Showering Moms Who Choose Life - Interview with Sheryl Chandler from Truth and Mercy Ministry

0:00 I Am Yours, I am yours, I am yours. Send Me, Lord. I welcome to the Gospel Center pro life podcast. In this episode we do an interview with Sheryl Chandler from Truth and mercy ministries about how to Minister to a mom's practical needs as well as Minister The Gospel. Stay tuned, Lord. I felt show passis touch your heart. Welcome to the Gospel Center pro life podcast. Appreciate you guys listening to this podcast. Appreciate if you guys would share this podcast with your friends and let folks know that we're doing these episodes and we're doing these episodes. We're gearing these episodes toward people who are really on the front lines, people who are, like us, at the abortion center's reaching out, but also to pregnancy centers and others in other types of ministry that touch the issue of life and the reach out to women that are considering abortions. So just share these podcasts. Let folks know just some of the things that you've been blessed by. Let us know.

1:07 Reach out to me, D parks at cities for Lifecom you can let me know what you think of the podcast. Some episode ideas that you have so you can reach out to Vicky at Vicossi Oorg at cities for lifecom. Let's jump into this episode. We have a special guest with us, Ms Caryl Chandler, who's with truth and mercy ministries. We've worked alongside with them. They've worked alongside with us since cities for life got started. Cheryl has been in ministry. She just told me thirty two years truth and mercy ministries, but she's been in prolife work for a long time. I think we can really glean a lot of wisdom from her and she's just got a unique perspective as it comes to the Ministry of reaching out of these MOMS after they've chosen life and doing baby showers. And she's done many baby showers for moms that have chosen life here in Charlotte and beyond. And so, Ryl, just introduce yourself real quick. I've already kind of introduced you, but your Ryl Chandler, truth and mercy ministries. What else you want to add to that?

2:00 Your mom, you're yes, hi, Daniel and Vickie. I'm so happy to be here. Thank you for inviting me. It's really an honor to be with you today. Yeah, I live here in Charlotte, okay, and have since one thousand nine hundred and eighty three. Long Time. I have two kids and they're both grown now. One got married this past summer, Bethany. She's twenty two and she's now a nurse at Du Hospital. Graduated College last May. And my son, Nathan is nineteen. He's a business major at you and see Charlotte. Wow, great, and my husband is Doug. We've been married, Oh gosh, thirty four years. I think I can't do that math. Thirty four years, thirty four and a half, I think. Yes, yeah, cool. And so you've been truth and mercy ministries. has been going on for how long? Well, truth and mercy will get into that in the story a little bit.

2:50 I officially named the Ministry Truth and mercy just back in I think, two thousand six, okay, so not that long. But I started in pro life ministry back in one thousand nine hundred and eighty eight, okay, October of eighty eight. So it'll be thirty two years in just a couple of weeks. Yeah. Well, without beating around the Bush, let's get right into that because I want to hear some of your history in the pro life movement and just how you got involved with what you're doing now. Okay. Well, everyone's got a backstory, including the women who come to the clinic for abortion services, and they, like I, are typically dragging a trail of brokenness behind them. My family life as a young child, in a teen really involved a whole lot of brokenness in my family. We were a church going family my whole life and I knew a lot about God, but I did not know God and and all the brokenness and trauma of my family caused me personally, as a girl, to never want marriage or family of my own. I was miserable as a kid and I did not want to continue that family misery into my adult life. And so I really embrace the sexual revolution that I grew up in in the S and I was raised on the feminist wave of the S and I got most of my moral instruction, unfortunately, from magazines like glammor magazine, Mademoiselle Vogue, and these are really godless rags that I caution anyone and everyone within the sound of my voice from

4:25 consuming. Yeah, they led me to very dark and very, very damaging places. So you can just suffice it to say that back in the S and S I was very pro choice. It's just all I knew. And just to put a little, I guess, timeline where your listeners can know, I just turned fifty nine last week, so this was back in the s and you let me tag a timeline again. Rov Wade was decided in one thousand nine hundred and seventy three right. So I had a lot of godless views and a lot of godless ideas and I remembered defending them in freshman composition papers in college, and God help my professor who had to read through all of them. But thankfully the Lord pursued me and saved me when I was twenty years old. I was a junior in college, and he used a wonderful campus ministry and some wonderful believers to draw me to himself and he radically saved me, he really did. And the pro choice stance though it was, was it took a little while for that to fall it took a couple of years, I would say, for that to fall away. But fast forward. I graduated in one nineteen eighty three and I moved here to Charlotte for a job in my field of graphic design and I was growing in the Lord, I was active in church, I was making a lot of strides with with God and Um I met my husband, Doug. He was a native Carolinian and we married in eighty six. And in the summer of

