Was Pastor Matt Chandler Right?

WEBVTT100:00:00.560 --> 00:00:05.759I Am Yours, I am yours, I am yours, s and me.200:00:06.120 --> 00:00:09.509Lord, some folks have implied thatif we tell a woman not to300:00:09.589 --> 00:00:12.470have an abortion, then we needto be willing and able to meet the400:00:12.550 --> 00:00:16.070needs that brought her to the abortionclinic in the first place. But as500:00:16.109 --> 00:00:19.829that concept Biblical and how should weview that subject? Join us as we600:00:19.949 --> 00:00:34.500talked this through. I felt showpassish touch your welcome to the Gospel Center700:00:34.579 --> 00:00:38.810pro life podcast. We appreciate youguys listening and we're going to talk today800:00:40.210 --> 00:00:44.689about Matt Chandler, but not really. So we're not. This podcast is900:00:44.810 --> 00:00:48.369not throwing him under the bus.It's just a particular mean that's been out1000:00:48.409 --> 00:00:52.280there in the social media around andthat some folks have been talking about,1100:00:52.880 --> 00:00:55.759and so we wanted to talk aboutit, not just about him, and1200:00:55.920 --> 00:00:59.039I'm sure you know he's a greatguy. I don't listen to Matt Chandler1300:00:59.079 --> 00:01:02.079A lot. I've missed listen tohim some. He has some good messages1400:01:02.119 --> 00:01:07.069about abortion in particular, and andI believe their church is really involved in1500:01:07.829 --> 00:01:11.469trying to rescue the unborn and doingthings for the Lord in that realm.1600:01:11.709 --> 00:01:15.189But this is really just I thinka misconception that a lot of people have.1700:01:15.629 --> 00:01:22.420Right and I don't know it's sometimesit looks to me, when people1800:01:22.420 --> 00:01:26.859say things like this, that theirconcern is less with what the Bible says1900:01:26.060 --> 00:01:30.939and more with what culture might sayor might think. MM and so,2000:01:32.099 --> 00:01:34.689if you don't mind, you've writtenan article here. Right, he,2100:01:34.890 --> 00:01:38.329like you do often times. Yeah, and I appreciate would you read that2200:01:38.409 --> 00:01:42.489quote? That? Yeah, yeah, so he there was this meme on2300:01:42.609 --> 00:01:47.680facebook. It said, as thechurch, we must not say of abortion,2400:01:48.200 --> 00:01:53.239this is murder without saying to pregnantwomen we will serve you. If2500:01:53.319 --> 00:02:00.920we're doing the former without the ladder, we don't truly understand the Gospel.2600:02:00.280 --> 00:02:05.189Okay. So if we're doing thethe former, we're saying abortion is murder2700:02:05.510 --> 00:02:07.430without doing the ladder, which isbasically saying hey, will serve you,2800:02:07.909 --> 00:02:12.949pregnant mom, then we don't understandthe Gospel. Right. Right. And2900:02:13.150 --> 00:02:15.819you know, it ties into Ididn't know I was going to mention this3000:02:15.860 --> 00:02:17.939this early, but it just flowsinto it. It ties into this idea3100:02:19.139 --> 00:02:23.699that and this has been attributed toprobably everyone's favorite theologian over the years or3200:02:23.699 --> 00:02:27.939favorite preacher over the years. Idon't know actually who said it. But3300:02:28.620 --> 00:02:31.409Preach the Gospel at all times.It when necessary, use words. Right,3400:02:31.449 --> 00:02:34.930I heard that one. Oh yeah, yeah, one of my least3500:02:34.930 --> 00:02:37.530favorite. Yeah, well, youknow, it's cute, you know,3600:02:37.610 --> 00:02:39.050and it makes the world think.Oh, these people are not just about3700:02:39.090 --> 00:02:43.969shoving the Gospel Down People's throats.There about helping others, right, which3800:02:43.969 --> 00:02:46.680we should help mothers. I meanwe're not. This podcast is not saying3900:02:46.719 --> 00:02:51.719we shouldn't help others, but thatidea preach the Gospel and, when necessary,4000:02:51.759 --> 00:02:54.520use words is like, yes,stupid. Yeah, they're say,4100:02:54.680 --> 00:02:58.629you know, they're saying it's getyou should demonstrate it with your life,4200:02:58.789 --> 00:03:00.669but not speak with your words,which, it is true, you should4300:03:00.710 --> 00:03:05.069demonstrate with you likely, but that'snot what the Bible says about how we4400:03:05.110 --> 00:03:07.310are to share the Gospel. Yeah, I mean that would say preach the4500:03:07.389 --> 00:03:13.539Gospel and it's necessary to use wordslike in order to preach the Gospel.4600:03:13.539 --> 00:03:15.699And you have the gospel of Matthew, Mark, Luke and John. Those4700:03:15.740 --> 00:03:22.419gospels were written down their words.They are written right to be broadcast about4800:03:22.500 --> 00:03:24.259this Jesus, and right, youknow, Paul and First Corinthians, Chapter4900:03:24.340 --> 00:03:29.129Fifteen, the first couple of versesthere in First Corinthians, Chapter Fifteen,5000:03:29.129 --> 00:03:31.129he says it's The Gospel that Idelivered to you, which I received.5100:03:31.250 --> 00:03:35.169And Yeah, and he lays outthat Jesus Christ died for our sins,5200:03:35.169 --> 00:03:38.009according to the scriptures, that hewas buried on the third day he rose5300:03:38.050 --> 00:03:40.250again, according to the scripture.So the Gospel is the death, burial5400:03:40.330 --> 00:03:45.080and resurrection of Jesus Correct. Andsometimes we fall into the trap, and5500:03:45.159 --> 00:03:49.199I think it's possible that's what MattChandler's here doing in this quote, if5600:03:49.199 --> 00:03:52.120fall into the trap of, youknow, trying to guess, trying to5700:03:52.159 --> 00:03:54.120look good to the world and trynot to look like just preachy people.5800:03:54.319 --> 00:03:58.189What we should be doing good things, and you know those two things.5900:03:58.270 --> 00:04:01.389It's not like it's mutually exclusive,like you can preach the Gospel, use6000:04:01.469 --> 00:04:04.909words and you can do good forothers. We're commanded to do good for6100:04:04.990 --> 00:04:10.060others. Were commanded to, youknow, in these situations, to as6200:04:10.139 --> 00:04:14.460best we can to help these women. But the question is, and it's6300:04:14.580 --> 00:04:18.019in it's a misconception that I liketo tear down with folks, with our6400:04:18.060 --> 00:04:23.259new volunteers and with other folks thatI talked to about pro life issues is6500:04:23.420 --> 00:04:27.329that, you know, we can'tgo out there to an abortion clinic,6600:04:27.370 --> 00:04:30.490or we can't be in a pregnancycenter in ministry, or we can't stand,6700:04:30.649 --> 00:04:32.810you know, in a protest situationwith a sign saying abortion is murder,6800:04:33.089 --> 00:04:35.529unless we're willing to help all ofthe women that would come to an6900:04:35.529 --> 00:04:40.879abortion to have an abortion right it. Is that really true and as that7000:04:41.160 --> 00:04:45.920mentality really biblical? Yeah, andand we can't speak against abortion without having7100:04:45.959 --> 00:04:50.800the resources to help women who wouldconsider abortion right right and to meet the7200:04:50.920 --> 00:04:54.709needs that they are using to justifyables. Yeah, you know, one of7300:04:54.750 --> 00:04:58.750the things that I like to dowhenever these sorts of statements are made is7400:04:59.350 --> 00:05:05.670kind of show the ludicrousness of thosestatements by giving other examples, not of7500:05:05.750 --> 00:05:10.779an unborn child, so sort oflike a fault experiments, kind of kind7600:05:10.779 --> 00:05:14.620of just substituting a different, differentwords, but that give the basic same7700:05:14.660 --> 00:05:17.300idea. So so what if thememes said, as a church, we7800:05:17.980 --> 00:05:24.769must not say that's sexual abuse