What Does it Mean to Be Gospel Centered and Pro-Life?

WEBVTT100:00:00.600 --> 00:00:05.799I Am Yours, I am yours, I am yours. Send Me,200:00:06.160 --> 00:00:10.710Lord. I welcome to Gospel centeredpro life. This is a podcast that300:00:10.830 --> 00:00:14.630deals with pro life issues in lightof the Gospel and this episode we're going400:00:14.630 --> 00:00:17.789to talk about what it means tobe Gospel centered in pro life. We500:00:17.870 --> 00:00:21.429have these episodes. Bless you.Thank you for listening. Stay tuned.600:00:23.699 --> 00:00:33.299I felt show passish touch your heart. Well. This is the Gospel Center700:00:33.420 --> 00:00:38.009pro life podcasts, a podcast ministryof Cities for life. I'm the director,800:00:38.049 --> 00:00:41.850Daniel Parks, of cities for lifehere in Charlotte, and this is900:00:41.890 --> 00:00:45.329our volunteer coordinator with cities for lifehere in Charlotte, Vicki, cassie Org.1000:00:45.890 --> 00:00:50.359This podcast is basically designed not topromote cities for life, but to1100:00:50.479 --> 00:00:54.880share some of our experiences in thepro life realm and with pro life ministry1200:00:55.320 --> 00:00:58.640and to talk about pro life issuesin light of the Gospel. That's really1300:00:58.679 --> 00:01:00.479our hearts. What it's called Gospelcentered pro life. We want to talk1400:01:00.479 --> 00:01:06.430about pro life issues, the issueof abortion and the protection of the unborn1500:01:06.790 --> 00:01:11.150in light of the Gospel and reallywhat that means to be pro life and1600:01:11.269 --> 00:01:15.189to be Gospel centered. And sojust right off bat with the first podcast,1700:01:15.230 --> 00:01:18.310we wanted to talk about really whatthat means, what it means to1800:01:18.390 --> 00:01:22.939be pro life and Gospel centered.Why is that different? Are we trying1900:01:22.980 --> 00:01:26.700to make ourselves sound more spiritual orwe trying to make ourselves sound better than2000:01:26.780 --> 00:01:30.739other people because they're not Gospel centeredbut we are? What's the motivation behind2100:01:30.780 --> 00:01:34.209this? Really want to talk aboutwhat it means to be Gospel centered and2200:01:34.450 --> 00:01:38.569pro life. Is it just againus to be super spiritual, or is2300:01:38.609 --> 00:01:45.049there something unique that we're trying toconvey and something that really we think would2400:01:45.049 --> 00:01:49.560benefit the church when we're talking aboutthe issue of life? So right off2500:01:49.719 --> 00:01:53.599bat, Vickie, let's talk aboutthat a little bit. What it means2600:01:53.680 --> 00:01:56.760to be Gospel centered in pro life. Let's talk about pro life first.2700:01:56.760 --> 00:02:00.280What does that mean? PROLIFE?Yeah, well, you know that that2800:02:00.000 --> 00:02:06.030that life is precious, that itis sacred, that it's of value and2900:02:06.469 --> 00:02:10.990of intrinsic value and should be protected. Yeah, yeah, yeah, and3000:02:12.069 --> 00:02:15.229so, from you know, myperspectives break down the word pro life,3100:02:15.389 --> 00:02:20.539pro which is for in the positive, and then life, for life.3200:02:20.979 --> 00:02:23.419We believe, and we're talking aboutlife or talking about human life, obviously3300:02:23.500 --> 00:02:28.139every life is precious. God madeall the creatures and all the animals,3400:02:28.460 --> 00:02:30.569but in particular he made human beingsand he made us special. In the3500:02:30.610 --> 00:02:34.210Bible says, he made us inhis image. And so we're talking about3600:02:34.210 --> 00:02:38.810pro life, we're talking about werefor the protection of life, human life.3700:02:38.849 --> 00:02:42.409Human life is not like animal life. It has an intrinsic value,3800:02:42.490 --> 00:02:46.919like you said, and a sacrednessto it, and so it's important to3900:02:46.000 --> 00:02:50.039be pro lives. A Matter offact, I've said actually, that I4000:02:50.159 --> 00:02:53.919believe everyone is pro life on somelevel, even pro abortion people who some4100:02:54.199 --> 00:02:59.349staunchly opposed what we do and callus is terrible names. But I believe4200:02:59.349 --> 00:03:01.229that those people in some sense orpro life. They would believe at some4300:03:01.469 --> 00:03:06.669point a human life deserves should beprotected. I think we would just say,4400:03:07.430 --> 00:03:09.629yeah, we should be pro lifeand human life is precious, but4500:03:09.789 --> 00:03:14.860we believe that there's no stage inwhich a human life, a unique human4600:03:14.900 --> 00:03:16.340life, does not deserve to beprotected. And that's kind of the pro4700:03:16.500 --> 00:03:22.099life that right and our nation isfounded on the belief that life is sacred,4800:03:22.259 --> 00:03:29.090is precious, is intrinsic and andand is the essential first right before4900:03:29.090 --> 00:03:34.810all other rights proceed. Yeah,so, yeah, so we covered the5000:03:34.849 --> 00:03:36.969pro life thing, when it meansto be pro life, and I'm sure5100:03:37.009 --> 00:03:39.770that can go into big definitions andthere can be a lot of INS and5200:03:39.849 --> 00:03:43.520outs of that, but I thinkpeople basically know what we're talking about.5300:03:43.520 --> 00:03:47.879We're talking about being prolife. Butwhat about