours and hoursa day really for months, where then14500:10:39.909 --> 00:10:45.669at like twenty weeks she said shewas going to go aboard and my response14600:10:46.269 --> 00:10:50.580was, I would call it righteousanger. At that point I I really14700:10:50.820 --> 00:10:56.179gave very hard truths. Yeah,without really any hold spart, because I14800:10:56.580 --> 00:11:01.860felt like, okay, I've beenNice, right, I've played the nice14900:11:01.940 --> 00:11:03.649girl. Now it's found to laydown, you know, and I had15000:11:03.730 --> 00:11:09.169said everything Ye, so many timesand there comes the point that you just15100:11:09.529 --> 00:11:15.129really need, I think, toto bring home the point what you're about15200:11:15.169 --> 00:11:16.370to do, or what you havedone, if you've gone through with it,15300:11:16.769 --> 00:11:22.519is sin. Yeah, absolutely.So I want to say before we15400:11:22.600 --> 00:11:26.960jump into some of the the guessin depth right this conversation, there's a15500:11:26.000 --> 00:11:30.480couple of ways this could play outand particularly the angle we're coming from,15600:11:30.519 --> 00:11:33.629because this was the experience of themissionary you're talking about. Is You built15700:11:33.669 --> 00:11:39.590a long term relationship, like shechose life one day and then you've walked15800:11:39.629 --> 00:11:43.750with her, you've followed up withher, you've tried to connect her with15900:11:43.789 --> 00:11:46.029the mentor, you've built some kindof relationship and over the course of weeks16000:11:46.340 --> 00:11:50.460that she turns back. But itcan also take place in the moment actually16100:11:50.460 --> 00:11:54.820at the abortion center where you've pouredeverything out you could. You've taken them16200:11:54.820 --> 00:11:58.220on board the Mobultra sound unit,or you've taken them to a pregnancy center16300:11:58.580 --> 00:12:01.450and then you see the next daythey've come right back to the abortion center.16400:12:01.529 --> 00:12:05.649So we've had those situations as well. Yeah, so how do you16500:12:05.769 --> 00:12:09.129deal with that? And when yousee them, and I'm recalling a situation16600:12:09.250 --> 00:12:13.210where this happened not terribly long ago, we poured out to this mother and16700:12:13.409 --> 00:12:16.000we helped her when we showed herall the resources, all the things that16800:12:16.080 --> 00:12:20.080were available to her. Every issue, situation she was facing, there was16900:12:20.120 --> 00:12:24.000an answer for it, every reasonto choose life. She chose life in17000:12:24.080 --> 00:12:28.559that particular day and then a coupledays later she comes back and actually I17100:12:28.679 --> 00:12:33.909saw her going in and she actuallyhid behind one of the posts out in17200:12:33.029 --> 00:12:37.230front of the latter abortion center.There's like these columns and behind that tie17300:12:37.269 --> 00:12:39.509because from you, to hide fromme. Yeah, she was ashamed.17400:12:39.669 --> 00:12:43.980She was a shame and she apparentlywent in with the abortion, went in17500:12:45.019 --> 00:12:48.500and had the abortion and she's drivingout of the abortion center after having had17600:12:48.580 --> 00:12:52.620the abortion. How do you dealwith that? So, yeah, be17700:12:52.659 --> 00:12:56.220a long term thing, can bea short term thing. What do you17800:12:56.340 --> 00:13:00.610say, because we want to havethis balance between grace and truth that we17900:13:00.690 --> 00:13:03.970talked about, right, and wein a sense, in our righteous indignation,18000:13:05.169 --> 00:13:07.889we want to lay the hammer downand say, you wicked person,18100:13:09.169 --> 00:13:11.960look what you did. Yeah,but also we know that's not going to18200:13:13.039 --> 00:13:15.879be helpful, right, that's notgoing to be helpful at all for us18300:13:15.919 --> 00:13:18.519just to kind of unleash all ofour anger. But it's also not going18400:13:18.600 --> 00:13:22.559to be helpful for us to justsay it's no big deal, I'm sorry,18500:13:22.559 --> 00:13:26.840you made that. Mistakes and yeah, who what is helpful anyway?18600:13:26.919 --> 00:13:31.309Don't say that just with this rightoff. Don't say that God loves you18700:13:31.350 --> 00:13:33.629anyway, because then you've just madean allowance for sin. Is that true?18800:13:33.830 --> 00:13:37.750You can say a true thing ina wrong time and it be taken18900:13:37.789 --> 00:13:43.019completely in the direction Gott never intendedit. Right. So, of course19000:13:43.299 --> 00:13:46.340the best place, in my opinion, to go to answers, because I19100:13:46.539 --> 00:13:48.259wrestled with this. We all wrestlewith this. It's not easy, and19200:13:48.779 --> 00:13:52.220don't don't get me wrong. Evenas we give you these pointers, it19300:13:52.419 --> 00:13:56.090doesn't make it easy. It's noteasy, right, but I I went19400:13:56.169 --> 00:14:01.570to the Bible and and thought,okay, is there any situation in the19500:14:01.690 --> 00:14:09.000Bible where someone who is supposedly doingthe right thing, a righteous human being,19600:14:09.279 --> 00:14:15.960who turns to sin then letting downall those around him? Yeah,19700:14:16.000 --> 00:14:20.159and then someone confronts him, andI thought of the story of David and19800:14:20.360 --> 00:14:26.029Beth Sheeba. Sure, and Nathan. Yeah, Nathan was amazing in and19900:14:26.350 --> 00:14:33.309how he confronted David in in theaftermath of the sin with with Beth Sheeba20000:14:33.309 --> 00:14:37.899and the murder of Beth Sheeba's husband. You're Riah. So what? Basically,20100:14:39.220 --> 00:14:41.340what? What at this isn't,by the way, Second Samuel Twelve.20200:14:41.740 --> 00:14:43.860Yes, for all of you.That maybe when I wasn't going to20300:14:43.899 --> 00:14:52.100read the whole thing, although maybewe should. But Nay. Then tells20400:14:52.179 --> 00:14:56.649David he knows what's happened with BestSheba and Bath Sheba is now pregnant with20500:14:56.850 --> 00:15:01.450David's child and Uriah, the husbandof Beth Sheba, has been put in20600:15:01.529 --> 00:15:05.490the front line so that he willbe killed on purpose by David to cover20700:15:05.850 --> 00:15:11.080the sin. And then David TakesBest Sheba into his home, has his20800:15:11.279 --> 00:15:16.320wife. And so Nathan is outragedand he the way he deals with it20900:15:16.600 --> 00:15:20.629is he tells us a story.Yeah, to David. Great story about21000:15:20.629 --> 00:15:26.590a poor man who owns one lamb, I think. Yeah, and the21100:15:28.470 --> 00:15:33.789family pet lamb, family pet lamb. It was very precious and I can't21200:15:33.830 --> 00:15:37.899remember who the person power was.was he the king, someone that was21300:15:37.220 --> 00:15:41.019a rich man, a rich manman? Yeah, far from him.21400:15:41.100 --> 00:15:45.820And Kay in a position of power. Yeah, and he takes the poor21500:15:45.899 --> 00:15:50.370man who's in a position of hewas a rich guy. He didn't need21600:15:50.490 --> 00:15:54.409the lamb, but he took thepoor man's lamb. Yeah, he had21700:15:54.450 --> 00:15:56.850a visitor come, even though hehad lambs of his own. And Chris,21800:15:58.250 --> 00:16:02.529the analogy is that near David hadplenty of it hit so many whites,21900:16:02.529 --> 00:16:04.039all right and all that. Whywould you go and take someone else's22000:16:04.200 --> 00:16:08.799right? So he tells his story. Yeah, and doesn't say anything about22100:16:10.159 --> 00:16:11.960you know, doesn't even use thatthe rich man was a king or something22200:16:11.960 --> 00:16:15.720to make it real obvious. Hejust tells the story and David is outraged,22300:16:15.759 --> 00:16:21.470HMM and and and says that thisrich man must be severely