oftwo year olds is wicked, without saying7900:05:24.850 --> 00:05:28.930to all fathers we will serve you. Yeah, okay, that's not all8000:05:28.970 --> 00:05:32.050that different from except now we're talkingabout instead of an unborn and an abortion,8100:05:32.129 --> 00:05:39.920which is a legal and increasingly sociallyacceptable form of murder. We're talking8200:05:39.959 --> 00:05:43.519about something that most people agree with, that that two year old should not8300:05:43.560 --> 00:05:46.920be sexually is. If you don'tagree with that, then turn this podcast8400:05:46.040 --> 00:05:49.110off and right, right and goget demons cast out. Okay, so8500:05:49.189 --> 00:05:54.709here's anotherhood. How about this?As a church, we must not say8600:05:54.829 --> 00:06:01.069of drunk drivers who kill innocent children, murderers, unless we provide programs to8700:06:01.269 --> 00:06:05.980every alcoholic. All right, yeah, and you know, these thought experiments8800:06:06.019 --> 00:06:11.980and you kind of analogies help usto see the absurdity, right, of8900:06:12.100 --> 00:06:15.339what's being said. Right. Soyou know what Matt Chandler says again,9000:06:15.339 --> 00:06:17.459going back to that you we mustnot say of abortion. Then it's murder9100:06:18.170 --> 00:06:21.449without saying to the mother. willserve you right. Well, let's ask9200:06:21.490 --> 00:06:26.529ourselves the question then and again.I'm not picking on Matt Chandler, is9300:06:26.889 --> 00:06:30.170you know, it's a situation wherewe could ben I can't see how,9400:06:30.370 --> 00:06:32.959but maybe he was taken out ofcontext. It's just a little quote.9500:06:33.160 --> 00:06:36.519I think the human coalition or somebodyput it out in a meme, right,9600:06:36.639 --> 00:06:39.959and and it's some other folks grabdon't do it. Say this is9700:06:40.279 --> 00:06:42.480what. What is it? Whatis he even talking about? So we're9800:06:42.519 --> 00:06:45.759not picking on him, but wehave to ask yourself, though, is9900:06:45.800 --> 00:06:48.990abortion really murder? And, youknow, I would say take even a10000:06:49.029 --> 00:06:54.350step further than that. Is itmass genocide? Is it like unto the10100:06:54.470 --> 00:07:00.870Holocaust, because I think most prolifefolks would agree that it is. I10200:07:00.949 --> 00:07:04.060mean, we're looking at sixty fivemillion plus, right, so that's almost,10300:07:04.220 --> 00:07:08.699you know, ten times as manypeople that were killed in the Holocaust10400:07:08.779 --> 00:07:11.860and I think we all would lookback at the Holocaust and say that was10500:07:11.939 --> 00:07:16.769a terrible, massive loss of innocentlife and it was something that we as10600:07:16.810 --> 00:07:20.089a society, we, you know, human being, should look back and10700:07:20.170 --> 00:07:25.930say that should never have happened.Right, is abortion? Is the abortion10800:07:26.050 --> 00:07:30.480Holocaust like unto that? And itwould always be, you know, Tan10900:07:30.560 --> 00:07:33.839amount to saying to you know,these Nazis who many felt like they were11000:07:33.920 --> 00:07:38.720doing their country and economic good bygetting rid of these people that they perceive11100:07:38.839 --> 00:07:42.120to be the problem that, youknow, we can't say to these Nazis,11200:07:42.199 --> 00:07:46.110Hey, don't, don't pack theseJews away and in cattle cars and11300:07:46.470 --> 00:07:48.990send him off to concentration camps andultimately kill them, like we're not able11400:07:49.029 --> 00:07:54.990to say that unless we offer themsome kind of rehabilitation, profect or in11500:07:55.350 --> 00:07:58.899the economic conditions that they needed.That they were saying, if we get11600:07:58.939 --> 00:08:03.220rid of the Jews, it willincrease whatever prosperity. Yeah, and so11700:08:03.899 --> 00:08:07.500what do we need to be surewe're? Should we have been sure Germany11800:08:07.620 --> 00:08:11.740was economically prosperous and then say,Oh and by the way, don't right.11900:08:11.779 --> 00:08:15.850Yes, three million Jews are howevermany million Jews they can yeah,12000:08:15.930 --> 00:08:22.370and really the question is this.Do we have any right to go and12100:08:22.490 --> 00:08:26.529tell moms going into an abortion clinicor MOMS who are struggling in their hearts12200:08:26.569 --> 00:08:28.040and minds of whether or not tohave an abortion, that we have any12300:08:28.079 --> 00:08:33.240right to tell them not to killtheir children if we don't have the resources12400:08:33.480 --> 00:08:37.799available to meet their needs or ifwe're not willing to make the sacrifices that12500:08:37.919 --> 00:08:41.269we would have to make as achurch, as a ministry, as an12600:08:41.269 --> 00:08:46.110individual, like if we're not willingto take a mother in our house who's12700:08:46.149 --> 00:08:48.789getting who's going to be kicked outof her house unless she has an abortion,12800:08:48.830 --> 00:08:50.110right, do we have any rightto tell her not to have that12900:08:50.190 --> 00:08:54.590abouttion, right, and some folkswill say no, yeah, we need13000:08:54.710 --> 00:08:56.899to be be willing to open ourhouse. And I'm not saying because you13100:08:58.019 --> 00:09:01.779know, some of our volunteers haveliterally done that. Some volunteers have literally,13200:09:01.019 --> 00:09:05.700literally taken MOMS who were going tobe homeless into their homes from the13300:09:05.860 --> 00:09:09.649abortion clining. Yep, you serveall some testimony. So, yeah,13400:09:09.850 --> 00:09:13.330that's that's something that, you know, some of our folks have been willing13500:09:13.370 --> 00:09:16.730to do. But, as everyone, should everyone be willing to do that?13600:09:16.289 --> 00:09:20.049Yeah, and and of course not, of course not. So,13700:09:20.570 --> 00:09:24.559as in all things, it's it'sreally valuable. Says, what does the13800:09:24.600 --> 00:09:28.000Bible say? Yeah, does doesthe Bible the exactly does the Bible Guide13900:09:28.000 --> 00:09:33.120us in this? And so,when I was working on this article,14000:09:35.639 --> 00:09:41.789does the Bible talk about proclamations bythe Church regarding we could behavior? Okay,14100:09:43.309 --> 00:09:48.990and how are we to talk aboutor are we to talk about we14200:09:50.110 --> 00:09:52.980could behavior? Do we need tojust the Bible talk about providing social programs14300:09:54.059 --> 00:09:56.779first or whatever? So some ofthe some of the verses that I found,14400:09:58.019 --> 00:10:03.379these are verses for all from proverbstwenty eight. Okay, I just14500:10:03.539 --> 00:10:07.850looked at the one proverb the wickedflee when no one is pursuing, but14600:10:07.970 --> 00:10:11.769the righteous are bold as a lion. All right, those who forsake the14700:10:11.889 --> 00:10:18.730law praise the wicked, but thosewho keep the law strive with them.14800:10:20.490 --> 00:10:26.120He who leads the upright astray inan evil way will himself fall into his14900:10:26.279 --> 00:10:33.039own pit. But the blame wasblameless will inherit good. He who confesses15000:10:33.320 --> 00:10:39.789and forsakes transgressions will find compassion.A man who is laden with the guilt15100:10:39.830 --> 00:10:43.990of human blood will be a fugitiveuntil death. Let no one support him.15200:10:45.870 --> 00:10:50.259He who rebukes a man will afterwardfind more favor, favor than he15300:10:50.379 --> 00:10:54.340who flatters with the tongue. Inother words, in all of these verses,15400:10:54.620 --> 00:10:58.500the righteous are bold. Who arethe righteous? The Bible tells us,15500:10:58.539 --> 00:11:01.539right, who are the righteous?Well, I mean, of course15600:11:01.620 --> 