5:59 one thousand nine hundred and eighty eight I started hearing the national news about Operation Rescue and this was a pro life movement where Christians peacefully put their physical bodies between the killers inside the clinic and the victims outside the clinic, and this made sense to me. This was the first pro life ministry action activity that made so much sense to me. And they blocked the doors. They risk or rest for second degree trespass and the whole movement was based on proverbs eleven, which says rescue those unjustly sentenced to death, don't stand back and let them die. And blocking the doors bought time for sidewalk counselors to reach the women and talk to the women and offer help and hope. So this made a lot of sense to me. As Charlotte Group organized and I was on fire and that was October eighty eight. That was my start and I've been involved ever since. I have personally blocked the doors and I've been arrested thirteen times. I've served jail time for each of those arrests. I I always refused to pay the fines. That was always an option. You could pay a fine and not go to jail, but I refused to pay a fine because I thought the whole system is correct up. I'm not paying into it.

7:19 Yeah, but mostly during that time I was sidebot counseling and I side got counseled from one thousand nine hundred and eighty eight to even now, although now I do very little of it, and we'll get to the reason for that, but I trained a lot of early sidelock counselors. For several years our group would hold rescues, we would block doors about four times a year. Those were kind of big rescue events. But every other week, every other weekend, we were sidebok counseling and what we call piccoting at that time, and I'll get to the reason why we call it picketing. Our did. So that's a little background. Yeah. So, yeah, just for you guys who are listening, we did it. We did it episode sometime ago about civil disobedience and how some of that fits into our Christian worldview and biblically. So we won't Labor that point. One of the things I will say is that folks like you and flip, which we did an interview with, and others, even folks that the volunteer with us now, who were involved in the rescue movement, really plowed the ground, really made the way for what we're doing here in Charlotte. We're not doing, obviously, the rescues anymore, but it really did plow the ground it it really didn't make the way and stirred up the church and got people's attention toward the issue of abortion and really, I think, made a shift because for a long time it seems like the the issue of abortion and being at an abortion clink intervening

8:50 like that was just sort of it. It was a Catholic thing. Yeah, but really the rescues brought the Evangelical Church and so I mean, you can tell me if I'm wrong, but it seems like just in me reading some of the history with that brought the Evangelical Church to the forefront of this battle and really, Hey, this is our battle because this is this is on the Lord's heart. These babies matter to him. Minister in the Gospel there in that context is important to the heart of God. So am I correct and all of that, and just really in the rescue movement bringing the Evangelical Church along from your view, I think so. That would be my assessment as well, although rescue did involve many Catholics. Yeah, they were part of it too, but it did, I think, wake up the Protestant Church. Yeah, so we could go on for hours for like king should do a whole other podcast on all that. I didn't even know all of that about you, but but we're at what point did you start what I do know of you, which is truth and mercy and and becoming involved in baby showers? How did that evolve, and I would love to hear about how your unique perspective of baby showers, because yours is not at all the typical baby shower. I love your approach and I love your philosophy behind why you approach baby showers the way that you do. So how did that all about? Well, as you know, I began it's just a typical sidewalk counselor. We were kind of weak in warriors. For Two decks I showered many of the moms who I met and kept up with, but each time I showered a mom I had to start from scratch to collect baby items

10:24 for each mom because I didn't have any supply stored. I didn't have a storage unit, I didn't have anything like that, so I just kind of started from the beginning. Facebook wasn't around back then. That means so bad. That's my next day that I this was way before social media. This was we didn't use chisels and stones, but we did. I didn't even have voicemail and answering machine on my personal phone at home at this time. I didn't even have email. So I mean it was literally making call after call after call after call to people I thought might have a crib they were finished with or a car seat or something like that, and those people made calls to so it did spread out. It wasn't just me making them, but but the responsibility felt to me to make sure each thing, you know, was was met, each need was met. So it was way before any of the conveniences of communication that we have now. And can I just ask so would there's so many needs of the moms that we meet who are coming to kill their baby. The baby shower was that. How did that become such a an important need or did you see that as that was critical and a turning point for some of these moms that you met it? It was a turning point for some and, like I said, I didn't shower very many, maybe three or four year at this early stage, like back in Eighty Eight, eight ninety, just maybe three or four because each time it was he was a huge endeavor each time to get and they weren't as