the Gospel centered aspect that we're5400:03:47.879 --> 00:03:52.080talking about? What does that mean? Gospel centered pro life? You know,5500:03:52.280 --> 00:03:54.120I'll share a little bit about myheart, but what's your heart on5600:03:54.240 --> 00:03:59.789that? That sort of yeah,well, you know, I'm I'm I'm5700:03:59.949 --> 00:04:03.669someone who loves the Lord and andmy world view procepts from from that.5800:04:03.909 --> 00:04:11.180That is basic to everything that proceedsout of me. And so God's Word5900:04:11.259 --> 00:04:15.060is clear that human beings are madein the image of a holy God,6000:04:15.219 --> 00:04:21.420that life is sacred and and itis that which gives value to every human6100:04:21.500 --> 00:04:29.370being. And so if I ama a pro life person with a Gospel6200:04:29.689 --> 00:04:36.290Centered, focused life and Gospel centeredorientation and everything I do, then then6300:04:36.410 --> 00:04:44.199my my feelings about life are goingto reflect what God says about life and6400:04:44.279 --> 00:04:47.839they really can't be separated about youknow, for someone who is a Believer,6500:04:47.920 --> 00:04:54.990I think the Gospel has to bean inherent part of everything we do6600:04:55.750 --> 00:05:01.870as as pro life advocates, becausebecause God says that, God gives us6700:05:01.870 --> 00:05:09.139the standard by which we determine thepoint at which life become sacred. Yeah,6800:05:09.819 --> 00:05:13.660which is the point of conception accordingto the Bible. Yeah, and6900:05:15.220 --> 00:05:17.300you know, and everything flows outof that, that, that belief about7000:05:17.300 --> 00:05:21.209God. Everything that we encounter onthe sidewalk, I think, has to7100:05:21.329 --> 00:05:28.089proceed out of that and for methat's what a Gospel focused pro life ministry7200:05:28.970 --> 00:05:31.769is all about. Yeah, it'scourse, will mention a lot, as7300:05:31.850 --> 00:05:36.480we do our podcast, even thispodcast, about sidewalk counseling ministry. That's7400:05:36.519 --> 00:05:41.279what we do as a ministry andcities for life and and it's what we7500:05:41.399 --> 00:05:44.839deal with on a daily basis whenwe're there in front of the abortion centers,7600:05:44.920 --> 00:05:48.399where they're proclaiming the Gospel, wherethey are certainly speaking about the humanity7700:05:48.439 --> 00:05:51.870of the baby and the resources thatare available to a mom in need,7800:05:53.709 --> 00:05:58.149but we're also sharing the Gospel andeverything that we try to do is really7900:05:58.269 --> 00:06:01.509Gospel centered, focused on what Godsays in his word. Yeah, there's8000:06:01.509 --> 00:06:06.379a lot in the pro life realmwhen people talk about being prolife and people8100:06:06.379 --> 00:06:10.660say their pro life. A lotof times what I encounter, what what8200:06:10.779 --> 00:06:13.699you encounter, what used to encounterin general when you talk about pro life8300:06:13.779 --> 00:06:17.500stuff, is people take it asa political issue and so they hear right8400:06:17.540 --> 00:06:20.410away. When you talk about prolife, they might hear a Republican. You8500:06:20.449 --> 00:06:24.769know, I'm prolife. Also,you're a Republican, and so that's why8600:06:24.769 --> 00:06:27.569I think when we talk about beingpro life, when we talk about Gospel8700:06:27.610 --> 00:06:30.610centered pro life, that's what we'rereally saying. I think one since we're8800:06:30.610 --> 00:06:36.319separating out the politics from abortion becauseat its root, because abortion is sin8900:06:38.519 --> 00:06:42.560at its root, any sin isrooted to course and selfishness and all that9000:06:42.720 --> 00:06:46.319thing, all that that kind ofstuff, and this sin of abortion is9100:06:46.399 --> 00:06:49.269not really rooted in politics. It'sbeen captured, I think, by the9200:06:49.430 --> 00:06:55.149devil and by devious politicians to tryto make it a political thing. And9300:06:55.269 --> 00:06:58.949I so I think when we're sayingwe're Gospel centered pro life, we're separating9400:06:59.470 --> 00:07:02.420from the political aspect. Doesn't meanthat politicians can't do good stuff. They9500:07:02.500 --> 00:07:08.860can. There can be Gospel centerednew legislation. I guess that that can9600:07:08.899 --> 00:07:14.819be enacted. However, we understandthat it's not politicians that are going to9700:07:14.860 --> 00:07:17.209end abortion. It's not politicians thatare going to be saving babies on a9800:07:17.250 --> 00:07:21.449day to day basis. It's Goddoing it and it's through the proclamation of9900:07:21.529 --> 00:07:26.209the Gospel. And you know,of course, our heart is. We10000:07:26.290 --> 00:07:28.889don't want to get away from that. We don't want to get away from10100:07:29.410 --> 00:07:33.639the gospel censored approach decide, whilecounseling or the Gospel centered approach to talking10200:07:33.680 --> 00:07:38.439about the issue of abortion. We'rehaving a debate or a conversation with somebody10300:07:38.439 --> 00:07:43.319about abortion, God in his wordis always going to come up because,10400:07:43.360 --> 00:07:46.870like you said, it's central towho we are. We Are Christians.10500:07:46.470 --> 00:07:51.509We haven't had an encounter with Godthrough his Gospel that has changed our