00:11:05.649we all know there's none righteous.So we're not. We're not righteous in15700:11:05.769 --> 00:11:09.929and of ourselves, right, butwhen we become Christians, we take on15800:11:09.049 --> 00:11:13.850the righteousness of Christ and you andthe Bible's pretty clear that you are.15900:11:13.889 --> 00:11:18.490You are righteous in Christ and soyeah, I mean we could, as16000:11:18.529 --> 00:11:22.279Christians, say we're the righteous bythe grace of God, and we're told16100:11:22.000 --> 00:11:28.399we who are righteous are to bebold as lions. Yeah, in exposing16200:11:28.720 --> 00:11:31.799evil. So yess club. Sure, proverbs twenty eight is a good one.16300:11:31.919 --> 00:11:33.669The what there were many. Thatwas throughout proverbs twenty eight, where16400:11:33.710 --> 00:11:37.029I didn't give the specific verses,but you can, you can look them16500:11:37.070 --> 00:11:45.590up. But so, what doesboldness entail? And you touched on this16600:11:45.629 --> 00:11:50.740right at the beginning. Is Boldnessjust demonstrating by our lives that we are16700:11:52.539 --> 00:12:00.179reflecting God and and showing God's atoningsacrifice for us, the Gospel, through16800:12:00.259 --> 00:12:05.330our behavior? It should. Butis that boldness? Right? And there16900:12:05.370 --> 00:12:15.169were a lot of scriptures about boldness. And listen to the active verb.17000:12:15.610 --> 00:12:18.360Okay, in all of these scriptureinto some grammar, grammar, and there,17100:12:18.360 --> 00:12:22.799yeah, this is a grammar.Let's I was an English major in17200:12:22.840 --> 00:12:26.600a little bit worried. Yeah,okay, okay, in axe twenty eight,17300:12:26.720 --> 00:12:31.870thirty one, proclaiming the Kingdom ofGod and teaching about the Lord Jesus17400:12:33.149 --> 00:12:37.909with all boldness. Yeah, proclaiming, right, that's the active verb.17500:12:37.029 --> 00:12:41.110We are proclaiming with all boldness.Okay, how about this one? If17600:12:41.190 --> 00:12:46.580Heesian six nineteen, but also forme that words may be given to me17700:12:48.059 --> 00:12:54.059in opening my mouth boldly right,to proclaim the mystery of the Gospel effician,17800:12:54.139 --> 00:12:56.259six nineteenth people. So all again. Right. And what does he17900:12:56.379 --> 00:13:03.690do? He opens his mouth boldly, not catch flies, right, right,18000:13:03.370 --> 00:13:09.210probably to speak, probably say okay, Second Timothy, three hundred and18100:13:09.210 --> 00:13:13.720sixteen, all scriptures breathed out byGod and profitable for teaching, for reproof,18200:13:15.279 --> 00:13:20.039for correction and for training in righteousness. Now, the word boldly wasn't18300:13:20.080 --> 00:13:22.519in there, but it does tellus, tell us that we are to18400:13:24.240 --> 00:13:28.669correct others. Now I want toask how can we correct others if we're18500:13:28.789 --> 00:13:33.029you're not speaking. Yeah, howare we going to correct well, you18600:13:33.110 --> 00:13:35.269know, someone might well say,you know, if someone's living a lifestyle18700:13:35.350 --> 00:13:39.629that's destructive, if you live alifestyle that honors God and it's not destructive18800:13:39.669 --> 00:13:43.899in front of them, MMM,then that's a way that you can correct18900:13:43.899 --> 00:13:46.620them. Your life can be arebuke, right, and and that correction,19000:13:46.779 --> 00:13:52.659presumably, would take some time.So what if? What if the19100:13:52.940 --> 00:13:56.210need for correction is when there's alife or death on the line in front19200:13:56.250 --> 00:13:58.409of me? Yeah, because Imean to that situation. And you would19300:13:58.409 --> 00:14:01.730say, if somebody's, you know, it's let's say you have next door19400:14:01.730 --> 00:14:05.370neighbors that are living, you know, sexually and moral. Maybe they're shacked19500:14:05.370 --> 00:14:09.129up and they're cohabitating. They're notmarried in right, you know, I19600:14:09.169 --> 00:14:11.440mean my wife were going to livean awesome married life in front of these19700:14:11.480 --> 00:14:15.440people. Be a display. Yes, and Amen, you should right.19800:14:16.080 --> 00:14:20.600But those it's not like an eitheror situation. M You need to be19900:14:20.080 --> 00:14:22.960speaking the Gospel. That I meanyou're shoving it down their throat. It20000:14:24.039 --> 00:14:26.830doesn't mean you in the situation ofabortion that we need the we're not saying20100:14:26.830 --> 00:14:31.230you need to stand in front ofabortion clinic and yell you murderer. You20200:14:31.309 --> 00:14:33.990feel the murder or your abortion ismurder, anything like that. But you20300:14:35.350 --> 00:14:37.659do need to use words right inorder to proclaim the Gospel and you do20400:14:37.860 --> 00:14:43.100need to use words in order toproclaim, two women going into an abortion20500:14:43.139 --> 00:14:46.419clinic and men at the abortion clinicthat abortion is wrong. Right. We've20600:14:46.460 --> 00:14:52.059talked about it a bunch and soI don't think that we need to backtrack20700:14:52.139 --> 00:14:56.409and qualify what we're saying, butI'LL DIS mantine it. We're not,20800:14:56.129 --> 00:15:00.049as a ministry, standing in frontof the abortion clinic just yelling at people.20900:15:00.090 --> 00:15:03.769We want to be gracious in ourwords, but we also do want21000:15:03.769 --> 00:15:09.519to speak what we speak with boldness, with truth and with clarity. And21100:15:09.639 --> 00:15:13.759you know, the Bible does tellus that there are actions that people should21200:15:13.759 --> 00:15:22.029see, but they're not just theactions of living a righteous life. They21300:15:22.070 --> 00:15:26.750are that, but listen to theseactions. Okay, and in proverbs eleven,21400:15:26.789 --> 00:15:31.070one of kind of a key versefor our ministry. Rescue those who21500:15:31.429 --> 00:15:37.340are being taken away to death,hold back those who are stumbling to the21600:15:37.419 --> 00:15:45.659slaughter. Our actions are to preventin a physical way. What is someone21700:15:46.179 --> 00:15:50.370in a dire situation being led awayto death, stumbling to the slaughter?21800:15:50.450 --> 00:15:54.169Where to hold them back? Whereto rescue them? So we're to broke21900:15:54.210 --> 00:16:00.250up, boldly, proclaim the Gospel, boldly, stand and act to deter22000:16:00.649 --> 00:16:03.679the wicked. Yeah, I thinkthe Bible's pretty clear about that and I22100:16:03.840 --> 00:16:08.399just gave a very few verses thatthat talk about that. We are to22200:16:08.480 --> 00:16:14.799confront evil boldly. Yeah, yeah, and the confrontation that were supposed to22300:16:14.840 --> 00:16:18.029have with evil is often times averbal confrontation, like you just mentioned.22400:16:18.110 --> 00:16:22.710You know, the the Timothy Passageabout reb rebuke and reproof. Those are22500:16:22.950 --> 00:16:27.750those are verbal words. Yes,are they imply that you're using your mouth22600:16:27.830 --> 00:16:32.389or using your words right, tobring a reproof, to bring a rebuke,22700:16:32.509 --> 00:16:34.460to bring a correction. Yeah,and in none of these verses,22800:16:34.620 --> 00:16:40.019by the way, and you canlook through proverbs twenty eight, there is22900:16:40.220 --> 00:16:44.220in the last verse in Proverb TwentyEight, one call in a sense to23000:16:44.379 --> 00:16:47.769social justice. That that verse.I'll just read it. He who gives23100:16:47.809 --> 00:16:51.649to the poor will never want,but he who shuts his eyes will have23200:16:51.690 --> 00:16:56.610many curses. But all of theother verses and in in proverbs twenty eight,23300:16:56.690 --> 00:17:00.330we're talking about how to how todeal with