punished.22400:16:21.549 --> 00:16:25.149How could he do this? Howcan we take from the poor guy who22500:16:25.190 --> 00:16:29.669had just this one little lamb?How could he take that when he had22600:16:29.789 --> 00:16:36.700so much and Nathan then says thatman is you. Yeah, and that22700:16:37.019 --> 00:16:41.580was the finger points the thing,that man is you. Doesn't, you22800:16:41.700 --> 00:16:48.730know, pour out anger or namecalling, just that simple statement that man22900:16:49.330 --> 00:16:57.610is you, yeah, and thatconvicts David powerfullet. So Nathan used a23000:16:57.730 --> 00:17:03.519principle that Jesus uses and I thinkwe could use frequently, and I think23100:17:03.519 --> 00:17:08.759we do actually in ministry, andthat is the power of story. Yeah,23200:17:08.880 --> 00:17:14.440and parallel stories and allergies. He'syeah, those are so powerful.23300:17:14.480 --> 00:17:15.670Now we might not be able tocome up with that. I mean this23400:17:15.829 --> 00:17:19.470was brilliant. I should I thoughtwhen Nathan came up with it was inspired23500:17:19.509 --> 00:17:22.150by the Lord, inspired by God. So we you know, yes,23600:17:22.230 --> 00:17:26.710I can we be inspired by Godand dealing with women, I'm of course23700:17:26.829 --> 00:17:33.180we can, but there are certainlytestimonies that that we can share that maybe23800:17:33.579 --> 00:17:37.380can help that woman to recognize,yeah, what she has done, the23900:17:37.579 --> 00:17:45.130depth of what she has done,maybe further humanizing and personalizee. Maybe what24000:17:45.250 --> 00:17:49.769that baby went through or what thatbaby has missed to out on. Yeah,24100:17:51.130 --> 00:17:56.289absolutely, and I think it giventhe proper scenario, sharing this very24200:17:56.450 --> 00:18:02.079story, yeah, with a mom, yeah, who has had an abortion24300:18:02.480 --> 00:18:06.200and has not felt the conviction ofit. Yeah, and then going right24400:18:06.319 --> 00:18:10.759to Psalm fifty one, which Ibelieve is the outflow of this story of24500:18:10.839 --> 00:18:15.029David, of his brokenness and contritionbefore the Lord for his sin. When24600:18:15.069 --> 00:18:18.309Nathan points to finger and says thatguy is you right right, David breaks24700:18:18.390 --> 00:18:22.470down in repentance and Psalm fifty one, yes, can read that, but24800:18:23.069 --> 00:18:26.940I believe that's David's Song of repentanceto God. You're right at you and24900:18:27.019 --> 00:18:30.460you alone of a sin and noneone is evil in your side. That's25000:18:30.460 --> 00:18:33.339what he says in some fifty one. Yeah, and and talk going through25100:18:33.420 --> 00:18:38.779that psalm with a mom and helpingher to recognize she clearly sinned against the25200:18:38.900 --> 00:18:44.609child, but ultimately that sin wasagainst God himself. Yeah, and in25300:18:44.730 --> 00:18:49.170rebellion, and I think that isthe important thing that we're aiming at when25400:18:49.210 --> 00:18:52.170we're looking for because what are welooking for? We're looking for repentance,25500:18:52.210 --> 00:18:56.720right. We're not just looking forsorrow, we're not just looking for tears.25600:18:56.799 --> 00:19:00.480Listen, people crowed tears for allkinds of things, but we're looking25700:19:00.599 --> 00:19:04.599for godly sorrow. We're looking forwhat it says in Psalm fifty one,25800:19:04.680 --> 00:19:08.880what David said. Yeah, isit. They acknowledge that they send against25900:19:08.960 --> 00:19:14.029God, and I think it's importantfor us in these conversations. Then we26000:19:14.109 --> 00:19:18.470can do it graciously. I don'tknow that we. You have to be26100:19:18.789 --> 00:19:21.309out of this the Holy Spirit.You have to do the best you can26200:19:21.390 --> 00:19:23.900to discern. I can't give youan exact formula of when you lay down26300:19:23.940 --> 00:19:27.460the hammer or anything like that.Yeah, let the scripture do its work.26400:19:27.900 --> 00:19:32.180Share them, share with them Psalmfifty one. If they're coming back26500:19:32.220 --> 00:19:34.619to you for whatever reason, youhave to ask yourself if this young lady26600:19:34.859 --> 00:19:38.089had an abortion and it was nobig deal and she's wanting to move on26700:19:38.170 --> 00:19:41.369with her life, why is sheeven reaching back out to the counsel right26800:19:41.609 --> 00:19:45.769right, why is she even responding? Because you'd think she would just block26900:19:45.809 --> 00:19:48.329her and we some of them did. What have some of them, dude?27000:19:48.369 --> 00:19:52.960Some of them do do that.So to me, I think either27100:19:52.279 --> 00:19:57.400divinely inspired or just inspired by ourown conviction and look grasping for something,27200:19:59.079 --> 00:20:02.480she reads back out to this thiscounselor back out of this missionary. But27300:20:02.519 --> 00:20:06.519I think in those situations, shootthe scripture over to him. We just27400:20:06.839 --> 00:20:08.670please read Psalm fifty one. That'sall. I'm asking for you, you27500:20:08.750 --> 00:20:11.430know. Yeah, just let thescripture do it's work. You don't have27600:20:11.549 --> 00:20:15.869to be the bad guy. Letus let the scripture be the good guy27700:20:15.990 --> 00:20:21.430that brings the bad, the thewant say the bad truth, but the27800:20:21.460 --> 00:20:26.059the reality of their accountability to God, and let let the Holy Spirit do27900:20:26.220 --> 00:20:32.220his job. Right. I thinkin counseling counselors that go through that,28000:20:32.940 --> 00:20:37.609it would be good to help themto to be able to state what is28100:20:38.329 --> 00:20:41.890their hope, yeah, of whatthey are going to achieve with this woman28200:20:42.049 --> 00:20:45.890at this point. Right. Andso it's, you know, it's a28300:20:45.250 --> 00:20:53.039Nathan's hope was ultimately restoration, yeah, of David Back to God. But28400:20:53.400 --> 00:20:57.519he then he did go on inthat story about he did tell him there28500:20:57.559 --> 00:21:02.000are consequences. You will not die. Yeah, you will not die,28600:21:02.279 --> 00:21:04.589but the baby will. Yeah,he was very honest about that. And28700:21:06.390 --> 00:21:11.069Yeah, I think what he's sayingthere is that, basically he's helping David28800:21:11.109 --> 00:21:15.349to understand. I think this ispart of what broke David Down, right,28900:21:15.829 --> 00:21:21.220is your sin has an effect onother people. Do you understand that29000:21:21.380 --> 00:21:26.059your sin just affected an innocent person? Now we can get into the theological29100:21:26.740 --> 00:21:32.539discussion about I mean God not intokilling babies. So how does that work?29200:21:32.740 --> 00:21:36.769The God caus this baby to die? Or was there some sickness and29300:21:37.410 --> 00:21:40.049the devil do it and God allowlisten, I don't want to get into29400:21:40.049 --> 00:21:42.650all of that less maybe for anotherpodcast, yeah, or for another whole29500:21:44.289 --> 00:21:48.799somebody else to do that podcast andepisode about that. But the fact is29600:21:49.799 --> 00:21:53.480David was, in some measure atleast, a soft hearted guy and David29700:21:53.759 --> 00:21:56.920was a guy after justice. Imean, look at the story of David29800:21:56.960 --> 00:22:00.240and Goliath. He comes out onthe battlefield there and here's this this goliath29900:22:00.400 --> 00:22:04.430mocking the children of God and mockingGod himself, and David's like, because30000:22:04.470 --> 00:22:08.750he's a man that wants justice,who's doing something about this uncircumcised Philistine?30100:22:08.829 --> 00:22:11.990Right, this, this is unjust. He speaking against the Living God.30200:22:12.309 --> 00:22:17.259Is there not a cause? Right? And