hearts10600:07:51.990 --> 00:07:56.189and, like the apostle says,we can't help. This. Is in10700:07:56.310 --> 00:07:58.509the book of acts where they weretold not to speak in the name of10800:07:58.550 --> 00:08:01.379Jesus, that we can't help butspeak the things that we've seen in that10900:08:01.459 --> 00:08:05.420we've heard. And so we're talkingabout the issue of life and the protection11000:08:05.500 --> 00:08:09.420of Human Life, the Gospel andGod's Truth and God's Word is going to11100:08:09.500 --> 00:08:13.569really come to play in that.And of course, when we're talking about11200:08:13.610 --> 00:08:18.810Gospel centered what we're talking about iswe're talking about a biblical understanding of pro11300:08:18.009 --> 00:08:22.730life issues. And now there are, you know, there's organizations out there11400:08:22.810 --> 00:08:28.000and there's some some organizations that arereally taken a secular approach to the issue11500:08:28.000 --> 00:08:31.039of life. There's even an organizationsecular pro life that that comes at it11600:08:31.080 --> 00:08:35.480from a secular perspective. And youknow, of course, when you look11700:08:35.480 --> 00:08:41.789at just the science behind life inthe womb and behind abortion, even from11800:08:41.789 --> 00:08:46.470a secular perspective, there's no denyingthat abortion is destroying human life. That's11900:08:46.470 --> 00:08:50.789right, that's right and from themoment of conception, is the only logical12000:08:50.909 --> 00:08:54.990drawing line, medically scientifically as well. And if it, you know,12100:08:54.029 --> 00:08:58.860if you don't have God, though, at the center, I think it12200:08:58.980 --> 00:09:05.899becomes easier to rationalize and to pointout terrible circumstances that somehow then change the12300:09:05.980 --> 00:09:11.289value of life. The value oflife becomes relative. So I think a12400:09:11.370 --> 00:09:18.250gospel oriented approaches is more absolute.Life is precious, period. Human Life12500:09:18.330 --> 00:09:22.409is precious and innocent human life shouldbe protected at all costs. Yeah,12600:09:22.529 --> 00:09:26.240yeah, because I think we runthe risk when we when we back away12700:09:26.759 --> 00:09:31.720or abandon what God's word says andthe need as believers to look at what12800:09:31.799 --> 00:09:35.080God's word says and base our beliefson that, because we kind of run12900:09:35.120 --> 00:09:39.110into this trap of end up havingan agree with the world and in the13000:09:39.149 --> 00:09:45.429world's persuasion when we abandon the foundationof the truth of God's word. And13100:09:45.870 --> 00:09:50.429sadly there are a lot of believers, not just in per life circles but13200:09:50.549 --> 00:09:54.500just in general, especially in America, that kind of abandoned the Gospel focused13300:09:56.580 --> 00:10:00.019approach to ministry. Really, Iwould say if you're not focused on the13400:10:00.139 --> 00:10:03.059Gospel and the Gospel is not yourmain driving force, you're not really doing13500:10:03.139 --> 00:10:09.330ministry. It's more like a businessor just some humanitarian effort. Humanitarian Efforts13600:10:09.370 --> 00:10:13.649aren't bad, they're good, butare humanitarian efforts have to flow out of13700:10:13.169 --> 00:10:18.169God's love put in our hearts andour desire to promote his gospel, because13800:10:18.450 --> 00:10:22.279it can become human centered, itcan become humanistic, and I we talked13900:10:22.320 --> 00:10:28.240about that before, but kind oflike a humanistic approach to prolife stuff and14000:10:28.440 --> 00:10:35.710saving babies. What's your take onkind of the humanistic approach there? Well,14100:10:35.830 --> 00:10:39.429again, God is is not anintegral part of it. It doesn't14200:10:39.590 --> 00:10:46.269need you can a humanistic approach wouldwould recognize, okay, the logical starting14300:10:46.309 --> 00:10:50.620place of life. The American Collegeof Pediatric says at the point of conception14400:10:50.100 --> 00:10:54.820there is human life and that humanlife develops and and all the names,14500:10:54.980 --> 00:11:01.539the de Zygoat, the fetus,all of those are just different stages of14600:11:01.659 --> 00:11:09.330development, but they're all human beingsand you know, and then when the14700:11:09.409 --> 00:11:13.970baby's born you have still a humanbeing, just more developed, and you14800:11:13.009 --> 00:11:18.370can certainly you can make a case, excuse me, for the value of14900:11:18.490 --> 00:11:22.639that little human being from the momentof conception. But but I think you15000:11:22.759 --> 00:11:30.200run into trouble from a humanistic pointof view when and the and equally valuable15100:11:30.559 --> 00:11:37.429human being, the mom has issuesthat make her feel that this human being15200:11:37.470 --> 00:11:46.509inside of her is impeding her ownsafety, happiness whatever. And and I15300:11:46.629 --> 00:11:50.059think that's where humanistic view is goingto struggle. Yeah, and a Gospel15400:11:52.179 --> 00:12:01.210focused view is is going to pointto something much more important than our humanistic15500:12:01.289 --> 00:12:09.409values. Are Standards are limited abilityto to kind of perceive the whole picture.15600:12:09.490 --> 00:12:13.370We're going