11:56 lavish as they are now by any stretch. They were just kind of what I could collect and patch together. But I just over the years of sidewalk counseling, keeping up with MOMS, you know, that maybe had their baby a couple of years ago, just keeping up with them, I just saw the need more and more and more and more clearly that the Gospel was what they really needed. Yeah, right, you know, because because sin patterns are not broken easily. I'm they're not broken in my life easily and they're certainly not broken in their life. So it was just became more and more and more apparent how critical the Gospel was and I saw the baby shower is another opportunity to get in front of these women and share the Gospel. It was just it was kind of an ulterior motive, to be honest. It was like, if I can lure them with gifts and and it's what they needed, they were happy to come. Nobody was ever forced to come, but it was just a way to meet the need and and their true spiritual need, which is their greatest need, far more than you know. They need the gospel far more than they need a crib, and they need a crib pretty bad. They got to have a car seat to have a you know, to have the baby. And so is it. Basically, it works this way. Unless they except Jesus, you don't give them a crib.

13:11 Is that? We're told that. So, yeah, I told that. Absolutely absolutely. What you do are jump through our religious who's you get nothing. Of course, not right, but it is the means to to show them the tangible love of God and an opportunity to share the gospel. I mean we're doing that on the sidewalk and we talk to them, we're even the Gospel and everything we're doing, but there's another opportunity to present the Gospel and give them the ability to respond to the Gospel. And you're going to share some stories I'm sure. But Do Women Respond to the Gospel in that way? Have you had ladies respond to the Gospel? Yes, I know because we've. We've heard plenty of testimonies. Were moms and been involved.

13:52 Vicki, you've been to some of those baby showers yourself where MOMS surrender their lives to the Lord. And we know the Gospel is what changes hearts, not not cribs and right those things are practical means to show the love of God, but it's ultimately the power of the Gospel that changes those hearts. And that's why I appreciate what you do so much, because in some of these not I'm not trying to point out any ministry in particular, I don't have one in mind, but I do know just in general, a lot of these kind of helps and mercy ministries are viewed almost is just humanitarian efforts and the Gospel is not really presented. People say, well, you know, they know that, you know I love them and that's the best thing. What yeah, they should know that you love them and baking somebody K yeah, that should show the love. But if you're not going to share the Gospel with them and you're not going to meet their most pressing need.

14:37 Your kind of your kind. I just given them a baby shower and, you know, kind of putting springs on the wagon on their way to hell if you're not sharing the gospel. Yeah, and so my experience as I first met you, is, okay, I've been to many baby showers and here I'm invited to go because was a mom that I had worked with and I was invited to go to your baby shower and I'm expecting you a party, I'm expecting balloons and cake and decorations and oodles of people. Well, your shower was not that at all. There were let a whole lavish room filled with gifts. I mean not lavish room, lavish gifts. The room was filled with gifts. But you were very clear to me privately, and I think and how you developed your showers, that this was not necessarily a celebration. It was a celebration of that new life. I remember you telling me this and being so impressed. It was a celebration of the new life and the choice for life, but you were very careful not to be celebrating the lifestyle, life choices and immorality and rebellion from God that led them to this place where they were in their life, and so I'd love to hear how that came about. Did was that immediately what you were thinking?

16:00 I have to be careful about how this is presented. I did. I I didn't want to celebrate Sind Right. I wanted to honor the woman for making the right choice and doing the very hard thing. I wanted to honor her, I wanted to encourage her, I wanted to meet her need, but I didn't want to celebrate her situation. So it's a fine line, you know, to draw. It really is, and it's a very delicate tension and my whole minute, the whole ministry, name which I'll get to in a minute, is is a tension. Yeah, Biblical tension that we all experience. You guys experience it every day on the sidewalks. But I do want to honor and encourage her and meet her needs and, you know, show her the love of God, the mercy of God, but I also want to bring truth right to the table as well, and that's the tension between truth and mercy. Yeah, since expand on that a little bit, though, because truth and mercy, that that's the the real theme of the Gospel, of course, but it's the theme of Your Ministry. So expand on that and how that name came about. was there a point in which she said Hey, this, this should be called Truth and mercy?