so Nathan and God Rue.30300:22:17.259 --> 00:22:22.140Nathan plays on that, your senseof justice, and you can play on30400:22:22.220 --> 00:22:25.180that with these mothers and help themto understand that what they've done is an30500:22:25.220 --> 00:22:29.180unjust thing. They just took thelife of another human being. Yeah,30600:22:29.539 --> 00:22:32.410they're guilty before God for it.Well, as you were saying that,30700:22:32.569 --> 00:22:36.529and actually it didn't even occur tome, which is kind of crazy till30800:22:36.529 --> 00:22:41.410you said that. But this isexactly a perfect story, because the result30900:22:41.690 --> 00:22:48.720of the sin of David and well, best she but, but best she31000:22:48.839 --> 00:22:52.839but was possibly forced into it,but of David, was a baby dies.31100:22:53.039 --> 00:22:57.829Yeah, that was the consequence,and that's exactly what happened in an31200:22:57.869 --> 00:23:03.549abortion. The sins of the motherand the father's usually has led to the31300:23:03.710 --> 00:23:08.470death of an innocent human being.Yeah, so it might be a really,31400:23:08.789 --> 00:23:15.140really good story to share with them. Yeah, absolutely, but now31500:23:15.259 --> 00:23:18.099we'll say this that I don't Idon't know that you talked about this in31600:23:18.220 --> 00:23:22.019this article necessarily, but I dowant to talk just for a second to31700:23:22.140 --> 00:23:27.289the counselor and to them emotionally.Yeah, because what can happen in those31800:23:27.329 --> 00:23:32.170situations, and I'm sure that's whathappened with our missionary that you're talking about.31900:23:32.170 --> 00:23:33.529I know it's happened to you.To happen to me, it's happen32000:23:33.609 --> 00:23:37.890everyone who's been involved in these kindof situations where you you a mom has32100:23:37.890 --> 00:23:41.559chosen life, praise God, thingsare moving forward and she turns back on32200:23:41.680 --> 00:23:45.759it. You Begin to beat yourselfup and the devil begins to play tricks32300:23:45.799 --> 00:23:48.680in your mind. All you shouldhave did this, you shouldn't have did32400:23:48.759 --> 00:23:52.480that, you should have said this, you should have said that you're not32500:23:52.640 --> 00:23:56.430good enough to be out there,because if you were, they wouldn't have32600:23:56.630 --> 00:24:00.069went back on their decision for lifeor you whatever. You didn't use the32700:24:00.069 --> 00:24:04.269right scripture. You did what?Who knows? There's lies come across your32800:24:04.589 --> 00:24:08.390your mind and in your heart,and the whole idea and the whole intention,32900:24:08.430 --> 00:24:12.019I believe, from the devil isto discourage you and to get you33000:24:12.140 --> 00:24:15.339off of mission right, right.So I just want to encourage you,33100:24:15.420 --> 00:24:18.900guys who listen. If you're outthere, you're probably going to deal with33200:24:18.980 --> 00:24:22.619this at some point and if you'vealready dealt with this, would encourage you.33300:24:22.339 --> 00:24:27.890You can never say everything just right, you can never do everything just33400:24:29.130 --> 00:24:32.930right. We live in a fallenworld where fallen human beings. So to33500:24:33.049 --> 00:24:36.130try to put a weight on yourselfthat God doesn't put, because God doesn't33600:24:36.130 --> 00:24:38.279put the weight on you, theburden on you to say everything exactly right33700:24:38.279 --> 00:24:41.279all the time. What does Godput on us? He puts on us33800:24:41.680 --> 00:24:45.240so seeds and water seats. That'sright. Plant seeds, that's that's the33900:24:45.359 --> 00:24:49.799best you can do. You literallycannot plant a seed and force that seed34000:24:49.960 --> 00:24:52.190to come out of the ground right. That's, I believe, why the34100:24:52.230 --> 00:24:56.950analogies there in scripture that we're plantingseats, because there's nothing you can do34200:24:56.109 --> 00:25:00.390to make that seed grow. Yep, except for putting water on it.34300:25:00.470 --> 00:25:03.309But you even if you put wateron it's no promise it's going to grow.34400:25:03.349 --> 00:25:06.869Right, it's up to that seedand it's up to the Lord.34500:25:06.950 --> 00:25:10.380So we have to leave these situationsin the hands of the Lord. We34600:25:10.500 --> 00:25:12.740have to say, okay, I'vedone my due diligence, I've done the34700:25:12.900 --> 00:25:18.019best I can. Could you havesaid things better? Sure, you always34800:25:18.140 --> 00:25:22.009can. In our you know,you've been doing this or eight years.34900:25:22.009 --> 00:25:26.769I've been doing this for fifteen years. I still from time to time go35000:25:26.970 --> 00:25:30.569back and even conversations where a momhas chosen life, I'll go back and35100:25:30.650 --> 00:25:32.650think, man, why did Isay that? I should have said this,35200:25:32.849 --> 00:25:34.960and and try to beat myself upon what I did and what I35300:25:36.000 --> 00:25:40.200didn't do. Don't do that,guys. Don't beat yourself up. Just35400:25:40.519 --> 00:25:44.559trust the Lord ultimately, again yourplanning seeds, trust the Lord that he'll35500:25:44.559 --> 00:25:48.240give the increase and that the wordsthat you said, even though she didn't35600:25:48.240 --> 00:25:52.829choose life on that particular day.Maybe she turned back on her decision for35700:25:52.950 --> 00:25:56.509life on that particular day, butdown the road those seeds that you've sewn35800:25:56.950 --> 00:26:00.390and the truth that you've spoken,God's word, doesn't return void, it's35900:26:00.470 --> 00:26:04.380gonna have some kind of effect.It will and and that goes for not36000:26:04.619 --> 00:26:08.259only the initial discussions that you hadwhere she chose life, that you're planning36100:26:08.380 --> 00:26:11.660seat, but the same is truewith the discussions you're going to have her36200:26:11.900 --> 00:26:17.259after she has aborted and you're tryingto figure out what to say again.36300:26:17.700 --> 00:26:21.650It's going to be difficult and youmay not say everything perfectly, but just36400:26:21.849 --> 00:26:26.450remember you are planting seats. AndI think I may have mentioned this recently36500:26:26.569 --> 00:26:30.170in one of our podcast recently,and it did just happen just to I36600:26:30.289 --> 00:26:34.519think it was last week, maybethe week before, where a mom had36700:26:34.839 --> 00:26:41.319abhorted. She every okay, I'mnot sure I've talked about this, but36800:26:41.400 --> 00:26:45.680one of our counselor's, Mary Beth, had poured in to this mom and36900:26:45.279 --> 00:26:51.950the mom had even gone to thepregnancy resource center that works with us.37000:26:52.029 --> 00:26:55.789She had seen her baby, sheshe had gotten all the resources. She37100:26:55.950 --> 00:27:02.460was excited. She had chosen lifeand then turned around and aborted. And37200:27:02.859 --> 00:27:07.380Mary Beth beat herself up. Yeah, the the sonographer at help, Monroe37300:27:07.579 --> 00:27:10.019beat herself up. They all,they all fell. Oh, what could37400:27:10.059 --> 00:27:11.059we have done when we do wrong? Those, you know, all that37500:27:11.220 --> 00:27:18.849stuff, devastated. Yeah, andthat mom showed up again just a week37600:27:18.890 --> 00:27:23.609ago, two weeks ago, andlooking for us because she remembered. She's37700:27:23.650 --> 00:27:27.769pregnant again, in an unplanned pregnancy. Again, again abortion, vulnerable.37800:27:27.809 --> 00:27:33.160Yeah, but this time she saidI'm going to let you help me and37900:27:33.599 --> 00:27:41.200she expected anger. Yeah, andand the same sonographer, Kelly, was38000:27:41.279 --> 00:27:44.430the one that happened to be there. Yeah, the day that she