to look to an absolutestandard of the value of life as15700:12:13.529 --> 00:12:18.559determined by a holy God and itis unchanging in our circumstances are not going15800:12:18.600 --> 00:12:24.960to change the value of that life, because God doesn't put restrictions on commands15900:12:24.039 --> 00:12:28.440like thou shalt not murder. Yeah, Thou shall not murder, whether your16000:12:28.480 --> 00:12:31.990circumstances are good or bad, whetheryou're rich or poor. And that child16100:12:31.070 --> 00:12:35.389is a value because, again,he's made in the image of a holy16200:12:35.429 --> 00:12:39.830God and I think if you cankeep going back to a biblical standard,16300:12:41.309 --> 00:12:46.700you you're on solid a solid foundation, which the Bible says also, you're16400:12:46.700 --> 00:12:52.980not on sinking sand. That's goingto change dependent on circumstances or or feelings.16500:12:54.100 --> 00:12:56.940Yeah, yeah, I mean we'vegot a lot in our modern society,16600:12:58.019 --> 00:13:00.809a lot of people that are drivento do a lot of good things,16700:13:00.929 --> 00:13:07.049but based on just feelings and fromour experience in the realm of ministry16800:13:07.129 --> 00:13:09.289that we're called to and that wefunction in on the sidewalks in front of16900:13:09.330 --> 00:13:13.159an abortion clinic, if we dowhat we do based on feelings, it17000:13:13.679 --> 00:13:18.480can be devastating. You know,just today we had a mom who just17100:13:18.639 --> 00:13:24.080yesterday had chosen life. Yeah,and she was farther along than most of17200:13:24.120 --> 00:13:26.120the moms that we encounter. Shewas almost sixteen weeks along at that point.17300:13:26.269 --> 00:13:31.350She'd actually gotten an ultrasound on board, a mobiultra sound unit with a17400:13:31.429 --> 00:13:35.750partner Ministry of ours, help pregnancycenter, and chose life. From what17500:13:35.830 --> 00:13:39.230we understood, we help to helpher to see all of the needs that17600:13:39.350 --> 00:13:43.820she had could be met with resourcesand things like that, and poured into17700:13:43.860 --> 00:13:48.220her and the sidewalk counselor Angela,had poured into her and just really connected17800:13:48.259 --> 00:13:50.340with her and we thought that wasa solid choice for life. And then17900:13:50.419 --> 00:13:56.169she came back today, apparently tokill that baby. Her feelings had changed18000:13:56.210 --> 00:14:01.850and kind of a you know,the opposite happened today on the sidewalk,18100:14:01.889 --> 00:14:07.730where a young woman very overwhelmed andand very certain that she needed to kill18200:14:07.769 --> 00:14:11.639her baby almost the same age.This is a big baby, fully developed.18300:14:11.679 --> 00:14:20.639Yeah, and and she she agreedto go on the mobile ultrasound unit18400:14:20.679 --> 00:14:28.830and her feelings changed when she sawthe baby on the ultrasound and when she18500:14:28.990 --> 00:14:37.509heard about the resources and and theGospel. But the point is that feelings18600:14:37.950 --> 00:14:43.220can her feelings led her to thatabortion center and then an hour later,18700:14:43.340 --> 00:14:48.820her feelings led her to believe thatthis child was of value. So feelings18800:14:48.860 --> 00:14:54.730are good. Yeah, shift andchange and there just has to be again,18900:14:54.929 --> 00:14:58.730there's something that is permanent. Yeah, that is lasting, that will19000:14:58.809 --> 00:15:03.730endure. Feelings won't, circumstances willchange. So yeah, so what can19100:15:03.850 --> 00:15:07.919we rely on that is unchanging?Yeah, and you know, I know19200:15:07.080 --> 00:15:13.399the Gospel was presented to the womanyesterday. But and I think that there19300:15:13.559 --> 00:15:16.840is a higher likelihood of woman isgoing to stay firm, yeah, her19400:15:16.879 --> 00:15:20.960choice for life when when the Gospelis presented. But of course, I19500:15:20.080 --> 00:15:24.830mean if she yields her life toJesus, and obviously she's not gonna not19600:15:24.950 --> 00:15:28.429going to have the abortion, evenfrom our perspective, you know, from19700:15:28.470 --> 00:15:35.149the the woman's perspective, the feelingschange. But even from our perspective,19800:15:35.269 --> 00:15:39.259and even maybe in a political realm, you know when politicians their feelings change19900:15:39.340 --> 00:15:43.980and there's always shifting and one politicianmight say that abortion is wrong and then20000:15:45.340 --> 00:15:50.090you know your years later say thatabortion is right because it's more expedient for20100:15:50.169 --> 00:15:52.090them and their feelings change on thisissue. And Yeah, and even with20200:15:52.330 --> 00:15:56.450you know, out there on thekind of the street level, out at20300:15:56.490 --> 00:16:00.769the abortion center, and we're outthere because God's word says we should be.20400:16:00.289 --> 00:16:03.519If we're only out there because wefeel like we want to be a20500:16:03.679 --> 00:16:07.039help to these MOMS or even tothese babies or whatever. That's one of20600:16:07.080 --> 00:16:11.200the things we warn our volunteers against, is you can't be out here based20700:16:11.200 --> 00:16:17.240on just emotion alone. Certainly emotions, God can use those to draw us20800:16:17.279 --> 