the wicked. Yeah,23400:17:00.639 --> 00:17:04.119but he gives to the poor.He doesn't say gives to the poor who23500:17:04.720 --> 00:17:10.039have done some wickedness. It's justgive to someone who's an unfortunate circumstances.23600:17:10.200 --> 00:17:15.000Right. That's a very different situationthan what's happening at an abortion center.23700:17:15.079 --> 00:17:18.589Yes or not? Just poor women? These are often poor women who are23800:17:18.589 --> 00:17:22.630there murdering their baby. Yeah,well, you know, also there's this23900:17:23.190 --> 00:17:29.509misconception that folks have about women goinginto abortion clinics, women that are having24000:17:29.509 --> 00:17:33.420abortions. Now, I am notsaying that there aren't difficult situations. There24100:17:33.460 --> 00:17:37.619are. We encounter them on aregular basis. Just a few days ago24200:17:37.619 --> 00:17:41.420we were talking about this. Wehad a situation where a young lady's boyfriend24300:17:42.059 --> 00:17:45.049was in essence, trying to forceher to have an abortion. There was24400:17:45.089 --> 00:17:49.450a such a scuffle he busted thewindow over car out with the Rock and24500:17:51.049 --> 00:17:53.730and you thankfully she didn't have theabortion, praise God, but she was24600:17:53.769 --> 00:17:57.599under a lot of pressure right andshe was, you know, still is24700:17:57.640 --> 00:18:00.920under a lot of pressure. Thatsituation hasn't just disappeared because she left the24800:18:00.960 --> 00:18:04.519abortion clinic. Yeah, and weencounter, I mean, any situation you24900:18:04.640 --> 00:18:08.240can think of that might could potentiallyjust find abortion, we encountered. But25000:18:08.880 --> 00:18:12.910the fact is the vast, vast, vast majority of the women that we25100:18:12.950 --> 00:18:18.710encountered at an abortion clinic are inno way victims, in no way,25200:18:19.390 --> 00:18:22.190you know, being pressure to havean abortion. I mean we see him25300:18:22.990 --> 00:18:26.539go in and and they almost likethey kill their baby just for spite.25400:18:26.579 --> 00:18:32.420Yeah, of us. Now again, I'm not tagging everyone that has an25500:18:32.460 --> 00:18:34.859abortion with that kind of mentality orwhatever, but I'm just saying our experience25600:18:34.900 --> 00:18:37.500has been and if and if youhave this mentality, I guess what I'm25700:18:37.500 --> 00:18:41.609getting at is, if you havethe mentality that women that have abortions to25800:18:41.730 --> 00:18:47.009just pure, poor innocent victims.Then come out with us for a couple25900:18:47.049 --> 00:18:49.609of days, come out and joinus on the sidewalk and you'll see that26000:18:49.730 --> 00:18:52.690they're not just victims. We dida podcast about this. Are Women that26100:18:52.769 --> 00:18:57.920have abortions victims? And and wetalked about biblically and and from a biblical26200:18:59.039 --> 00:19:02.319perspective. You know, in asense we're all victims of the lies of26300:19:02.400 --> 00:19:06.440the enemy. Doesn't give us justificationfor doing the sins and things that we26400:19:06.519 --> 00:19:07.400do. Do we do a podcast, but did? Yeah, we did.26500:19:07.480 --> 00:19:11.509Okay, yeah, so you remember. It's awesome to I remember it26600:19:11.589 --> 00:19:15.309so so vividly right now. NotReally, but listen to it. It's26700:19:15.309 --> 00:19:19.789awesome. So the idea that womenare poored, just poor innocent victims of26800:19:19.869 --> 00:19:23.579their circumstances and that's why they havean abortion, it's just a misconception,26900:19:23.619 --> 00:19:29.299right. It is. It isand that you know. We see women27000:19:29.380 --> 00:19:32.539go in and we see women comeout and we see many come out with27100:19:32.660 --> 00:19:36.660tears in their eyes and their heartsare broken and it's grievous for us to27200:19:36.740 --> 00:19:40.410see them come out and it's basicallyokay, you've been duped by the devil.27300:19:40.450 --> 00:19:42.250He told you go in and havethe abortion and it's going to be27400:19:42.329 --> 00:19:45.890all right. And you're saying thecomforter going in is your accuser. Come27500:19:45.890 --> 00:19:48.769Out, look what you've done,and so hard to see. But the27600:19:49.089 --> 00:19:52.849vast majority are not like that.The vast majority to come out and they27700:19:52.880 --> 00:19:56.519got their middle finger up and they, you know, speed out just despite27800:19:56.559 --> 00:20:02.079you. Right, there's something onfacebook right now, I believe they're quotes27900:20:02.200 --> 00:20:06.079and testimonies. I think it's callednot a victim. Yeah, and and28000:20:06.200 --> 00:20:11.390it's quotes and testimonies from women whoare post abortive and who talked about they28100:20:11.430 --> 00:20:15.630admit, look, I am nota victim and they'll describe their wickedness and28200:20:15.750 --> 00:20:18.910you can going into that abortion.So, yeah, I haven't looked much28300:20:18.910 --> 00:20:22.339into that, but yeah, yeah, you know, and are not that28400:20:22.579 --> 00:20:26.220many of them are not. They'renot and they admit they're not. And28500:20:26.299 --> 00:20:30.980I think another another way that wecan approach whether this meme is true or28600:20:32.019 --> 00:20:37.289not is to think about are thereany biblical examples of Prophets, messengers of28700:20:37.369 --> 00:20:44.450God, anyone who God has sentto confront evil, to confront wicked?28800:20:44.809 --> 00:20:51.480Yeah, who are also told byGod but first make sure all those social28900:20:51.599 --> 00:20:56.960programs that are necessary to take careof all those wicked people's needs are in29000:20:56.119 --> 00:21:00.400place. Yeah, yeah, well, you know, you think about the29100:21:00.440 --> 00:21:03.910children of Israel and and their rebellionagainst God, and I know you're going29200:21:03.910 --> 00:21:07.549to talk a little bit about Moses. To be going on, even pass29300:21:07.710 --> 00:21:11.950Moses, H Huh, if you'relooking at Jeremiah, the prophet is they29400:21:12.869 --> 00:21:18.660write these men were called to adifficult task, right, they were called29500:21:18.740 --> 00:21:22.380to expose the sin of the nationof Israel, their rebellion and their idolatry.29600:21:23.460 --> 00:21:26.819And again, it was not aneasy task. And it's not like29700:21:26.900 --> 00:21:30.740these people were involved in, youknow, just you know, bad gambling29800:21:30.859 --> 00:21:36.369deals or they are, you know, you know, doing just underhanded things.29900:21:36.410 --> 00:21:42.009They were involved literally in sacrificing theirchildren to demons, to Pagan Gods,30000:21:42.130 --> 00:21:47.799right, little g and so theywere dealing with in a lot of30100:21:47.839 --> 00:21:52.559ways, what we're talking very similar. So it's the absolutely murderabness the innocent30200:21:52.640 --> 00:21:55.559babies. So hop into what you'vegot. They well, so some of30300:21:55.640 --> 00:21:59.440the I was just thinking of someof the people who were commanded by God30400:21:59.519 --> 00:22:03.509to confront wickedness, because that's whatbasically chandler is talking about. Pastor chandlers30500:22:03.910 --> 00:22:08.470is saying, okay, you're confrontingthe wickedness of abortion. Well, you30600:22:08.630 --> 00:22:15.470can't call it murder until you've setup all of these programs that are going30700:22:15.470 --> 00:22:18.339to help those this women. That'swhat he means by we will serve you,30800:22:18.460 --> 00:22:19.980whatever your needs are. We will, we will serve you. So30900:22:21.220 --> 00:22:23.940let's think about Moses. Okay,he comes off the mountain with the Ten31000:22:25.059 --> 00:22:32.289Commandments