returned38100:27:44.470 --> 00:27:52.029and Kelly just poured love into her, showed her her baby. I was38200:27:52.150 --> 00:27:56.589the counselor, and she said,thank you so much for forgiving me a38300:27:56.670 --> 00:28:03.700second chance. So she had beenconvicted from even though she had gone back38400:28:03.779 --> 00:28:10.700and aborted, the relationship that wasestablished in the seats that were planted brought38500:28:10.859 --> 00:28:15.890her back to us with the nextpregnancy. Yeah, and and I guess38600:28:17.049 --> 00:28:21.250that's a testimony to do exactly exactlywhat I'm talking about, exactly. Yeah,38700:28:21.289 --> 00:28:26.519but even given that scenario. Shereceived love. Right, but when38800:28:26.599 --> 00:28:30.599we say that, most people arethinking she received love, that means we38900:28:30.720 --> 00:28:33.039were just nice to her. Okay, now I want to tell you what39000:28:33.240 --> 00:28:36.839she received. So, because thatis Acun't know what your that's what modern39100:28:36.880 --> 00:28:40.319Christians being. So they're when whenthey say we need to speak the truth39200:28:40.400 --> 00:28:42.869and love. Right. What?What? Most Modern Christians just be nice.39300:28:42.910 --> 00:28:47.589Let's just be nicey right, andlisten Jesus in a lot of ways.39400:28:47.869 --> 00:28:49.509I'm sharing this before we started thepod. Guess, yeah, Jesus39500:28:49.630 --> 00:28:53.750was not nice. But we askourselves, did Jesus love the Pharisees?39600:28:53.789 --> 00:28:59.019He loved them with a with adeep love. He wept over Jerusalem,39700:28:59.059 --> 00:29:03.420in their obstinates and and he lovedthem and he spoke the truth to them.39800:29:03.700 --> 00:29:06.140Now, yeah, I'm not sayingthese women are Pharisees, but what39900:29:06.220 --> 00:29:08.660I am saying is that to showlove is not always to be nice,40000:29:08.740 --> 00:29:14.690nicey Nice, but it is toshow the kindness of the Lord which leads40100:29:14.690 --> 00:29:18.809us to repentance and to bring thetruth to bear, like right, reality.40200:29:19.009 --> 00:29:22.650What they've done? So right.So, so, when she when40300:29:22.769 --> 00:29:27.119she came on and I didn't hearabout the prior abortion till near the end40400:29:27.799 --> 00:29:32.920of the session. So clearly shewas not proud of it, not not40500:29:33.160 --> 00:29:37.519happy about it, knew knew itwas sin and when she revealed that,40600:29:37.799 --> 00:29:41.750then I'm up for sharing the Gospel. It's kind of they've done the medical40700:29:41.789 --> 00:29:45.670stuff, I've shared the resources.Made sure she knew that no matter where40800:29:45.670 --> 00:29:48.109she stood with God, it didn'taffect whether we would help her. But40900:29:48.670 --> 00:29:56.059shared the Gospel and and she hadmade a common along the lines of at41000:29:56.140 --> 00:29:59.259that time I had to do whatI did. Yeah, with the abortion.41100:30:00.059 --> 00:30:07.410So her heart had not yet beenchanged really regarding the sin of what41200:30:07.569 --> 00:30:10.890she had done. And that wasthe first thing that I talked about then41300:30:10.930 --> 00:30:15.130before sharing the Gospel, was thehumanity of that baby, all the things41400:30:15.210 --> 00:30:19.450the baby would never know and somepretty hard truths. I spoke it kindly,41500:30:21.210 --> 00:30:26.039with the tone of voice that wasn'tangry, but but I wanted her41600:30:26.160 --> 00:30:30.400to I wanted her to come tosay it was wrong. You're right,41700:30:30.599 --> 00:30:34.599it was sin against against that babyand against God. And she did and41800:30:34.829 --> 00:30:37.950she ultimately, I can't remember.There was a whole slew of women,41900:30:38.029 --> 00:30:45.029fortunately during that time period that cameto the Lord and I can't remember if42000:30:45.029 --> 00:30:49.339she was one of them. Ithink she was, but she she clearly42100:30:49.420 --> 00:30:56.460left with a greater understanding of thesin of abortion. Right, and when42200:30:56.539 --> 00:31:00.180I when I said, no matterwhat you face in the future, if42300:31:00.299 --> 00:31:04.730you were to have an unplaying pregnancy, first of all you shouldn't because you're42400:31:04.730 --> 00:31:07.769not going to have sex outside ofmerit anymore. Right. But but if42500:31:07.930 --> 00:31:15.089you were, is is abortion andever a valid option? And she said42600:31:15.130 --> 00:31:18.160now, yeah, no, andshe she was very sorrowful. Yeah,42700:31:18.519 --> 00:31:25.519at that point, when we talkabout healing and when we talk about restoration42800:31:25.599 --> 00:31:32.519and we we talked about salvation,we haven't understand that ultimately, healing,42900:31:32.720 --> 00:31:33.869and we're going to talk about thatin just a second, the steps to43000:31:33.990 --> 00:31:40.710healing. Yeah, healing doesn't happento people that don't realize that they're not43100:31:40.869 --> 00:31:44.309healed. Right, they don't.They need healing. It's like sack.43200:31:44.430 --> 00:31:47.619You Know Ray Comfort, who weuse his model of sharing the Gospel,43300:31:47.619 --> 00:31:48.980which is, I believe, theBiblical model of in the Gospel, which43400:31:49.019 --> 00:31:53.900is Jesus, is way of sharingthe gospel, sharing the reality of why43500:31:53.980 --> 00:31:59.299he came. Yeah, and you, Ray Comfort talks about if you go43600:31:59.339 --> 00:32:02.890into the doctor's office and you knowthe doctor doesn't talk about you know you've43700:32:02.930 --> 00:32:07.890got blue spots on your face andyou've got horns grown out of your head,43800:32:07.170 --> 00:32:10.650and the doctor talks about everything elsebut those symptoms that you have outwardly43900:32:10.890 --> 00:32:16.079and doesn't talk about the actual problem, then he's not doing you any good.44000:32:16.240 --> 00:32:21.400Right. The doctor has to talkabout the symptoms of sickness. He44100:32:21.480 --> 00:32:25.400has to talk about also the consequencesof not dealing with this sickness. So44200:32:25.519 --> 00:32:29.519if you have this sickness with bluespots on your face and horns grind your44300:32:29.559 --> 00:32:30.990head, that's not the example thatray comfort gives, but it's something that44400:32:31.309 --> 00:32:37.109to that effect. Yeah, ifyou show if you continue in this with44500:32:37.309 --> 00:32:40.950this disease and don't take this cure, people likely to take the cure.44600:32:40.990 --> 00:32:45.380And so that's why we talk aboutsharing the Gospel, but before that,44700:32:45.059 --> 00:32:51.099sharing the law. Right, that'sreally sharing the truth that you're sick and44800:32:51.299 --> 00:32:53.420you need a healer. Yeah,and that healer is Jesus. You're sick44900:32:53.500 --> 00:32:57.140and you need a physician. Hisname is Jesus, and they're not going45000:32:57.220 --> 00:33:00.289to get the idea why they needthat. In in your little doctor analogy,45100:33:00.369 --> 00:33:02.329it'd be like the doctor going upto him and not talking about the45200:33:02.450 --> 00:33:06.609disease at all and just saying,let me cut open your stomach to pause,45300:33:06.730 --> 00:33:08.970yeah, to play your intestines andremove a portion of them. You're45400:33:09.049 --> 00:33:13.559like, what know, because youhave no idea that there is something on45500:33:13.680 --> 00:33:15.960your intestine that is going to killyou, that cancer, whatever, and45600:33:16.240 --> 00:33:22.279so you can't bring the remedy beforethey know there's an illness. Yeah,45700:33:22.319 --> 00:33:27.269there's some sickness, there's and thatsickness is sin. Yeah, and especially45800:33:27.309 --> 00:33:30.029when we're dealing with a woman that'shad an abortion. Right, if we45900:33:30.190 --> 