00:16:19.149to do the right thing. Guiltcan be a good tool to get us20900:16:19.149 --> 00:16:22.269out there, but it can't sustainus out there on the sidewalk. And21000:16:22.470 --> 00:16:26.590so we have to be motivated bywhat God's Word Says First, like we21100:16:26.669 --> 00:16:30.830say, a love for God first, not even a love for that baby21200:16:30.909 --> 00:16:33.940first. Got To be a lovefor God first, and our focus is21300:16:33.019 --> 00:16:37.820on him and our focus is onadvance in his kingdom, not our ministry.21400:16:37.139 --> 00:16:40.620You know, we can get inthis mentality of we're trying to advance21500:16:40.620 --> 00:16:44.539our ministry and then we get thingsout of whack, you know. But21600:16:44.820 --> 00:16:51.250really our emotions can shift, ourcircumstances can change and society can shift and21700:16:51.370 --> 00:16:56.090society can change its opinion of thevalue of life, but God's word doesn't21800:16:56.210 --> 00:17:00.929change. Yeah, the Scripture saysthat heavens earth can pass away, but21900:17:00.370 --> 00:17:07.319my word remains, and that's whywe come from a Gospel centered perspective of22000:17:07.400 --> 00:17:10.920Biblical perspective on anything that we writetalk about right, and that's such a22100:17:10.960 --> 00:17:15.910good point, because a humanistic approach, I think it would be very easy22200:17:15.990 --> 00:17:19.269to be discouraged. You've presented allof this medical evidence. You know the22300:17:19.390 --> 00:17:22.829science behind human development, you knowthat baby is a baby, is a22400:17:22.910 --> 00:17:27.390human being from the moment of conception. And if you're out there thinking,22500:17:27.430 --> 00:17:33.619okay, if I just present enoughfacts, then logically everyone will choose life.22600:17:33.619 --> 00:17:36.980Well, we know that doesn't yeah, that doesn't happen because we're not22700:17:37.259 --> 00:17:41.740just rational beings, we're spiritual,yeah, beings as well, otional beings22800:17:41.819 --> 00:17:45.529and emotional and you know, andand so, when you're coming from a22900:17:45.609 --> 00:17:52.529Gospel perspective, just like you said, we're not there primarily to save babies.23000:17:52.650 --> 00:17:55.529I mean we are. That's thefocus of our ministry, on one23100:17:55.890 --> 00:17:59.839in one, you know, aspect. But we are primarily out there because23200:17:59.880 --> 00:18:02.960God has commanded us to be outthere. He has said that we are23300:18:03.000 --> 00:18:07.079to be a voice for those whocan't speak for themselves. And so we23400:18:07.640 --> 00:18:11.039have the victory by being on thatsidewalk. We have done what God has23500:18:11.119 --> 00:18:15.150asked us to do, and thenwe use that that time out there to23600:18:15.230 --> 00:18:19.349the best of our ability and,with the grace of God, hopefully bear23700:18:19.509 --> 00:18:27.819fruit. But but our our goalis to be obedient to God and let23800:18:27.859 --> 00:18:33.220him be responsible then for what happens. Yeah, there, yeats are yeah,23900:18:33.259 --> 00:18:36.940I mean that's, you know,kind of one of the dynamics that24000:18:37.259 --> 00:18:41.809it that we can deal with nationallyon a political level or just again,24100:18:41.890 --> 00:18:45.130on a street level, is that. Yeah, we can do certain things.24200:18:45.210 --> 00:18:48.809You know, man plans his step, his steps, but the Lord24300:18:48.930 --> 00:18:52.569has that passage gave. Man planshis step, but the Lord makes the24400:18:52.609 --> 00:18:56.400way access directs this fact. Thankyeah, yeah, yeah, it should24500:18:56.599 --> 00:19:00.039that. Certainly. So we planour steps, we do the things that24600:19:00.119 --> 00:19:04.119we know best to do, butultimately the results are up to the Lord,24700:19:04.200 --> 00:19:07.440between the Lord and the person.So we can't as much as we24800:19:07.519 --> 00:19:12.630don't take responsibility in a baby issaved or when some political victory takes place.24900:19:12.750 --> 00:19:15.309I mean, certainly there's a lotof stuff going on in our nation25000:19:15.430 --> 00:19:21.670now and there's some political victories anddefeats and and on later podcast will talk25100:19:21.789 --> 00:19:26.099more about some of the politics andhow we view the politics of abortion in25200:19:26.259 --> 00:19:29.660light of the Gospel and all ofthat. But even in those realms and25300:19:29.779 --> 00:19:33.539on the street level. We can'ttake credit for when a mom chooses life,25400:19:33.579 --> 00:19:36.900when a victory is row we givethe glory to God because it's his25500:19:37.140 --> 00:19:41.009work, it's his spirit at workin the hearts of the MOMS. And25600:19:41.170 --> 00:19:45.410even when a mom decides to gointo the abortion clinic and and to have25700:19:45.650 --> 00:19:48.809that abortion, we can't take responsibilityfor that, because I know one thing25800:19:48.930 --> 00:19:53.160that that can happen is we canlet our flesh and the devil beat us25900:19:53.160 --> 00:19:56.960up. And the thing we shouldhave said this. You didn't say that.26000:19:56.000 --> 00:20:00.319I spoke with Angela. We texta little bit this morning about this26100:20:00.400 --> 00:20:03.079mom who came back and she waslike, you know, shouldn't