and he sees his people ofSir biling down to a false god that31100:22:32.369 --> 00:22:36.730they had made right, the goldencalf that they had made, and so31200:22:37.329 --> 00:22:45.599Moses right away breaks the ten commandmentsand then offers them an idolatry, idolatry31300:22:45.640 --> 00:22:48.119recovery program right. Yeah, Imean of course. I mean while Whitney,31400:22:48.160 --> 00:22:52.559you knows. How could he tellthem, you idolatrous, idolatrous people,31500:22:53.119 --> 00:22:57.079you have defied a holy God,unless he first makes sure that there31600:22:57.200 --> 00:23:00.869is a recovery program in place?Of course they need an idolatry cover every31700:23:00.990 --> 00:23:04.430program and he would have that inplace before he even right got angry through31800:23:04.509 --> 00:23:07.589down the tablets. Of course,that's an absurdity that that's not what happened.31900:23:07.630 --> 00:23:12.460Action are in this article and Isaw the idolatry recovery program I had32000:23:12.539 --> 00:23:17.539to laugh. That's that's really funny. That's really classic. But again it32100:23:17.579 --> 00:23:21.579shows the absurdity of what we're talkingabout. And right just probably keep saying32200:23:21.660 --> 00:23:23.980this because I feel I don't justthrow this brother under the bus. I'm32300:23:23.980 --> 00:23:26.369sure he meant well and what he'ssaying, but this is a learning and32400:23:26.650 --> 00:23:32.849teachable moment. I think that wecan just tear down some really barriers now32500:23:33.609 --> 00:23:37.730and I think an important point tothis and why we felt like we needed32600:23:37.730 --> 00:23:41.369to tackle this, is that itis a barrier for people coming out to32700:23:41.480 --> 00:23:45.599the sidewalk because they don't feel like, number one, that they're equipped to32800:23:45.680 --> 00:23:49.240come out to the sidewalk and bea voice for the voices. Number two,32900:23:49.279 --> 00:23:52.079you listen, you're flesh and thedevil will give you all kinds of33000:23:52.200 --> 00:23:56.990reasons not to obey God and bea voice to the voiceless. And you33100:23:56.069 --> 00:24:00.069know, I don't have the financialresources to help a mom. I mean,33200:24:00.150 --> 00:24:02.349what if? What if a momneeds a place to stay and and33300:24:02.430 --> 00:24:04.549I can't bring her into my house. I have so many kids already and33400:24:06.069 --> 00:24:07.309and I have so much to takecare of already. I can't do that.33500:24:07.910 --> 00:24:11.740And so people it'll be a barrierfor some people to think I can't33600:24:11.740 --> 00:24:15.819say abortion is murdering go out thereand stay until him not to murder their33700:24:15.859 --> 00:24:18.579children, if I can't help themin this this and this way and again,33800:24:18.660 --> 00:24:21.859it'll be a barrier. And youknow, Moses certainly didn't have that33900:24:22.019 --> 00:24:26.009as a barry as he dealt withthe children of Israel and and you ultimately34000:24:26.970 --> 00:24:30.329was he do? He takes theGolden Calf and grinds it into powder and34100:24:30.410 --> 00:24:33.690makes them drink it. I meanthat this is so shure, because that34200:24:33.809 --> 00:24:37.410was he is social repecovery program thisthis brother was series about this, this34300:24:37.609 --> 00:24:41.240thing. You know, another danger, as long as we're talking about the34400:24:41.240 --> 00:24:44.119dangerous because, like you said,no, we don't mean to pile on34500:24:44.160 --> 00:24:47.079Matt Chandler. Right, yeah,he seems like a great guy from the34600:24:47.279 --> 00:24:49.720little I know about him. Butbut this, I think, is a34700:24:51.079 --> 00:24:55.549very real, impresent danger of ameme like that and the message of that34800:24:55.789 --> 00:25:00.710meme. The moms themselves who arego going into abort their children use this34900:25:03.069 --> 00:25:08.700excuse for why to abort their children. Just this morning I was there early.35000:25:10.059 --> 00:25:11.660There was a mom who had beendropped off by a cab driver.35100:25:11.779 --> 00:25:17.099So I had fifteen minutes to talkwith her before they open the door and35200:25:17.420 --> 00:25:19.779we had a long exchange. Mostof hers were four let a word and35300:25:22.970 --> 00:25:26.650telling me to shut up and thatI didn't have any right to say what35400:25:26.809 --> 00:25:34.410I was saying. Just what whatthis meme says. Because was I going35500:25:34.450 --> 00:25:41.279to take care of her baby?Yeah, and I said yes. I35600:25:41.480 --> 00:25:47.119said yes, not me specifically,but I have a list of names of35700:25:47.279 --> 00:25:52.990mother's who want a child. Havesaid any mother at the abortion center who35800:25:52.029 --> 00:25:56.829says I need someone to take careof my baby and then I won't aboard?35900:25:56.069 --> 00:26:00.750So I am happy to provide thatlist with you, ma'am. And36000:26:00.869 --> 00:26:07.460then she she went on to thenext level. If I keep this baby,36100:26:07.099 --> 00:26:11.500if I don't kill this baby.I don't think she said either kill36200:26:11.779 --> 00:26:15.500or or baby, by the way, but she said, will you provide36300:26:15.539 --> 00:26:23.809his college education? Again, it'sthe same philosophy. Unless we provide needs,36400:26:25.289 --> 00:26:30.329and in fact all their needs,then they are justified in killing their36500:26:30.369 --> 00:26:34.319baby, they think, and Idon't think that's what probably Matt Chandler was36600:26:34.440 --> 00:26:41.880saying, but they do not needto be forcibly confronted as I was,36700:26:41.440 --> 00:26:47.390because her heart was clearly very hard. Right and and he I think that36800:26:47.630 --> 00:26:52.150me it would tell me I hadno right to confront her. Yeah,36900:26:52.789 --> 00:26:56.150yes, and one, since itcould discourage someone like you, who were37000:26:56.150 --> 00:26:59.670going out there to be a voicefor the voiceless, and it would encourage37100:26:59.710 --> 00:27:03.019an abortive mother to say, well, if these people can't provide for all37200:27:03.059 --> 00:27:07.539my needs, then then I'm justfine, justified. I absolutely aboard.37300:27:07.940 --> 00:27:11.380And if head, I've had womenand men say to me, if you37400:27:11.460 --> 00:27:14.420give me five thou dollars right now, won't have this abortion right. And37500:27:14.539 --> 00:27:18.849it's like, okay, there's thisselfishness there that we don't need to play37600:27:18.890 --> 00:27:22.250into now. We don't, becausewe're never going to. Everybody has needs.37700:27:22.289 --> 00:27:26.250We're never going to be AB Solucentisfinding. So you know, I'll37800:27:26.289 --> 00:27:29.690say this, and I've said thisthe volunteers, I've said this to myself,37900:27:29.730 --> 00:27:33.960I've said this to you. Ifwe had nothing, not a single38000:27:34.200 --> 00:27:38.519resource. Thank God, maybe we'llget into some of that yet some point.38100:27:40.039 --> 00:27:42.039Thank God. We have all kindsof resources here in Charlotte. You've38200:27:42.039 --> 00:27:47.670got ministries, I mean we've gotfinancial counselors that will sit down. We've38300:27:47.670 --> 00:27:51.950got relationship counselors, we've got housing, ministry, clothing, food, I38400:27:52.029 --> 00:27:55.269mean anything you can think of.It's amazing what God has done. Yeah,38500:27:55.430 --> 00:27:56.829and they may not be like thatin every city. Thankfully it's like38600:27:56.950 --> 00:28:00.420that here. We thank God forthat right. But if we had none38700:28:00.460 --> 00:28:06.140of that, if the only thingthat we had was our measily little voices38800:28:06.819 --> 00:28:11.259and the only words we could ekeout was