00:33:36.829talk about everything else we don't talkabout abortion, then we're not talking about46000:33:36.869 --> 00:33:39.069the thing that, ultimately, beforeGod, brings our guilt. Right.46100:33:39.190 --> 00:33:43.140That's why she's come to us andthat's why we've connected with her in light46200:33:43.259 --> 00:33:46.140of her pregnancy, because it's whatwe're out there doing. We're talking about46300:33:46.579 --> 00:33:50.180reaching out to women who are bringinggoing into the passion center. Right.46400:33:51.059 --> 00:33:53.299So, if we talk about everythingelse but that abortion, then we're like46500:33:53.420 --> 00:33:58.410a doctor that's talking about everything elsebut that cancer that he can see very46600:33:58.490 --> 00:34:01.130plainly is going to destroy that person'slife. Yeah, and the same is46700:34:01.210 --> 00:34:07.250true of sexual impurity. Is isyou can't just dance around that issue when46800:34:07.289 --> 00:34:09.760you're dealing with a women coming foran abortion because, as most of them46900:34:09.800 --> 00:34:16.159are in some sort of sexual sin. Yeah, and if you don't address47000:34:16.360 --> 00:34:22.079that, then they'll just be backagain. That is a major part of47100:34:22.320 --> 00:34:27.070why people are showing up for abortions. They and so that it sets outside47200:34:27.070 --> 00:34:30.590of marriage wasn't a thing, thenabortion would not be a thing. Yeah,47300:34:30.710 --> 00:34:34.750I mean pretty much, if youwe go statistics, the overwhelming majority47400:34:34.789 --> 00:34:38.179of people that come to abortion centersor committing sexual sin, right. Yeah,47500:34:38.300 --> 00:34:43.099yeah, so let's talk about thesesteps to healing. Yeah, yeah,47600:34:43.619 --> 00:34:46.500the first step, like we talkedabout, is the conviction of sin.47700:34:46.579 --> 00:34:50.659Yeah, it's matter of fact.That's what the Bible says the Holy47800:34:50.780 --> 00:34:54.170Spirit, that's what his job is. Jesus says that the spirit comes to47900:34:54.250 --> 00:35:00.130convict the World Concerning Sin, righteousnessand judgment. Was the Holy Spirit doing?48000:35:00.010 --> 00:35:04.170For the Christian he's bringing comfort,but for the center, for the48100:35:04.250 --> 00:35:08.039world, he's bringing the conviction ofsin to conduct the World Concerning Sin and48200:35:08.119 --> 00:35:15.039righteousness and judgment. So just thisidea that we need to to dance around48300:35:15.039 --> 00:35:16.920the issue of abortion, to weneed to be nice and not talk about48400:35:16.920 --> 00:35:21.239it is a false notion. Weneed to be plain, we need to48500:35:21.280 --> 00:35:23.190be kind. That is a fruitof the spirit. By the way,48600:35:23.550 --> 00:35:27.190niceness is not a fruit of thespirit. It's kind of like a worldly48700:35:27.269 --> 00:35:34.030perversion of of kindness, I think. And kindness sometimes leads to us being48800:35:34.070 --> 00:35:39.420a little forthright and a little outwardlymight appears being kind of mean or snarky48900:35:39.420 --> 00:35:44.139or whatever. It's not our motivation. Motivation is kindness. We want to49000:35:44.139 --> 00:35:47.940be kind to them by telling themyou got cancer right and in this situation,49100:35:49.739 --> 00:35:52.969your sin, the cancer is abortion. When you do with that,49200:35:52.610 --> 00:35:57.690and we need to really plainly layit out, why is abortion sin?49300:35:58.250 --> 00:36:01.530It's not sin because it's a it'sa bad medical decision, you know.49400:36:01.969 --> 00:36:06.760It's not sin just because the doctorsthat do it or bad people. That's49500:36:06.880 --> 00:36:09.280true, but it's not just sinbecause of that. It's sin because that49600:36:09.440 --> 00:36:14.719baby is made in God's image,loved and known by him, and that49700:36:14.880 --> 00:36:21.110baby has been mercially, mercilessly killedby what you did, by your involvement49800:36:21.150 --> 00:36:24.190in the abortion of your son oryour daughter, and I think that's important49900:36:24.230 --> 00:36:27.909for them to know, very important, and I love how you stated it.50000:36:28.110 --> 00:36:31.150I hear all the time out there. Please stop. You're making her50100:36:31.190 --> 00:36:37.340feel bad, right, and myresponse is that's good, because someone's killing50200:36:37.380 --> 00:36:42.900another person, they should feel bad, should feel back. That's all always50300:36:42.980 --> 00:36:46.809my response. She should feel bad. What she's doing is evil, wrong,50400:36:46.929 --> 00:36:52.250sinful, against God, against thatchild, even against yourself, because50500:36:52.250 --> 00:36:55.250that's not what a woman is designedto do and it will destroy a part50600:36:55.250 --> 00:36:59.650of her to do that. Soconviction of sin. Yeah, that's number50700:36:59.650 --> 00:37:01.320one. Right. Yeah, andhow do we bring the conviction of sin?50800:37:01.480 --> 00:37:06.280Just, very simply, we likewe shared Psalm fifty one. That's50900:37:06.320 --> 00:37:09.679a good way to start. Shuresa great start, scripture laying out the51000:37:09.920 --> 00:37:15.599the humanity, the biblical case ofthe humanity of that baby. Likely,51100:37:15.429 --> 00:37:20.590if she's already broken in some sense, there's no sense in adding insult to51200:37:20.630 --> 00:37:22.630injury. So if she's already weepand she's already ball and she's already acknowledged51300:37:22.750 --> 00:37:27.869her sin, likely the holy spiritsalready done that and all you've got to51400:37:27.909 --> 00:37:30.500do is just, you know,a few maybe statements that can kind of51500:37:30.539 --> 00:37:35.139reiterate the holy spirits conviction. Ifhe's done that work again, it's his51600:37:35.219 --> 00:37:37.820job to do that, then wedon't need to add more to that.51700:37:37.340 --> 00:37:40.699But we do need to be surethat there's a true conviction of sin and51800:37:42.260 --> 00:37:45.969not just like a worldly sorrow likewe talked about. And just you know,51900:37:45.690 --> 00:37:50.210I'm sorry I disappointed you, becausethat can happen sometimes, where they're52000:37:50.250 --> 00:37:52.650sad because not because they offended God, but because they disappointed you, and52100:37:52.690 --> 00:37:55.250you were really nice to them.You're really kind to them. It was52200:37:55.369 --> 00:37:59.079one here. That A lot.Yeah, that's what their true sorrow is.52300:37:59.360 --> 00:38:01.760There was a in conviction of sin. There was a man today who52400:38:01.840 --> 00:38:07.320stopped who had an abortion decade agoand he was asking me, you know,52500:38:07.400 --> 00:38:10.280what was going on here, andhe he said that he had,52600:38:10.559 --> 00:38:15.789you know, been a part ofan abortion many years ago and that ultimately52700:38:15.469 --> 00:38:21.429they broke up and then she committedsuicide. Oh well, and and he52800:38:21.510 --> 00:38:27.219said not a day goes by thatI don't think of it, but I'm52900:38:27.260 --> 00:38:30.460grateful that I never really pushed herto the abortion. We both agreed to53000:38:30.539 --> 00:38:37.340it. Yeah, and I consoleyou'd say, you know, I I53100:38:37.579 --> 00:38:42.050I told him my story and Isaid I really you've carried this burden for53200:38:42.170 --> 00:38:49.210decades. You will never release thisburden until you recognize that abortion, the53300:38:49.369 --> 00:38:52.849abortion, was wrong, it wasit was sin. It was sin against53400:38:52.889 --> 00:38:58.760a holy God. But but Goddoes long to heal you. But that's53500:38:58.800 --> 00:39:00.880the first step in healing. Ijust came right out and said that is53600:39:01.000 --> 00:39:05.920the first step in healing you.You have to understand what you did was53700:39:06.039 --> 00:39:08.679wrong. And he was very gracious. He actually did listen to the whole53800:39:08.719 --> 00:39:10.909thing. He didn't come to theLord or anything. I shared the whole53900:39:10.909 --> 00:39:16.750Gospel, but but he did thankme and he took attract a little book54000:39:16.750 --> 00:39:22.710of John which he said he wouldread. But that so yet. Just54100:39:22.909 --> 00:39:28.260being I think conviction of sin scriptureis great, but sometimes just coming right54200:39:28.340 --> 00:39:32.500out and saying it is is important. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, and54300:39:32.659 --> 00:39:37.340so I want to kind of knockthrough these as quick as we can because54400:39:37.380 --> 00:39:40.250we're sort of running out of timerecording this. But when we get to54500:39:40.329 --> 00:39:45.090this last part of the podcast.Okay, so the steps of healing,54600:39:45.170 --> 00:39:49.849of conviction of sin, sorrow forsin and be sorry, not just that54700:39:49.889 --> 00:39:52.280they were caught in their sin butthey've sent against God. Yeah, repentance.54800:39:52.480 --> 00:39:57.239Now, repentance is not just sorrow. Repentance is actually turning away from54900:39:57.239 --> 00:40:00.400sin. Yeah, turning away happensin the heart, also happens with our55000:40:00.480 --> 00:40:05.639hands, our feet. All thatright. Yeah, calling out to God55100:40:05.800 --> 00:40:07.150for forgiveness and healing. Now,I want you to touch on that real55200:40:07.190 --> 00:40:12.190quick because we when we share theGospel, whether it's a mom who's chosen55300:40:12.230 --> 00:40:15.710life for her baby or even amom who's had an abortion, we do55400:40:15.989 --> 00:40:22.139aim for a some might call itlike an invitation sinners prayer. We're not55500:40:22.260 --> 00:40:24.940trying to get them to pray afterme, but talk a little bit about55600:40:24.980 --> 00:40:30.619that. Well, in terms ofout I think when when David calls out55700:40:30.699 --> 00:40:34.699insign fifty one, he's calling outto God. He has repented and he's55800:40:34.739 --> 00:40:38.210saying God, cleanse me, makeme clean again, restore me to a55900:40:38.210 --> 00:40:45.170right relationship with you. And andso calling out to God for forgiveness and56000:40:45.409 --> 00:40:52.079healing means that you have recognize whatyou've done, you have turned from what56100:40:52.199 --> 00:40:58.079you've done and you truly want abestored relationship with God. You recognize that56200:40:58.159 --> 00:41:01.119it has been disrupted by your sin. And this is the point we make56300:41:01.159 --> 00:41:05.550such a big deal about. Well, you don't mention forgiveness too soon.56400:41:05.630 --> 00:41:10.070Yeah, but there is a pointat which forgiveness is to know that they56500:41:10.190 --> 00:41:16.550can be forgiven, but forgiven doescome with a price. I mean forgiveness56600:41:16.750 --> 00:41:24.059is is, is not unconditional.Yeah, forgiveness must be preceded by repentance.56700:41:24.260 --> 00:41:29.699And you know the I've I've reallythought a lot about a forgiveness and56800:41:30.219 --> 00:41:36.050one of the verses that is quotedall the time to Christians. We years56900:41:36.489 --> 00:41:39.769forgiving people. We need to bea forgiving people, and they say forgive.57000:41:40.130 --> 00:41:45.969Well, Jesus has forgive as theLord forgave you, as God forgave57100:41:45.010 --> 00:41:51.960you. But God's forgiveness, Hisforgiveness, is offered to all through the57200:41:52.039 --> 00:41:55.519cross. I mean it's open toall, but it's never, never,57300:41:55.599 --> 00:42:01.309we're never reconciled to God until thereis repentance. Yeah, and then the57400:42:01.989 --> 00:42:09.230forgiveness is is extended. Yeah,absolutely. So is that? Am I57500:42:09.309 --> 00:42:12.949getting where you wanted me to gowith that? Or is there to yeah,57600:42:12.989 --> 00:42:16.739well, just in also in theseconversations, getting them to call in57700:42:16.780 --> 00:42:20.980the name of the Lord and Ithink getting them if you're in a one57800:42:21.099 --> 00:42:25.300on one conversation. Well, they'veacknowledge their sin. Yeah, you're repentant.57900:42:25.619 --> 00:42:30.570Right, they're acknowledging their sin,their sorrow for there, their sorrow58000:42:30.650 --> 00:42:35.010for it, and then they're voicingand I never want to do this again.58100:42:35.090 --> 00:42:38.449That's that's a part of repentance.Now repentance is borne out not just58200:42:38.650 --> 00:42:42.769in the moment but also in howwe live. Right, the life of58300:42:42.849 --> 00:42:46.679repentance. You're moving over into thenext point about submitting one's life fully to58400:42:46.760 --> 00:42:52.679Jesus. Right, if, if, if you truly want to know the58500:42:52.960 --> 00:43:00.510freedom of forgiveness, that requires submittingyour life to the Lord. Yeah,58600:43:00.630 --> 00:43:06.789if you're not calling upon Jesus asLord, you will never know what it58700:43:06.909 --> 00:43:10.429means to be forgiven, to havethat burden of your guilt lifted. But58800:43:10.550 --> 00:43:15.900as soon as you do, yoursins, which were scarlet, are made58900:43:15.980 --> 00:43:20.260white as snow. His blood washesaway. Yeah, your sin and that59000:43:20.539 --> 00:43:25.019bird and that that overwhelming bird,and that guilt, that self condemnation and59100:43:25.139 --> 00:43:30.610self hatred, that's removed. Theconsequences are not not all like in David's59200:43:30.690 --> 00:43:34.929case, he was forgiven. Nathantells him God will forgive you, you59300:43:35.130 --> 00:43:37.690are it's got's not going to kill. You are forgiven, but the baby's59400:43:37.730 --> 00:43:44.280going to die. There is stilla consequence and and I think that's important59500:43:44.320 --> 00:43:49.920for people who are experiencing forgiveness toremember that that does not mean that God59600:43:50.000 --> 00:43:54.639removes the result of your sin rightin. Sometimes he does, but quite59700:43:54.679 --> 00:44:00.230frankly, most of the time Idon't think he does. Most of the59800:44:00.349 --> 00:44:02.349time you do live with the that'snot really the point, right. The59900:44:02.389 --> 00:44:07.309point is that I've offended God,right, I'm repenting to him and whatever60000:44:07.469 --> 00:44:10.739consequences, maybe they that's what theyare. Yeah, that, to me60100:44:10.860 --> 00:44:15.659shows a truly repentant heart. Yeah, but kind of what I was getting60200:44:15.699 --> 00:44:20.780at was getting them to right therein front of you, if there's this60300:44:21.059 --> 00:44:23.969genuine repentance, getting them to callthe name of the Lord Right there,60400:44:24.050 --> 00:44:25.969rather than to say and do itwhen you get home. I think that60500:44:27.530 --> 00:44:31.690personal accountability. What your standing rightthere now, do shy away from repeat60600:44:31.730 --> 00:44:35.889after me. All right, saythis after me. I shout away from60700:44:35.929 --> 00:44:37.369that because anyways, well, youknow, if that's genuine, yeah,60800:44:37.409 --> 00:44:42.159if you're repeating after somebody calling thename of the Lord. Yeah, you60900:44:42.239 --> 00:44:45.840know, like you've shared before.I'll tell him it can be as sloppy61000:44:45.880 --> 00:44:49.360as you as you wanted to be. Ain't got to be in perfect King61100:44:49.400 --> 00:44:53.030James English or anything like that.Just pray to the Lord, Confess your61200:44:53.070 --> 00:44:58.230sin to him and ask him tosave you. Yep, and in your61300:44:58.230 --> 00:45:00.949own words, and oftentimes I haveoften had them say, oh, I61400:45:00.989 --> 00:45:02.829can't do that, I'll just canI just say it in my head?61500:45:02.829 --> 