17:19 There was. I was vacuuming one day. Really, honestly, I've been praying about a name for a long time because for years, for probably two decades, I didn't have a ministry name. I operated under action Lee for life. I operated under UM operations, save America. I was doing showers kind of under their banner. Yeah, a little bit, but when it became very apparent I needed my own storage units, I was going to have to raise my own money for that and I had to have my own name. And this was a huge step for me, a big step because all those years I started, you know, like I said, I had to start from scratch for every shower I did with baby items, and then I started kind of storing stuff in my garage, I started storing stuff in friends basements, I started storing stuff in friends addicts and every shower I did I had to go collect everything all around the city, drive all around the city, picking through and I had to keep like an inventory of what was where and it was very, very, very time consuming and I remember crying out to the Lord I could do so many more showers God if I could just be more efficient with this time. And he just really led me delicately, because it was I was fighting. I was like, I do not want to have to raise money. I am a terrible salesperson, if you will.

18:38 I could not sell a heat or to an ESKIMO. I would say you don't really need this, you're okay. I really it would be very hard for me. So I told God, I said Okay, God, I'll do it, but you've got to make the fundraising part really easy and really quick, because I am afraid of it. I'm scared of it. And and so now I did name the ministry truth and mercy based on one of my favorite scriptures from Psalm ten, and it was just coincidentally, I'll say, it was in my scripture reading this morning. So I was really encouraged by that. Psalm five ten says love, loving, kindness and truth have met together, righteousness and peace have kissed each other. This is a prophetic verse about Jesus and his Ministry to to reconcile God's truth, his Justice, his law, his wrath against sin and his mercy. And on the cross these two things came together in perfect reconciliation and they kissed on the Cross.

19:47 So this is the tension of the ministry and you too know it well. When you're sharing the gospel with someone, when you're pleading with them not to, you know, destroy their child, you've got to walk this tension between how hard do I hit truth and how, you know, how much mercy do I express? It's very much attention. And they're very opposing things. Yeah, they're very opposing things. Only Jesus can bring them together perfectly. And I named the Ministry Truth and mercy because it reflects my dependence on God. Yes, I cannot do need the Holy Spirit to walk that tight rope of truth and mercy. I'll read it from the new King James Version, which is probably the initial version. Probably got it from the King James, which is mercy and truth have met together, righteousness and peace have kissed M and that's really from what I've seen from the ministry, that God is using you to do that. That's what happens and from what I've seen, by God's grace on the sidewalk we're seeing mercy and truth come together. We're seeing these two really, like you said, opposing ideas come together. And of course it's a natural fit with the Lord that truth and mercy come together.

20:59 But in the minds of human beings, just in our human frailties, we can't reconcile. How can God be a god of Wrath and justice and judgment but also be merciful and patient and kind? Well, it's who he is and you do do well as you explain this to these mothers. I know my wife has been in some of those, those times where you've done the baby showers and Vicki's as as to I have haven't had I've come and brought some items before to a baby shower, but I haven't had the pleasure of sitting in account. Might be kind of Awkur. Came to one that Vicky was at and you prayed with them. They had specifically asked for a pastor. Yeah, you're right, I did. Right, yeah, I remember that that one. I think the gifts were already opened by then. Yeah, but you came and you counseled and you encouraged and prayed with them all. Yeah, I remember that. Now it's you bring that up.

21:44 Yes, blessed, that one was at my house. I remember that. Yeah, yeah, that's right. That's right, because it's so easy to be too much of one and not enough of the other, and I think that's where so many Christian endeavors fail. Too much truth, too much hard hitting on the justice and not enough of that love and mercy, and then Budd to loving and merciful without sharing the hard truth, they'll just end right back up where they started. That's right. So I consider the truth part of the ministry to be what you guys are doing on the sidewalk, your you're saying you know that abortion is wrong. Yeah, it hates this.

22:26 Yeah, you cannot destroy your child, this is against God's holy law. Yeah, this is truth. And you know their response would be my body, my choice. But we would say from scripture, you know you, you're not your own. You were bought with a price. Glorify God in your body. That's what scripture says. So we counter that with truth. And then the mercy side, once you know by the holy spirits power they have softened their heart and turn their heart to their child and let their child live. The mercy side is then shown at the shower where God's provision and his love and his care is just lavishly displayed with all these gifts. And I have to tell your listeners that these gifts I are really quite lavish.