don't murder your child, yeah,38900:28:11.740 --> 00:28:15.369we would be still perfectly justified instanding in front of that abortion clinic.39000:28:15.849 --> 00:28:21.650Why? Because abortion is murder,because it's sin, because it's wrong,39100:28:21.890 --> 00:28:25.009and we're commanded to speak out againstthat which is sin, that which39200:28:25.049 --> 00:28:27.519is wrong. Right, tell theyagree. Let me go on to another39300:28:27.559 --> 00:28:32.920problem. Let's go in too anokay. Let's think about Jonah okay,39400:28:33.119 --> 00:28:38.359going to Innova and he tells themto repent eventually. I mean at first39500:28:38.400 --> 00:28:41.400he said in a way, wasit. Yeah, you know, we39600:28:41.470 --> 00:28:44.069went definitely ran from the Lord.He did, he did. But then39700:28:44.069 --> 00:28:48.589he does go and and he tellsthem to repent. But before he tells39800:28:48.670 --> 00:28:55.819them to repent, he sets upa crisis intervention center for bloodthirsty liars because39900:28:56.180 --> 00:29:00.579he has to because because in inJonah, one, one, two,40000:29:00.660 --> 00:29:04.180two, the word of the Lordcame to Jonah, the son of Amatos,40100:29:04.259 --> 00:29:07.500saying arise, go to an innof other great city and cry against40200:29:07.539 --> 00:29:12.930it, for their wickedness has comeup before me. And later we find40300:29:12.970 --> 00:29:18.690out what that wickedness is. InNahem, Uh Huh, chapter three,40400:29:18.809 --> 00:29:23.210verse one, woe to the bloodycity. He's talking about Nineveh completely full40500:29:23.250 --> 00:29:30.240of lies and pillage. Her preynever depart. So their bloodthirsty, lying40600:29:30.400 --> 00:29:34.039pillagers. Well, before we cancall them those things, are confront them40700:29:34.119 --> 00:29:41.750in their sin accord that see lyingpillager crisis, ventiman center. And yeah,40800:29:41.829 --> 00:29:45.150maybe they're blood maybe they're lying inbloodthirsty and pillagers because, you know,40900:29:45.269 --> 00:29:48.029they don't have much. They wereraising bad homes, right, maybe41000:29:48.029 --> 00:29:52.549they that was their example. Yeah, they're that's that's what their father did41100:29:52.630 --> 00:29:55.099right for them, my father's father. And they just don't have it.41200:29:55.220 --> 00:29:59.420They just need counseling. They justneed counseling. Yeah, and and maybe41300:29:59.460 --> 00:30:03.700that's the case, but still,yet we know the private Jonah was to41400:30:03.779 --> 00:30:11.369go and to proclaim God's truth andgive a warning of the consequences if they41500:30:11.369 --> 00:30:14.890are to continue in sin. Now, of course, we know them into41600:30:14.930 --> 00:30:17.730the story. Jonah was not sohappy, no, about this, but41700:30:17.890 --> 00:30:21.960I think God was very happy thatthis, that Nineveh, repented before God.41800:30:22.240 --> 00:30:25.680Yeah, and that, you know, God was glorified in that city.41900:30:26.039 --> 00:30:30.319For there is contants, a quickout intervention center there, Turk,42000:30:30.400 --> 00:30:33.880without all of their needs being metand all the resources that they need.42100:30:33.039 --> 00:30:38.950It exactly just by speaking truth,by obeying God, speaking truth, exposed42200:30:38.990 --> 00:30:45.589using the wickedness and urging them toturn repent and turn to God. And42300:30:45.150 --> 00:30:49.539there was repentance. Yeah, soamazing what God's word will do. Even42400:30:49.579 --> 00:30:55.500apart from resources and stuff, God'sword changes heart. Yeah, now I42500:30:55.539 --> 00:30:59.420would say I will say, andwe've said this before, certainly are resources.42600:30:59.660 --> 00:31:03.099Resources do soften these women so toa point where some of them will42700:31:03.180 --> 00:31:07.369then say, okay, they're worthhearing. Yeah, and that's how the42800:31:07.490 --> 00:31:11.170resources are valuable. I think it'sone of our it's one of our three42900:31:11.210 --> 00:31:15.569points we're dealing with when we're training. Sidewalk counts right. You'll see it43000:31:15.650 --> 00:31:19.240on the sidewalks for life those whoare listening and and maybe you'll go on43100:31:19.279 --> 00:31:22.599the sidewalks for life site. It'sone of our first couple of articles about43200:31:22.599 --> 00:31:26.079the three talking points for sidewalk counselors. Right. First one is what does43300:31:26.119 --> 00:31:30.240God say about this? So bringingGod's truth, God's word, to bear43400:31:30.440 --> 00:31:33.950in the situation. We believe that'sfirst and most important. Secondly, the43500:31:34.029 --> 00:31:38.390humanity of the baby, talking aboutthis is a human being, describing fetal43600:31:38.430 --> 00:31:41.869development and all of that. Andthird is the resources that are available.43700:31:41.910 --> 00:31:45.630So we talked about the resources.It's important for us to do that,43800:31:45.829 --> 00:31:48.940for sure, right. Yeah.So, so our point, I think43900:31:48.980 --> 00:31:55.859is, is is pretty clear thatbiblically, we don't see that God ever44000:31:56.099 --> 00:32:02.009says don't confront evil or wickedness,don't confrol, front it boldly and don't44100:32:02.130 --> 00:32:10.650confront it by speaking about it unlessyou have provided for the needs of those44200:32:12.049 --> 00:32:16.319whom you are rebuking. He neversays that. Never that I can see.44300:32:17.480 --> 00:32:22.759And really our goal, and Ithink in likely Matt Chandler's goal,44400:32:23.079 --> 00:32:29.519is to stop abortion, to tohopefully hold people back from the destructive act44500:32:29.839 --> 00:32:36.509of abortion. Yeah, but meetingpeople's needs is never going to do that.44600:32:37.190 --> 00:32:43.190The only thing that is ultimately goingto end abortion, individually and as44700:32:43.269 --> 00:32:47.140a nation, is the Gospel.Right. And so then getting to the44800:32:47.220 --> 00:32:52.259end of that mean? It saysunless we provide for needs, we don't44900:32:52.539 --> 00:33:00.690fully understand the Gospel, and Iwould disagree with that statement. Yeah,45000:33:00.690 --> 00:33:05.529absolutely, because it does the Gospeltalk about. Like what is the Gospel,45100:33:05.569 --> 00:33:08.210Daniel, right? I mean Imentioned it earlier about the apostle.45200:33:08.250 --> 00:33:13.440Paul tells us with the Gospel thathe preached is, and he says it's45300:33:13.480 --> 00:33:15.680the Gospel in which we stand.Yeah, so the it's the Death Bury45400:33:15.720 --> 00:33:22.400Own resurrection of Jesus Preaching The Gospel. Now, just hear what I'm saying.45500:33:22.440 --> 00:33:25.240Don't hear what I'm not saying.Those you're listening preaching the Gospel does45600:33:25.400 --> 00:33:34.910not include meeting People's physical needs.Right now, meeting people's physical needs can45700:33:34.950 --> 00:33:40.500be a means to bring the Gospelto people, and meeting people's physical needs45800:33:42.140 --> 00:33:46.380is a necessary component of those whohave themselves receive the Gospel, like it's45900:33:46.380 --> 00:33:51.859going to be a natural outflow ofour hearts if we have something. You46000:33:51.940 --> 00:33:53.940know, John says it in FirstJohn. He says if you see your46100:33:54.019 --> 00:33:59.089brother in need and you don't meethis needs and you say well, go46200:33:59.250 --> 00:34:01.529and be warm and filled, thenthe love of God doesn't abide in you.46300:34:01.609 --> 00:34:07.529So obviously if you have something andyour brother needs it bread. If46400:34:07.569 --> 00:34:09.760you have bread, to loads ofbread, and somebody needs it and you46500:34:09.800 --> 00:34:14.840don't give it to him, thenthat's