00:45:06.590And I say, well, readthis first. WHAT IS ROMANCE? Ten61600:45:06.590 --> 00:45:09.739Nine, say and and it saysproclaim with your mouth. Yeah. So61700:45:10.139 --> 00:45:15.900I think the reason for that Godnever makes mistakes. I think that's purposeful.61800:45:15.940 --> 00:45:17.940The reason is if you say itout loud, in front of witnesses,61900:45:19.099 --> 00:45:21.610even, but even if you're alonein a room, but you're saying62000:45:21.650 --> 00:45:25.650it out loud to God, thereis a that is a commitment. Yeah,62100:45:25.690 --> 00:45:30.969that's and your Oh, your,you are not being worried about your62200:45:30.050 --> 00:45:36.639image or selfconsciousness. You're speaking toGod. Yeah, and yeah, I62300:45:36.679 --> 00:45:38.320think that's powerful. Yeah, andI think that kind of leads to the62400:45:38.440 --> 00:45:43.000next thing here. This is stepsto healing, submitting to the authority of62500:45:43.039 --> 00:45:46.400a local church. I think withinthat includes any local church I'm going to62600:45:46.440 --> 00:45:51.030send somebody to, is going toinclude them getting baptized, right. Yeah,62700:45:51.190 --> 00:45:54.429and that baptism. I don't believein Baptismal regeneration, that getting baptized62800:45:54.469 --> 00:45:58.550as what saves you. It's repentanceand faith in Jesus, calling on the62900:45:58.550 --> 00:46:01.550name of the Lord that saves people. Yeah, but baptism is a public63000:46:01.710 --> 00:46:07.980declaration, like you talked about.You're letting everybody know now I'm submitted to63100:46:08.059 --> 00:46:10.820Jesus. Yeah, and we've seenthis. I've actually had a story,63200:46:10.860 --> 00:46:14.619I think we shared on the podcastbefore. That happened not too long ago63300:46:14.699 --> 00:46:17.300down in southern California, right overin southern California. That was awesome.63400:46:17.340 --> 00:46:21.570Well, that young lady was choselife for a baby, surrender her life63500:46:21.570 --> 00:46:24.489to Jesus. Now, she wasnot repenting of an abortion, but she63600:46:24.610 --> 00:46:28.610was baptized right, and so that'sthat's an awesome story. But even these63700:46:28.690 --> 00:46:32.159women who do end up giving theirselvesover to the lies of the enemy and63800:46:32.320 --> 00:46:37.519have an abortion, when they repentput their lives in Jesus hands, get63900:46:37.599 --> 00:46:43.159baptized. This this public declaration thatI'm that's my old life has been buried64000:46:43.239 --> 00:46:46.269with Christ right my new life.I'm raised out of the waters of baptism64100:46:46.389 --> 00:46:50.909to new life, symbolic of theirnew life with him, and I think64200:46:50.909 --> 00:46:54.110that's included in the authority of thelocal church. Being in a local church64300:46:54.789 --> 00:47:01.300helps keep that decision for Jesus solidifiedand helps them stay encouraged and stake accountable.64400:47:01.579 --> 00:47:07.340Right and be really surrounded by otherbelievers who are you know, help64500:47:07.460 --> 00:47:09.860them through their struggles and all that. Oh, yeah, yeah, it's64600:47:09.980 --> 00:47:14.780critical. So that in and alsoit's in the local church where you're going64700:47:14.780 --> 00:47:16.690to be discipled. Yeah, God, God, will meet you where you64800:47:16.730 --> 00:47:19.929are. Yeah, but he doesn'twant us to stay where we are.64900:47:19.969 --> 00:47:22.130I know you've heard that. Alot of people say that and and that's65000:47:22.170 --> 00:47:27.130very true. So you're you know, that's where, that's what God instituted65100:47:27.210 --> 00:47:30.599as the way in which we willbe discipled and grows in a family of65200:47:30.679 --> 00:47:34.639believers in the local church. Yeah. So, yeah, that's really important.65300:47:34.639 --> 00:47:38.159And then the final step, Ithink, in in true healing,65400:47:38.639 --> 00:47:45.269is to now use what has happenedto you, the the sin and how65500:47:45.389 --> 00:47:49.829it was redeemed, and use itto help others. Yeah, absolutely,65600:47:50.070 --> 00:47:52.670and that's why there's so many ofour concerts who are posted to board if65700:47:52.670 --> 00:47:55.550they really know that that is areally important part of we don't do it65800:47:55.670 --> 00:48:00.780for healing, but that's kind ofthe bonus. You have absolutely of what65900:48:00.900 --> 00:48:04.219happens if you're out there helping othersthrough. And I told that that man66000:48:04.500 --> 00:48:07.619that stopped today. I said,this is why we're out here because we66100:48:07.739 --> 00:48:09.699know. We know what we've done, we know it's wrong, we know66200:48:09.860 --> 00:48:15.250the horrible consequences and part of thathealing process is to go and try to66300:48:15.369 --> 00:48:17.969help others not to do yeah,we did well. It's just, practically66400:48:19.010 --> 00:48:22.690speaking, it's loving your neighbor,right, it's loving your neighbor as yourself66500:48:22.730 --> 00:48:27.199if you've been down a destructive path. Yeah, and you like, for66600:48:27.320 --> 00:48:30.519example, for myself, being involvedin drugs, give myself to that.66700:48:30.039 --> 00:48:32.639If I see someone getting involved inthat, I'm going to warn them of66800:48:32.760 --> 00:48:37.880the consequences and say God, deliverme from that and I'll promise you he66900:48:37.960 --> 00:48:40.360don't want you to be involved inthat stuff. Right. So it's just67000:48:40.869 --> 00:48:45.389plain just loving our neighbor as ourselves, speaking the truth to people who ultimately67100:48:45.949 --> 00:48:51.510going to be involved in a sinfuland destructive things. Yeah. Yeah,67200:48:51.590 --> 00:48:55.820and also, this is one ofthe reasons why in our applications and things,67300:48:55.900 --> 00:48:59.380when we have people that come onboard and get our training, our67400:48:59.420 --> 00:49:01.820sidewalk training, we asked the questionof about do they have abortion in their67500:49:01.860 --> 00:49:06.699past? We ask that question,not because we want to probe deeply into67600:49:06.780 --> 00:49:09.650their past or anything like that,but we ask that question. It's kind67700:49:09.650 --> 00:49:13.050of yes or no question. Haveyou had an abortion in your past,67800:49:13.090 --> 00:49:15.329and then we ask a qualifier.If you say yes, then have you67900:49:15.449 --> 00:49:20.010gotten healing and what does that healingbeen? Because we want people to Minister68000:49:20.130 --> 00:49:23.360from a place of healing rather thanthe place of hurting, because you can't68100:49:23.360 --> 00:49:27.159give what you don't have. Andso this is just for those of you68200:49:27.320 --> 00:49:31.000who are counselors on the sidewalk whereyou underlove life or out there under your68300:49:31.039 --> 00:49:37.119church or whatever. If you haven'tgotten healing from a past abortion, you68400:49:37.199 --> 00:49:39.670should seek that out. You shouldsee restored life as a ministry that we68500:49:39.750 --> 00:49:45.949work with that's under love life's umbrella. Stephanie Ronhart's wonderful. She'll get you68600:49:45.030 --> 00:49:49.309connected and you can. I thinkit's love life that orgs last restored life.68700:49:49.469 --> 00:49:52.590Either way, you can search,you can google search that, but68800:49:52.860 --> 00:49:55.019that that's kind of a side notethat if you have an abortion in your68900:49:55.059 --> 00:50:00.019past, seek out that healing.Just make sure you come to a place69000:50:00.019 --> 00:50:02.219of healing and restoration so you canminister out of that. That's right.69100:50:02.300 --> 00:50:09.929And there's online healing resources if youknow that's more convenient, or just all69200:50:10.010 --> 00:50:14.329that