be doing26200:20:03.079 --> 00:20:04.319in it, but I'm beating myselfup. Yeah, like should have said26300:20:04.359 --> 00:20:07.390this. I have said what elsecould I say? And so my encouragement,26400:20:07.430 --> 00:20:11.829as always, I was encouraging anothervolunteer who stopped a mom, who26500:20:12.109 --> 00:20:15.349mom stopped and she talked to heron their way into the abortion center and26600:20:15.630 --> 00:20:19.269just poured everything out to her thatshe could possibly think. They poured out26700:20:19.269 --> 00:20:22.819to this mom and she still wentin there and she said, I feel26800:20:22.819 --> 00:20:25.420like I should have said this,said, listen, you can do that,26900:20:26.140 --> 00:20:30.460because you can always say something better. You could always deliver it at27000:20:30.460 --> 00:20:33.380a Matamore opportune time or whatever thatyou can. It's like your flesh is27100:20:33.460 --> 00:20:37.529never satisfied. You could always dobetter. Okay, fine, but you27200:20:37.650 --> 00:20:42.250can never say something that is alwaysgoing to change someone's mind because you don't27300:20:42.250 --> 00:20:47.769know their circumstances. What you areresponsible to do is to deliver the mail.27400:20:47.970 --> 00:20:52.680Just deliver the truth and they areresponsible to receive that truth and to27500:20:52.720 --> 00:20:55.519do with that truth what they whatthey should. Yeah, well, the27600:20:55.559 --> 00:20:57.160results are up to the Lord.What God said to Moses? You know,27700:20:57.240 --> 00:21:00.240he sends him to go speak toPharaoh, and most says but I27800:21:00.359 --> 00:21:04.349can't. I'm a man of StutteringLips. Why, you think about that?27900:21:04.430 --> 00:21:07.869Why would God, of all thepeople that could have chosen? Surely28000:21:07.990 --> 00:21:11.109there was someone who is eloquent?Yeah, but he didn't. He chose28100:21:11.230 --> 00:21:15.630a stutterer to deliver his message.And I and the Bible says, when28200:21:15.670 --> 00:21:18.339we are weak, he is strong. And so I think again. It28300:21:18.779 --> 00:21:25.539is freeing in a Gospel centered propro like ministry. It is freeing to28400:21:25.700 --> 00:21:30.539all of those who labor it withwith that in mind, because it truly28500:21:30.579 --> 00:21:33.890is what what we need to sayand do. God will empower us and28600:21:34.049 --> 00:21:40.250then everything else is up to him. Yeah, Tis. Yeah, again,28700:21:40.289 --> 00:21:44.569we're responsible for just the delivery ofthe male, so to speak,28800:21:45.009 --> 00:21:48.640and people are responsible for whether ornot they open it what they do with28900:21:48.720 --> 00:21:52.039it when they do open you Godtold Isekiel and say sent them to the29000:21:52.079 --> 00:21:55.960children of it who sent is Equelto the children of Israel as a prophet?29100:21:56.079 --> 00:22:00.200He said basically, if you don'twarn them, their blood will be29200:22:00.279 --> 00:22:03.670on your head, but if youwarn them and they don't obey, their29300:22:03.710 --> 00:22:07.869blood is on their head. Sowe're responsible to warn people of the consequences29400:22:07.950 --> 00:22:15.140of abortion and to to offer themthe alternatives to abortion and life affirming options29500:22:15.180 --> 00:22:18.819and all that stuff. We're responsibleto do that and deliver that male,29600:22:18.980 --> 00:22:22.539so to speak, but what theydo with it is up to them,29700:22:22.619 --> 00:22:26.420and we you know as much aswe're told that we try to control women's29800:22:26.460 --> 00:22:29.420bodies with what we talked about asfar as to convince people not to have29900:22:29.500 --> 00:22:33.609abortions. We literally don't have controlover women's bodies. We don't, or30000:22:33.730 --> 00:22:37.130else, you know, abortion wouldn'twouldn't exist because we're plased to it.30100:22:37.289 --> 00:22:41.569Yeah, so it's kind of thatdynamic of us. We can't take responsibility30200:22:41.609 --> 00:22:48.279for the results either way, aslong as we're faithful to deliver the truth30300:22:48.359 --> 00:22:51.480of God's word. Right. That'swhat we of course, ought to do30400:22:51.599 --> 00:22:53.920as Christians in every realm that we'reinvolved in. Exactly, and I think30500:22:56.279 --> 00:23:00.069for me, one of the strongestindicators of that that's the way to go.30600:23:00.470 --> 00:23:06.589Yes, when, almost every timea woman pulls up and I go30700:23:06.829 --> 00:23:11.990through whatever talking with her, butwhen I when I offer the question what30800:23:11.150 --> 00:23:17.339would God have you do, italmost always causes tears. Yeah, even30900:23:17.380 --> 00:23:22.900in people who say they don't necessarilyknow God, because that we are spiritual31000:23:22.059 --> 00:23:26.609beings and we all do know whatbecause God has written on our heart and31100:23:26.690 --> 00:23:30.650all creation declares the glory of God. We know right from wrong. God31200:23:30.690 --> 00:23:34.970has shown us very clearly and Ithink it's it's it's you know, it's31300:23:34.970 --> 00:23:38.289a very telling question. Yeah,absolutely. Yeah, one of the things31400:23:38.329 --> 00:23:45.400that I'd share with you that kindof Said is my failsafe prolife argument to31500:23:45.440 --> 