23:11 They're beautiful. Now, most of most of the things I give ar gently used, but I am very, very careful to make sure everything is clean, everything is in working order, everything is well taking care of, just gently used, in great condition. They're in beautiful bags. You put their names on on the beautiful tags, so that every single gift is presented to them by name, in a similar way as God presents the the gift of his free gift to us with Our Name. Our Name is on it. I am a little OCD yes about the gift tax. I spend a lot of time just making sure that each gift bag and each free standing item like a swing or a CARCI right has a gift tag on it. There their custom they have the mom's name on them and they have the ministry name.

24:03 They have a scripture, a blessing, and I just want them to make sure that they know the gifts are for them. Personally. Yeah, from the Lord and I am always you know this, Vitie, I'm always quick to say really at the very beginning, right, really, almost verbatim, I say these gifts reflect God's love and mercy and care and provision for you. I want the woman is lavish love, right. I remember you saying that, always so impressed by it. Yeah, I want, when I tell her, when you see this lavish displaying, I want you to see a very small expression of God's lavish love for you, his care for you. Yeah, that's what I want the gifts to reflect and represent. So I take it very seriously that these gifts represent the love and mercy of God.

24:49 So I want him to be represented well with quality items and and really nice things. And they do. They get two years worth of clothes, two years worth of toys, you know, from all stages up from zero to two books, bibs, car seat, strollers, swings, everything you can imagine. I mean it's, I call it, from bibs to cribs. It's the whole thing. Yeah, the whole kitten Kaboodle. So sometimes for their siblings as well. I know I've seen you always ask about the siblings and you try to provide, if possible, some things for the siblings. I do, I have. I keep some toys on hand that are probably, you know, a little older, and even the few older clothes so I can I can give gifts to siblings to because I don't want them to feel left out. How do moms respond when you say those words?

25:38 This represents the lavish love of God, and I want you, as you look around this room, I still you say it, like you said verbatim every time I've been to the shower. I won't as you look around this room and you see this, I want you to see the love of God. Well, many are moved to tears. Yes, they really are. They many are. And then some words, but but many are. I think it's a I think it's a beautiful thing. I think it's one of the most poignant parts. Yeah, shower is really the surprise. When they walk in, right, they gasp and say they can't believe it. Yes, yeah, they really do. It's really beautiful. The gifts are all in you know, colorful gift bags that match. Most of them are either blue or pink or and the tissue shoe and the tags and all. It's really quite a nice display, I think. Yeah, I've actually delivered a few of those baby showers and had a I'm like, man, I don't know if I can fit all this on my vehicle. That's all. That's a lot of stuff. It is a lot, but it's not like it's not needed. I mean these MOMS are very thankful. Can I ask you a question that occurs to me because we have so many new missionaries coming on sidebock missionaries. What would you cautioned them as they're starting a baby shower ministry?

26:52 Just in terms of what you do, and I don't mean to stump you with this question, but you do something that is different in from a typical baby shower. I would caution kind of you were alluding to it earlier about not thinking your job is to be a friend. I mean we do need to be a friend, but what we've said, we've already said it here, that the job is to share the gospel and to disciple. Yeah, and to call out sin if need be. Now there's kind ways to do that and there's some kind ways. Obviously I'm I'm encouraging the kind ways, you know, and that's that tension. We are always walking that tension, working with that tension. But I I don't have showers with cake and Punch and parties and party games and all of that. If I can help it. Now I have. I have if I've been discipling a woman all along or I know her mentor has, I'm a little more relaxed to do a party. But I don't typically want to have a party because for several reasons. One, the woman invites all her family and friends and then I come in and I've got literally thousands of dollars worth of gifts, right, and they're like who is she? And Yeah, why is she giving you all this stuff? Yeah, then the woman is going to have to revisit her near abortion, how I came into her life, what the connection is, and I don't think she's going to want to do that. So I'm trying to help her see that. No, you really don't want to party because of this reason. Yeah, and then a second reason is I want

28:26 to share the gospel and that's really hard to do in a big group setting. Now, I have done it in a group setting, but it's really much better one on one in a more personal, private setting. And so what I typically do, I don't do decorations usually, and I don't do cake and punch. What I do because I'm bringing all these gifts and trust me, that is a lot of work and if I have to add decorations and food to that, it's kind of puts me over the edge sometimes. So what I like to do is have a shower. It takes about an hour and a half, two hours to open all the gifts and then I like to take them out to lunch, yeah, or dinner, whatever meal is appropriate at the time, and then I like to share the gospel over the meal. And I'm very intentional about it and it's tempting to just not do it because it it's awkward. Making that transition from Baby Chit Chat, names and all that kind of stuff to Gospel is sometimes challenge most times challenging, but I'm very after all the work I did for the shower, I'm pretty committed to making sure that this happens. So we shared over the over the meal. But what it's not to say she's got to come alone.