just evidence that you've not really understood46600:34:15.119 --> 00:34:17.119the Gospel, your Heart's not beenchanged, because the Gospel has to do46700:34:17.239 --> 00:34:22.079with us be rather than being aselfish person, becoming a selfless person,46800:34:22.199 --> 00:34:25.590because we see the selfless act thatthe son of God did about giving his46900:34:25.789 --> 00:34:32.110life on the cross for us.Yeah, but meeting people's physical needs is47000:34:32.190 --> 00:34:36.909a means to bring the Gospel topeople and to show them that we're genuine.47100:34:36.989 --> 00:34:39.300Right. It kind of I don'tsay it validates the Gospel. It47200:34:39.420 --> 00:34:45.139just validates those who are bringing theGospel. But the Gospel itself is very47300:34:45.179 --> 00:34:46.900simple. We make it so complex, to make it so hard. You47400:34:46.980 --> 00:34:50.500got to do this and you gotto do that, and you got to47500:34:50.579 --> 00:34:52.650say this and you got to saythat and you've got to have this program47600:34:52.769 --> 00:34:57.369in place and you've got to havethis other program in place, to the47700:34:57.409 --> 00:35:01.130point where, you know, ourchurches are full of social programs, children's47800:35:01.170 --> 00:35:05.809programs, youth programs, all theseprograms and we think, well, these47900:35:05.849 --> 00:35:09.159are what make up a church,and so a church has to have a48000:35:09.559 --> 00:35:14.920kids program youth program of Elderly PeopleProgram and all this in order to be48100:35:14.960 --> 00:35:17.360a church. No, to bea church you've got to be people who48200:35:17.400 --> 00:35:21.949are bought by the blood of Jesus, who've come into a relationship with Jesus48300:35:22.030 --> 00:35:25.510by the Gospel that's proclaiming God's wordand it has, you, Biblical leadership48400:35:25.550 --> 00:35:30.070and that sort of thing. It'sthe Gospel that's at the center of the48500:35:30.110 --> 00:35:35.150Church. It's not this, Ihate it. This, this this concept48600:35:35.230 --> 00:35:40.380of the Social Gospel. Yeah,it's it's so foreign to what the apostles48700:35:40.420 --> 00:35:45.820were preaching right in the New Testament, so foreign from what Jesus preached.48800:35:45.940 --> 00:35:50.449Now again, please don't hear whatI'm not what I'm not saying. I'm48900:35:50.489 --> 00:35:53.090not saying we shouldn't meet People's physicalneeds. I'm just saying that that's not49000:35:53.610 --> 00:35:58.650part of the Gospels. Never,let's the outflow correct. It is is49100:35:58.769 --> 00:36:00.130never, at least seem to God, with the Gospel. Now, yeah,49200:36:00.210 --> 00:36:04.960it is never linked and and that'swhat I think the meme does.49300:36:05.119 --> 00:36:12.000That's damaging. It links the abilityto confront evil and the in fact the49400:36:12.079 --> 00:36:16.880command to confront evil with a SocialJustice Program Yeah, and and the Gospel49500:36:17.039 --> 00:36:22.469just doesn't say that, right.We are to confront evil word, to49600:36:22.989 --> 00:36:28.949convict people of sin, where toonce they're convicted of sin, to talk49700:36:28.949 --> 00:36:32.940about the just penalty for sin,once they understand that, to talk about49800:36:34.219 --> 00:36:38.500how repentant and submission of a lifeto Jesus Christ, who died to pay49900:36:38.579 --> 00:36:45.300the penalty for their sin, andthat when he rose again, he conquered50000:36:45.380 --> 00:36:49.610death and showed that he was God. Yeah, and the Holy Spirit enters50100:36:49.690 --> 00:36:53.409and dwells us. And we areto go and make disciples of the world,50200:36:54.409 --> 00:37:00.289not through social programs, right,but through continuing to preach that really50300:37:00.369 --> 00:37:05.199pretty simple message. Yeah, thatis it's very simple message. And you50400:37:05.320 --> 00:37:07.719know, we believe that's why wesay that's why this is the Gospel Center50500:37:07.800 --> 00:37:10.920pro life podcast. This is whywe say as a ministry, Cities for50600:37:12.000 --> 00:37:16.269Life is a Gospel Centered Ministry.Is because we believe it's the Gospel that50700:37:16.429 --> 00:37:21.550changes a mother's heart. Right,it's not just, you know, the50800:37:21.670 --> 00:37:24.949idea of social programs that's going tochange your heart. It's going to show50900:37:25.030 --> 00:37:30.219her that abortion isn't is an optionin the sight of God, but it's51000:37:30.460 --> 00:37:34.860God, by his spirit, cominginto her heart, change in her heart51100:37:35.380 --> 00:37:39.059and showing her her need for him. She surrenders to him. Now it51200:37:39.940 --> 00:37:44.369never is that. You know,we goose. We've been accused of this.51300:37:44.929 --> 00:37:47.050You ask, you tell people.Unless you ask Jesus into your life,51400:37:47.090 --> 00:37:50.369right, unless you get saved,lets you become a Christian, we51500:37:50.409 --> 00:37:52.329won't help you. That's not true, right, because we do have help.51600:37:52.449 --> 00:37:55.650We do have, as I talkedabout earlier, all kinds of resources51700:37:55.769 --> 00:38:00.079and stuff. So I mean itwould make no sense for us not to51800:38:00.199 --> 00:38:05.719help an atheist, someone who remainedan atheist, with the practical resources,51900:38:05.760 --> 00:38:07.760because that's another opportunity for us toshare the Gospel. Right, and as52000:38:07.800 --> 00:38:10.320we're giving out if we're doing ababy shower, we have a baby shower52100:38:10.360 --> 00:38:14.469ministry. We do a baby shower, we're proclaiming the Gospel right now.52200:38:14.510 --> 00:38:16.230Doesn't mean the whole time. We'retalking about sin and we're talking about Jesus,52300:38:16.269 --> 00:38:21.469Death Bearing resurrection, but we areclearly presenting the Gospel, not just52400:38:21.630 --> 00:38:23.869in given her baby stuff and sayingJesus loves you. We are laying out52500:38:24.070 --> 00:38:28.980the Gospel that the Bible tells usis the Gospel. Yep, we're talking52600:38:29.019 --> 00:38:31.780about sin, we're talking about theneed for righteousness. We're talking about the52700:38:31.860 --> 00:38:35.739need to turn to the Lord Jesusand put your faith in him. That's52800:38:35.739 --> 00:38:38.059right, that's right. And andif they don't, we take back off52900:38:38.099 --> 00:38:40.690a gift. Yeah, that's whatyou're going to give them. Give us53000:38:40.730 --> 00:38:44.969that stuff back. I'm going togive it to somebody who will said Jesus,53100:38:45.650 --> 00:38:49.889that's that's ridiculous, that's absurd.Right, but everything we do needs53200:38:49.889 --> 00:38:53.889to be seasoned with the Gospel andour motivation is, you know, one53300:38:53.969 --> 00:38:58.679preacher said, you know, ifyou bake someone a cake and you give53400:38:58.760 --> 00:39:00.400them a cake and you do itout of the love of your heart and53500:39:00.559 --> 00:39:05.159loving your heart and your love forJesus, and you just leaving with a53600:39:05.239 --> 00:39:07.159cake and you're not sharing the Gospelwith them, you've sent them to hell53700:39:07.280 --> 00:39:12.269with a cake. And Yeah,good is that? Yeah, a lot53800:39:12.349 --> 00:39:19.989of our Social Gospel sort of preachingand this motivation. And again, I'm53900:39:20.070 --> 00:39:22.150not saying we shouldn't have social programs. I mean if you look at the54000:39:22.829 --> 00:39:28.820you know all the things over theyears in Christian history, the things that54100:39:28.900 --> 00:39:32.059have been birthed out of Christianity,you almost can't name. You know,54200:39:32.099 --> 00:39:37.219I've in challenge. Atheist named forme five organizations that help poor