00:23:48.480a mom at an abortion clinic,and it's a very simple argument. I31600:23:48.559 --> 00:23:52.359guess you is not really an argument. You're pleading the case. You're doing31700:23:52.400 --> 00:23:55.279what proverbs thirty one, verses eightnine says open your mouth for the speech31800:23:55.319 --> 00:23:56.470us. In the cause of allwho were pointed to die, open your31900:23:56.470 --> 00:24:00.630mouth, judge righteously and believe.The cause of the poor and needy is32000:24:00.710 --> 00:24:03.750basically to ask them the question,do you believe that there's a God?32100:24:03.789 --> 00:24:07.470And and the majority, especially herein the South Maj already, are going32200:24:07.509 --> 00:24:10.900to say, I believe there's aGod. Okay, you believe that God32300:24:11.140 --> 00:24:15.460loves every person. Yeah, Ibelieve God loves every person. And then32400:24:15.500 --> 00:24:18.619you make the question more personal.Do you believe God loves you? Yes,32500:24:18.660 --> 00:24:22.019I mean most people are going tosay Oh, yeah, and they32600:24:22.099 --> 00:24:26.769probably you know, you're so obviouslygrateful that God does love them and smiling.32700:24:26.809 --> 00:24:29.450Yeah, God loves me. Andthen you ask the question, well,32800:24:29.569 --> 00:24:32.890when did God begin to love you? I did this just last Saturday.32900:24:32.930 --> 00:24:34.410I was talking to a young ladywho came with a friend and she33000:24:34.569 --> 00:24:38.079was trying to justify the abortion ofher friend and saying, you know,33100:24:38.119 --> 00:24:41.000I don't exactly agree, but she'sin a difficult situation. I asker that33200:24:41.039 --> 00:24:44.839question. You believe there's a God? Yeah, you believe that God loves33300:24:44.880 --> 00:24:47.440every person. Yeah, you believeit. God loves you. Yeah,33400:24:47.680 --> 00:24:49.200and then I asked the question whendid God begin to love you? And33500:24:49.359 --> 00:24:52.390it didn't take it was a splitsecond before she responded with, well,33600:24:52.470 --> 00:24:56.589but I know, but you know. So she puts it in you where33700:24:56.630 --> 00:24:59.430you were going exactly. She knewswhere I was going to. So I33800:24:59.589 --> 00:25:02.829responded with where, you can't putyour butt in the way of what God's33900:25:02.869 --> 00:25:06.390truth says. What does God's truth, what does his words say about human34000:25:06.470 --> 00:25:11.420beings, about human life? Doeshe love every person from the moment that34100:25:11.500 --> 00:25:15.619they become a person, but atthe moment of conception, or does he34200:25:15.740 --> 00:25:19.460not? And if, if hedoesn't love that baby before that baby is34300:25:19.579 --> 00:25:23.130born, like he loved you beforeyou were born, why what does that34400:25:23.210 --> 00:25:27.410baby possessed that that you don't?Or what does that maybe not possessed that34500:25:27.450 --> 00:25:32.089you do? And so what you'redoing is you're basically showing them that they34600:25:32.130 --> 00:25:37.640have separated themselves as better than thisother person. And it brings it kind34700:25:37.680 --> 00:25:41.680of brings it home and you know, it starts the wheels turning. But34800:25:41.759 --> 00:25:45.279that whole argument, that whole youknow, idea comes right out of God's34900:25:45.319 --> 00:25:48.559word. I'm going right to whatGod says. I'm starting with the premise35000:25:49.230 --> 00:25:52.710that there's a god, because Iactually believe. I don't. You know,35100:25:52.829 --> 00:25:56.710there's there's a book Great Comfort wrote, I think some years back,35200:25:56.789 --> 00:26:02.309called God doesn't believe, an atheist, and I believe God's Word is pretty35300:26:02.309 --> 00:26:04.420plain about this, that there reallyare no atheists. There are people that,35400:26:04.859 --> 00:26:08.299you know, believe that there's nogod in some sense, but it's35500:26:08.299 --> 00:26:14.339almost an emotional thing and it's almostlike they do they believe in order they35600:26:14.539 --> 00:26:18.059disbelieve in God in order to satisfytheir conscious. Fact is, every person35700:26:18.299 --> 00:26:22.289knows that they have a creator andthat they're responsible to that creator, you35800:26:22.369 --> 00:26:26.609know, and that's really really thefoundation, I guess, of a Gospel,35900:26:26.609 --> 00:26:30.809Senator Approach, is that there isa god and that he has certain36000:26:30.849 --> 00:26:33.759truths and is certain appeal in hisword that he calls you to. He36100:26:33.920 --> 00:26:38.759calls you to acknowledge your sin,to turn from your sin and to put36200:26:38.799 --> 00:26:44.160your trust and the work that JesusChrist did and his death is bury on36300:26:44.279 --> 00:26:47.269his resurrection, and that's Really Gospel, senator. That's right and it's so.36400:26:47.589 --> 00:26:52.190You know, we've heard how manymillions of just really horrific stories?36500:26:52.269 --> 00:26:56.950There are horrific situations that these thesewomen are off and in and and if36600:26:56.990 --> 00:27:00.309you go to a Gospel senator approachlike that, where you know the foundational36700:27:00.349 --> 00:27:06.859truths of what God says about thesanctity of human life, then that's the36800:27:06.980 --> 00:27:10.579issue. Yeah, that's where youcan keep coming, bringing them back instead36900:27:10.619 --> 00:27:15.650of all those rabbit trails of theirterrible circumstances. And you add as Christians,37000:27:15.690 --> 00:27:19.289I think we should meet those aswell as we're able, that we37100:27:19.329 --> 00:27:25.250should at least address and and tryto provide resources to help them through those37200:27:25.329 --> 00:27:30.960those dire needs. But the issueis not the circumstances. The issue is,37300:27:32.480 --> 00:27:34.640is life precious or is it notbefore a Holy God? Yeah,37400:27:34.720 --> 00:27:40.440you're going to rebel against him ordecide to follow him. Yeah, yeah,37500:27:40.720 --> 00:27:42.920and we're talking about Gospel, aGospel Center approach. We're talking about,37600:27:42.960 --> 00:27:48.509you know, Gospel centator approach tosidewall counseling or or whatever political realm37700:27:48.670 --> 00:27:52.750of Gospel centert approach to doing apregnancy center or whatever. We're not talking37800:27:52.750 --> 00:27:56.509about shoving the Gospel Down Somebody's throat. We're not talking about except Jesus,37900:27:56.549 --> 00:27:59.180or we're not going to help you, or you know, anything like that.38000:27:59.579 --> 00:28:03.500Exact what we're talking about. Thatthat's our main motivation and while we're38100:28:03.500 --> 00:28:07.660out there, is to advance God'skingdom through the proclamation of the Gospel,38200:28:07.299 --> 00:28:11.579and we're talking about that's kind ofwhat we're always going to come back to.38300:28:11.619 --> 00:28:14.490You know, when we do asa ministry, we do baby showers.38400:28:14.529 --> 00:28:18.250Other ministries do do different things tohelp women in need, and we38500:28:18.289 --> 00:28:21.089should, but we're always going tosay, well, this is because of38600:28:21.210 --> 00:28:23.049what God has done for us andhe's done the same for you. If38700:28:23.089 --> 00:28:26.759you'll turn to him, he'll rescuehe'll save you from your sin, because38800:28:26.759 --> 00:28:32.240at the foundation of the issues thatall of the eels of society, the38900:28:32.319 --> 00:28:37.079issues that we face are, attheir foundation the issues spring out of sin.39000:28:37.279 --> 00:28:41.470The problem is sin, the problembeing sin. The problem with abortion39100:28:41.589 --> 00:28:45.390it's not a it's not a politicalissue, it's a sin issue. It's39200:28:45.390 --> 00:28:49.470a spiritual issue and it's rooted insin. It's rooted in selfishness. The39300:28:49.630 --> 00:28:55.509solution for the issue of abortion,in any other of the ills of society,39400:28:55.549 --> 00:28:59.299abortion being one of the worst,if not the worst, issue that39500:28:59.380 --> 00:29:03.180we face in society. It's rootedin sin. Of the solution is Jesus39600:29:03.220 --> 00:29:07.259Christ, his Gospel, his deathis burial and his resurrection. Right,39700:29:07.579 --> 00:29:11.849right, and it's not that we'retrying to shove our beliefs on someone,39800:29:11.930 --> 00:29:15.970it's that we know this is truth. This is truth and this is what39900:29:17.170 --> 00:29:21.690is going to change the the politicianscan change all the laws in the world40000:29:21.690 --> 00:29:26.119and it's it's not going to affectabortion unless there's a true change in the40100:29:26.319 --> 00:29:33.200heart of the people, because therewill always be desperate women thinking that killing40200:29:33.240 --> 00:29:37.480their child is what's going to solvetheir issues unless they recognize that there's something40300:29:37.960 --> 00:29:44.430far more important than their than theircircumstances or their their ease and comfort in40400:29:44.509 --> 00:29:48.309their life at that moment. Yeah, yeah, so, yeah, that's40500:29:48.309 --> 00:29:52.230a little bit of our heart.That's our this our first podcast episode to40600:29:52.349 --> 00:29:56.380try to give an understanding of thosewho would be listening and watching where we're40700:29:56.420 --> 00:30:00.859coming from. Why Gospel centered prolife? Would we ever trying to make40800:30:00.900 --> 00:30:04.180ourselves again more spiritual or whatever?Now we're trying to say that our approach40900:30:04.220 --> 00:30:07.410to anything, any subject that wedeal with, has to be founded in41000:30:07.450 --> 00:30:11.849God's word and our desire has toalways be to promote the gospel of Jesus41100:30:12.369 --> 00:30:17.329and a loving and gracious way,but also in a fourth right and truthful41200:30:17.369 --> 00:30:21.329way and we believe that if wedon't abortion to end in this country and41300:30:21.480 --> 00:30:25.119around the world, the Gospel hasto take root in a society in order41400:30:25.200 --> 00:30:30.319for abortion and these evils to end. So we appreciate all those who listen.41500:30:30.079 --> 00:30:34.039You can check us out as aministry on Charlotte dot cities for Life41600:30:34.079 --> 00:30:41.150Dot Org and go on facebook atcities for Life Charlotte, and we'd love41700:30:41.230 --> 00:30:49.180to connect with you. And,God bless give me our love for love,41800:30:52.859 --> 00:31:02.380give me our loft for gratitude.I know it will cost me my41900:31:02.700 --> 00:31:10.089life. Nothing's too precious in someyou