29:40 I always encourage her to invite a close friend or a sister, mom, the boyfriend or husband or whatever. I mean. I'm happy to have a couple of others come as well, and then a sidewalk counselor like you, Vicky, have been to many of them. Whoever initially met her or if she has a love life, mentor the mint is welcome to come. So it's typically, you know, six, seven people at the most. Right. Yeah, they're pretty awesome. I remember one where a woman came to the Lord in Denny's. Was it? She is. Yeah, she would had been a former drug addict. It was in something like that we have. Yeah, yeah, I think it was denny's, I remember. Yeah, I know which one you're talking yeah, she's still following God and she's doing a she's doing well. Yeah, well, let's get into to some of those stories. Yeah, because you've got a lot of experience you.

30:36 I mean, how many baby showers if we done over the years, like Kajillian's? I don't know, maybe enough time that math. I A lot, a real lie. mean the first many years, you know, I was probably first, maybe eighteen years, I was probably only doing three, four, five six a year, so not that many. But the last twelve since official, since getting storage units and getting a name, I've I do about twenty five to thirty a year, which is a lot. So we're talking every other weekend almost. Yeah, so it's a lot. And and so I do have three storage units now. I started out which is one little one and it grew and grew and grew and I have three quite large ones now that are pretty well organized. Not as well as I would like, but but that's when people say you have three units, that's it is expensive and that's my major ministry expense. But when you think about it, I mean think about thirty cribs a year. Think about thirty car seats, thirty swings, thirty bathtubs, thirty mattresses. Yeah, all of that.

31:41 I mean thirty betting sets and all the clothes. I mean every woman gets about, I don't know, about three hundred outfits of clothes, at least I don't know. Do Six Times twelve? What's that? Knows? Oh, come on, don't at Daniel and for sure don't answer me. Six comes twelve, seventy two. Okay, good. Yeah, they're getting probably about a hundred and thirty outfits a year. It really is thousands of dollars with it really is. It's a life stuff. Yeah, so it just it takes a lot of room and it's It's a Pretty Well oiled machine. The ministry is, but most of it is is a lot of grunt work. I'm doing a lot of cleaning, I'm doing a lot of driving, picking up donations, organizing. I spent like four hours in storage yesterday just, you know, yeah, putting stuff in and out and organizing and that kind of thing. So it's a lot of worm. He's hot in the summer, is hot in my little tin storaging. It's in the winner it's cold, just like you guys on the streets. Maybe it's hot and it's cold. Yeah, so tell us some of those stories, which maybe maybe let's start with the we know there's highs and lows in any ministry.

32:50 Maybe will end on a good note and maybe you could tell us about some of the sad or hard things that you've been countered. Yeah, because the case, there's this kind of notion because we share stories, we share them on social media. Yeah, there's this sort of notion that you know, all the stories are great, that they all go fantastic, and you know, in the light of who God is and the fact that the Gospel is being presented in all of these stories, it's always a good it's always God is winning. God wins. As long as we're on his side, we win. Right. But the reality of ministry is sometimes more difficult than people would really believe. And for someone like yourself that have been in ministry for thirty two years and really done some hard stuff, people need to come to terms with the reality. The ministries tough and if nothing else to know, hey, pray for Cheryl, pray for pray for Vicky on the sidewalk, pray for me is we're minister on the sidewalk, because these these stories are difficult and they are waity, but God's graces sufficient. So yeah, I'd share a share a story struggle and we get some prayer warriors from the podcast where you well, I'll just touch on this. One of the most ongoing difficult struggles is just the brokenness of America's families. Yeah, and just when you when you get to know these women, and I know you too know it well, when you get to know them and you meet him and you meet their family members and you find out how disconnected the relationships are. I mean a lot of the women we serve have had multiple children with multiple men

34:20 and their siblings have done the same and and I used to try to meet them and try to mentally put together a family tree to find out how everyone's related and connected and it's really virtually impossible. So that's been very discouraging. And I'm always delighted that the baby is alive. The baby is loved at this point and welcomed and they're all excited about this baby coming. But but just knowing that the the baby is born into quite a fractured family and and the generational problem that ensues. When I mean it doesn't take long to to break up the family when a woman has never seen a functional nuclear family and her life and then her children repeated and their children repeated. They don't they've never seen it work and and that's really a big problem in America, not just with what we're doing here but all across them. Yeah, absolutely.