people,54300:39:37.659 --> 00:39:40.610and I would bet you at leastthree of those five are Christian or rooted54400:39:40.650 --> 00:39:45.610in Christianity. So almost all humanitarianday is it's a Christian so that's float54500:39:45.650 --> 00:39:50.409out of an innocence, a naturaloutflow. But this idea that you know,54600:39:50.489 --> 00:39:53.840this Social Gospel, is the Gospelis, is again completely foreign to54700:39:54.199 --> 00:39:59.599the biblical concept of proclaiming the GospelRight, right, and so you know,54800:39:59.639 --> 00:40:04.159we are called to bring to bearthe truth of who Jesus is and54900:40:04.519 --> 00:40:08.110to give people an opportunity, byappealing to to them by the Holy Spirit,55000:40:08.190 --> 00:40:12.230to turn to the Lord Jesus.And don't shrink back from the fact55100:40:12.230 --> 00:40:14.829that if you're a believer, theHoly Spirit and dwells you and, like55200:40:14.909 --> 00:40:19.989we said earlier, guide you inall righteousness. And you do know wickedness,55300:40:20.230 --> 00:40:22.340you do know right, you doknow right from wrong, you do55400:40:22.579 --> 00:40:29.820know evil and you are called byGod to rescue those that are on a55500:40:29.860 --> 00:40:32.579path of destruction. And how canyou do it if you don't name evil,55600:40:32.739 --> 00:40:36.570call it what it is? Yeah, and then rescue those on that55700:40:36.690 --> 00:40:39.250terrible path. Yeah, absolutely,it's what we're called to do. It's55800:40:39.250 --> 00:40:43.969what the church is called to do. We're called to proclaim the Gospel,55900:40:44.050 --> 00:40:47.489to make disciples of all nations,as the Scripture says, right. And56000:40:47.969 --> 00:40:52.000you know, if we have themeans to meet practical needs, we don't56100:40:52.000 --> 00:40:57.599do because it's the Gospel, wedo it because it's a natural outflow of56200:40:58.000 --> 00:41:01.079who we are, what God hasdone in us. Yeah, and you56300:41:01.199 --> 00:41:05.550know, and I want to encourageall you guys who are listening who maybe56400:41:05.630 --> 00:41:07.150this is a barrier to you,maybe thinking, you know, I can't56500:41:07.150 --> 00:41:10.070meet this need, I can't dothat, I can't do this that.56600:41:10.429 --> 00:41:15.070You know what, through that aside, abortion is murder. Yeah, you56700:41:15.230 --> 00:41:20.099have a voice. Those babies thatare murdered. Don't Goole in your voice56800:41:20.500 --> 00:41:24.019right now. I get it,because some folks a barrier to them as56900:41:24.019 --> 00:41:28.019they see some of the some ofthe other folks who are involved at abortion57000:41:28.059 --> 00:41:31.820clinics or abortion ministry that are justpretty pretty nasty about it. You know,57100:41:31.889 --> 00:41:35.730we've got a guy locally we mayhave mentioned, who, you know,57200:41:36.130 --> 00:41:37.969stands in front of the abortion clinicand just yells about murder and it's57300:41:37.969 --> 00:41:42.010just it's over the top. It'snot helpful. So I get it.57400:41:42.090 --> 00:41:44.090Maybe that's a barrier to some ofyou people. You don't want to be57500:41:44.090 --> 00:41:46.130associated with that. I get it. Understand that. And that's a question57600:41:46.199 --> 00:41:50.360of tone. Yeah, I thinkmore than anything, more than the message,57700:41:50.360 --> 00:41:52.239even more than the words, isthe tone and and the and the57800:41:52.559 --> 00:41:59.119motivation behind it. If if yourmotivation and your tone is angry and condemning,57900:41:59.559 --> 00:42:01.309that that's not what we're talking about. But Ye, say confront sin.58000:42:01.510 --> 00:42:06.110Yeah, yeah, can confront sin, as Jesus did just matter of58100:42:06.150 --> 00:42:07.949factly, this is right, thisis wrong. Turn from it. Yeah,58200:42:08.030 --> 00:42:10.309absolutely. Yeah. So, youknow, I get that. They're58300:42:10.349 --> 00:42:14.550all kinds of barriers and when thefuture will talk about some more of those58400:42:14.590 --> 00:42:16.860barriers. We talk about, andwe have before, about the what we58500:42:16.980 --> 00:42:22.380believe biblically's the proper tone, andthink things that say that you can say58600:42:22.420 --> 00:42:25.980that are really helpful. But thisidea that, you know, you have58700:42:27.059 --> 00:42:29.699to meet everybody's needs, or youhave to have social programs, you have58800:42:29.820 --> 00:42:32.889to be willing to you know,whatever you know, people think they need58900:42:32.929 --> 00:42:37.289to be willing to do in orderto speak out against murder of children.59000:42:37.730 --> 00:42:40.369It's just it's just a misconception.That's wrong and you know, I think59100:42:40.409 --> 00:42:45.280in this sense. You know,if I could have a conversation with Matt59200:42:45.320 --> 00:42:47.079Chandler, I would let him knowI hate hey man, will this back59300:42:47.119 --> 00:42:51.960a little bit because because it canbe a barrier for people right and because59400:42:51.960 --> 00:42:54.800he's got some good messages about abortion, powerful messages. He's got a big59500:42:54.840 --> 00:42:59.389church there that you know he's notholding back the truth. It is not59600:42:59.590 --> 00:43:01.190justifying a portion, which is awesome. Yeah, I'm encouraged by some of59700:43:01.230 --> 00:43:06.510the stuff I hear from him andappreciate the brother what I know of him.59800:43:07.070 --> 00:43:09.630And and so we're not saying don'tlisten to him anymore. We're just59900:43:10.030 --> 00:43:14.659springboard and off of that to helpyou guys. Hopefully this was a blessing60000:43:14.699 --> 00:43:16.699to you guys. You got anythingelse you want to touch on? Pretty60100:43:16.739 --> 00:43:20.219much, though. Okay, prettymuch everything. I yeah. Well,60200:43:20.300 --> 00:43:22.139great. Well, we hope youguys were blessed by this podcast. Hope60300:43:22.179 --> 00:43:25.579you're blessed by our other podcast.We hope that you guys will share these60400:43:25.699 --> 00:43:30.210podcasts. We're trying to put outcontent. We put out a podcast every60500:43:30.250 --> 00:43:32.570week Thursday morning. We were doingWednesday morning. It's just a lot easier60600:43:32.610 --> 00:43:36.329for me to put them out onThursday mornings. So I do that and60700:43:37.250 --> 00:43:38.929hope you guys are blessed and hopeyou're blessed enough to share it. Leave60800:43:38.969 --> 00:43:46.000us a review in apple podcasts APPor in the Google podcast APP or wherever60900:43:46.039 --> 00:43:50.639you listen to podcasts, and letus know what you think. You reach61000:43:50.679 --> 00:43:52.800out to me, reach out toVicki. Let us know if there's some61100:43:52.840 --> 00:43:55.510subjects you want us to cover,if there's something we may be just kind61200:43:55.550 --> 00:43:58.829of went over real quickly and youwant to get in more in depth.61300:43:58.909 --> 00:44:01.389We'd love to hear those suggestions fromyou. I'M D parks at cities for61400:44:01.469 --> 00:44:06.230lifecom. She's V Cosi Org.That's her email address. We cost you61500:44:06.309 --> 00:44:09.340work at cities for lifecom. Asalways, you can visit our wwe bea61600:44:09.579 --> 00:44:14.820dot sidewalks, the number four lifecomwebsite, where we post a lot of61700:44:14.860 --> 00:44:20.300articles and things about what we talkedabout on the podcast and sidewalk counseling and61800:44:20.420 --> 00:44:22.699so anyway, we hope you guyswere blessed. I hope you have a61900:44:22.820 --> 00:44:38.639good week and, God bless giveme our love for love, give me62000:44:39.400 --> 00:44:52.639our love for gratitude. I knowit will cost me my life. Nothing's62100:44:52.800 --> 00:44:54.389too precious and some met you