you're able to do. Butsomething, something, is important. Getting69300:50:14.329 --> 00:50:16.849some sort of healing is important.Yeah, absolutely. So, just kind69400:50:16.849 --> 00:50:21.679of ending out this episode of thePODCAST, you have here in the article69500:50:22.360 --> 00:50:25.000the flow of the conversation right.So can you kind of just knock through69600:50:25.039 --> 00:50:30.800that as quick as possible? Okay, so a great way to just introduce69700:50:30.920 --> 00:50:34.440it's just saying, how are youdoing? Yeah, how are you doing,69800:50:34.559 --> 00:50:37.710and that's when she'll give those commentsthat you can piggyback off of.69900:50:37.150 --> 00:50:39.349You know, well, I knowit was wrong, but you know,70000:50:39.469 --> 00:50:44.110I'm moving on. I will oftenhear that I'm I know, I need70100:50:44.269 --> 00:50:46.590to just move on. I hearthat almost every time. And so,70200:50:46.909 --> 00:50:51.860because I hear that so frequently andit's a great comment, because it's such70300:50:51.900 --> 00:50:54.619a great one, to easily thensay, you know, you can't move70400:50:54.659 --> 00:51:00.739on without acknowledging what has truly happened, and that's how you go into the70500:51:00.900 --> 00:51:06.329story of or the the conviction ofsin. Yeah, and you know,70600:51:06.489 --> 00:51:10.849similar to what Nathan did with David, maybe mentioning some verses that talk about70700:51:10.849 --> 00:51:15.849the sanctity of life and and whydo you call me Lord Lord and not70800:51:15.929 --> 00:51:19.719do what I say? Anything thatis going to help her to recognize that70900:51:20.440 --> 00:51:28.280what she did was was wrong,was indeed sin, and then oftentimes there71000:51:28.400 --> 00:51:32.550will start to be some level ofremorse and in some women, some women,71100:51:32.630 --> 00:51:37.349great remorse, and then you canstart to talk about what true repentance71200:51:37.469 --> 00:51:43.590looks like and tell them that thereis forgiveness. Yeah, Great Opportunity then71300:51:43.670 --> 00:51:46.420to share the Gospel, if youhaven't already share it again. If you've71400:51:46.460 --> 00:51:51.219shared it once and then they wentand aborted, I would say it didn't71500:51:51.219 --> 00:51:55.460take words. I would question.I would go back to the section of71600:51:55.699 --> 00:52:00.179Romans ten nine. Jesus is Lord, and I will ask them was he71700:52:00.340 --> 00:52:05.010lord? Was He Lord when youwere in there taking the life of your71800:52:05.050 --> 00:52:08.650own son or daughter? And Iwill say it bluntly like that, and71900:52:09.090 --> 00:52:15.119oftentimes I'll say no, he wasn't. And so really revisiting what that means.72000:52:15.320 --> 00:52:20.320If Jesus is Lord, what thatmeans, what does your change life72100:52:20.360 --> 00:52:24.079look like then? And then talkingabout the healing post aboard of programs,72200:52:24.400 --> 00:52:30.269linking her with them if you ifpossible. I want to reiterate what we72300:52:30.389 --> 00:52:34.829mentioned early on, but it's veryimportant. I have heard many people say72400:52:35.070 --> 00:52:39.150the advice in when you're dealing witha woman who chose life inish lily and72500:52:39.269 --> 00:52:44.619now has turned back to abortion.Is just show her the love of Jesus,72600:52:44.980 --> 00:52:49.860and I say no that I Ithink that that probably does damage.72700:52:50.300 --> 00:52:54.380In fact, I would say yes, but just what I talked about earlier,72800:52:54.619 --> 00:52:59.090sharing her the love of Jesus isnot just be nice to her,72900:52:59.530 --> 00:53:04.449okay, but the love of Jesusis to bring like, okay, okay,73000:53:05.130 --> 00:53:08.769Jesus would be the physician that whenyou walk in with blue spots on73100:53:08.929 --> 00:53:13.840your face and in a horn grishow your head because you have some kind73200:53:13.880 --> 00:53:16.400of weird disease, he's going topoint that out because he loves you.73300:53:16.880 --> 00:53:21.079Right. So showing them the loveof Jesus is talking about the thing.73400:53:21.159 --> 00:53:23.480That's it's obvious, right. That'sright. Yeah, so a lot of73500:53:23.559 --> 00:53:27.230times she showing the love of Jesus. Again, people are saying just be73600:53:27.349 --> 00:53:30.550nice, talk about everything, butthat talk about, you know, think73700:53:30.550 --> 00:53:34.670about his comfort, just comforting.Now I walk into the physicians room and73800:53:34.789 --> 00:53:37.349to the or the doctor walks intothe room, you're sitting there on the73900:53:37.550 --> 00:53:40.659on the little bad thing, andhe just talks about how much how great74000:53:40.699 --> 00:53:44.739you are, he talks about howmuch he loves you. And yet meanwhile74100:53:44.780 --> 00:53:46.860you got all this blues, theseblue spots on your frience and a horn74200:53:46.900 --> 00:53:50.940grown out of your head, andhe doesn't talk about the thing that's going74300:53:51.019 --> 00:53:55.530to cause you great harm. Right, right. So just just comforting with74400:53:55.889 --> 00:54:00.530with Jesus loves you and and yeah, just go ahead and move on that.74500:54:00.610 --> 00:54:04.409That's not what we're calling to do. We Are we are called to74600:54:04.449 --> 00:54:12.159speak, speak truth in in aloving manner. And and so the remember74700:54:12.199 --> 00:54:15.840the goal. Remember the goal.It is for not only to help them74800:54:15.920 --> 00:54:20.119recognize their sin just for the purposeof recognizing sin, but the goal is74900:54:20.239 --> 00:54:22.639that they would be restored and reconciledto God. Yeah, that is the75000:54:22.760 --> 00:54:29.989ultimate goal. And and in youknow, do whatever you need to do,75100:54:30.429 --> 00:54:37.030truthfully and lovingly, to bring themto an acknowledgement that they need God75200:54:37.429 --> 00:54:42.820know that they have walked away fromhim in the act of abortion. Yeah,75300:54:43.380 --> 00:54:47.139absolutely good stuff. Yeah, Ithink. And it's all put into75400:54:47.139 --> 00:54:51.460an article. Yeah, that willbe on the sidewalks for life website.75500:54:52.019 --> 00:54:55.050I have tried to put the linksof these articles out as the podcast of75600:54:55.170 --> 00:54:58.250going out, but I'm not alwaysbeen able to do do that. So75700:54:59.050 --> 00:55:01.210if the link is not in theshow notes of the PODCAST, go to75800:55:01.289 --> 00:55:07.719sidewalks for lifecom search, post abortive, whatever words would bring this up.75900:55:07.760 --> 00:55:09.840You can do it in search prettyeasily and find out any articles that have76000:55:09.960 --> 00:55:14.840to do with that. And sohopefully you guys will be able to get76100:55:14.880 --> 00:55:16.159a hold of this article, becausethere's a lot in this article that we76200:55:16.239 --> 00:55:21.119didn't cover because we kind of ranout of time and we think it would76300:55:21.119 --> 00:55:22.309be a blessing to you. Soplease take advantage of that. Read the76400:55:22.389 --> 00:55:25.590article, share the article, reachout to us, like we say in76500:55:25.630 --> 00:55:29.309the beginning. You know we wantyou to share this podcast. Want you76600:55:29.309 --> 00:55:31.389to let us know if there areother things you'd like for us to talk76700:55:31.469 --> 00:55:35.780about, subjects you'd like for usto cover. Daniel, Love Life Dot76800:55:35.820 --> 00:55:37.900Org. You reach her, Vicky, at Love Life Dot Org. We76900:55:37.019 --> 00:55:40.900love to hear from you, butuntil next time, God bless God that77000:55:42.019 --> 00:55:53.570Y'all give me our love for love. Give me our love for gratitude.77100:55:57.650 --> 00:56:07.400I know it will cost me mylife. Nothing's too precious in some you