35:22 So that's been discouraging. I've come home from showers and cried all the way home many times in my car. Yeah, many times. So just struggling with that. And but other low's have mostly involved the death of babies. Yeah, that's very hard. After all the work of saving, you know, of saving babies on the sidewalk and providing for them, meeting all their needs all down the list of you know, your lengthy resource needs, and baby showers and all that and have baby stye. Is Tragic and I've seen it many times actually over thirty two years. Baby that was saved from abortion, showered, died of a brain tumor right at her second birthday. She was diagnosed at our first birthday and treated, you know, Chemo, radiation, surgery, all of that, and and still passed away. And and I'm still in contact with that mother. We actually reconnected on facebook round about six months ago. So we're still in contact. We this was this was probably twenty years ago, and so we've reconnected recently. So I'm glad about that. And she has, you know, know, she's moved on, she's done great. Her other children are all grown by now and she's doing well. Let me ask you, was it? Was it at least somewhat glimmer of hope in that very tragic situation that it was not she who had

36:53 taken the babies life, but it was whatever cancer wouldever? You know, that's what I try to communicate. Yeah, weak and frail skills of verying. So, but they still always ask right, why, you know, why? What? I should have just aborted this baby? The same result. Yeah, and I say no, it's not the same reas all. Yeah, your baby new love. Your baby knew your warm embrace, your kiss, your hug, your tender voice speaking to your child, holding your child. Your child knew that, knew that Mommy loved her. Yeah, an abortion, she never would have known that. She would have known as terror, right terror. Yeah, and your conscience is clear. You've done the right thing. So these are the things I try to communicate. But there have been others. I mean, she's not the only one. That was a baby who died from asphyxiation in his crib. Oh, he had the flu and she had taken him to the emergency room that the night before and he was treated, given medicine. She brought him home and put him in his crib and woke up the next day and he was yeah, that's awful, he had passed. So, you know, she's the one that got saved. She's the one who called me with all those questions that day, and she was a believer by this point. So she had tough questions.

38:20 And Yeah, and these are questions none of us have the answers to. But God is the one whose sovereign over life. We are not. We cannot take life, only God can do his will and he has reasons and purposes and scripture shows all that and we are just to trust. Yeah, but very recently a mom who you two met right here on the sidewalks here just months ago, she delivered twins, boy, girl, twins about a month early. She had been on bed rest but she got to the eighth month and delivered a month early and it was all expected. Nobody was surprised by premature birth of twins. But the twins never thrived. They struggled for twelve days and fourteen days and they both passed just a couple of weeks ago. Right. So this is all very fresh and so I've been trying to minister to her and encourage her and pray with her and just be with her and there are no words. I mean there are no words and she is really quite numb right now. But she did have those same questions like why, what would have been wrong with me aboarding? You know, that kind of thing. So I went through the same type things with her.

39:35 So these are lows. These are lows and these are questions I can't answer. None of us really can. But I do know that we have no right to take life right. Yeah, absolutely, and in all of that, by God's grace and by His mercy, you were there and able to speak truth to these MOMS, to listen. The hope ultimately that is, that is sure and that is steadfast, is the hope that's found in Jesus Christ, and you're able to offer that and that's a tremendous blessing. People have, you know, all across the world, across the country, their children die young ages and they struggle with this and they have the why and many don't have a person like you who's going to be there and bring the mercy of God and the truth of God into the equation. So I appreciate you doing that and I know it's not easy. I man, I've had situations, stories that I could tell of these MOMS and these these dad's that I've ministered to, and you just come away from those situations thinking wow, that I really do any good. And you know, and you started doubt, but when you put things in perspective, like you said, that baby got to know love, whereas just in the womb and being torn apart by abortion, would not even be able to feel the touch of his mother.

40:47 And so that's just an amazing way to put it. Appreciate you sharing that. Yeah, so going from the from the lows. Yeah, share a story that's just been a tremendous blessing, something that stuck out in three years. And there's so many of them. I've I've I've been so privileged to be a part of so many of those with you and there are just really amazing stories from your ministry. There are, and it was really hard to narrow it down to one right, but you can be too if you want. Well, I have one that's a really very sweet and it's about a sixteen year old story. Now, I met a very young, sweet couple, Hispanic couple, at the Hebron road abortion clinic about sixteen years ago and I really don't even remember reading meeting them at this point, but they spoke only Spanish. So My, you know, interaction with them was very brief because I don't know Spanish more than just a couple of words anyway, and I know, like you, you've probably said, in my spare time I'm going to learn Spanish. Never have. If you're bilingual, we need to.

41:52 That's really that's one gift us. If the Lord can just give that to me without me trying that that would be the thing I would ask for. Yeah, so all I could do really at the time I met him was to give them Spanish literature and then a resource list written in Spanish and say the little I could and point to the pictures, you know, of the babies in the literature and that kind of I showed them fetal models and they did they turned away and they left that day. But I, you know, I they had my number, but it's not like if they called I could understand them. The man spoke a little more English because he worked in construction and he had more exposure than she did. But anyway, several months later they came back to the clinic all smiles and she had a big pregnant belly and so that broke all the language barriers right there, her pregnant belly and saw her at the clinic when she came back. Yeah, you just happen to be there that that day then? Yes, well, I was there every Saturday. I think they probably knew maybe I don't know, maybe they tried other times, I don't know, to find me, but if they came on a Saturday, I was most likely going to be there.

43:01 Okay. So, so they showed up and we rejoiced and and I got their number once again, and then I had a bilingual friend of mine call and offer the shower and make the arrangements of the time and day I could come and bring gifts and that kind of thing. Well, I came and they went through the gifts and I had, you know, Spanish Gospel material that I can't really share, the Gospel and Spona. So anyway, that was kind of feeble, but it's the best I could do. And then after the gifts were open, they started calling their family and friends and they all started pouring into this ty tiny apartment with all the gifts already in the room too. So and they start singing, they pull out instruments, the women go in the kitchen and start cooking, and I am not a good cook, and they made there were from Honduras and they made a delicious Hondur and meal and there may making Tortillia's by hand, and I want you to imagine all these little feminine hands patting out these Tortillia's in rhythm. I mean it was almost it was mesmerizing to me. And they're putting them in hot oil without burning their fingers. They're doing with their bare hands and I'm like, why are you using a tool? It was it was amazing to me. It was a breathtaking so they're synchronized and doing all that and they, you know, they start singing their songs and they start singing Christian songs and it was really beautiful. And their baby was born, baby girl.

44:29 Her name is Cynthia and she was born in two thousand and five. She just turned fifteen a few well, last month, August, two thousand and five, and she's in high school now. But the sweet part of this story is that this family calls to me every Christmas. Oh, every Christmas they call me and thank me, and I mean if it's not well, it might be Christmas, our New Year's. It's in that week of holiday. Yeah, and and the daughter always speaks to me the longest. She knows the story, she knows what almost happened to her. The fifteen year old knows. She knows she was almost aborted. Wow, she does. In her English is the best. So she talks to me the longest. Yeah, and they had another they married and they had another daughter about four years ago. So they have two girls right now and they work very hard.

45:16 They're very responsible family pursuing the American dream and their gratitude has lifted me on many, many discouraging days. That's a really it is a blessing, an awesome story. We have a Vietnamese lady who sends both me and Cheryl and the interpreter notes every every few weeks with pictures and thanking in in her broken English, thanking you for for all that you did and for us being there. It is she's sweet, that's she is jerious. Kind of thanks, because there are many that don't think right, as you know. There are many, but I the Lord has reminded me many times that. You know, Jesus at one point healed ten leppers. It's only one came back to exactly, I mean disease that is incurable, and only one came back to the right. So we don't operate for thanks, we operate for God's glory. Yeah, but it is good to have things. It can be discouraging in a lot of times to be out there, to be doing what you're doing day in and day out and not have any anythinks. The Lord Is Very Merciful, yeah, to let us sometimes hear those, those thank you's. Yeah, well, your model, your model of ministry, became the model that I think love life strives to follow with their the mentors when they give a baby shower, providing two years of the baby's clothes and equipment.

46:42 And that's something that we call out every day and that alone has changed people's minds, sometimes just hearing Oh, I don't have to do all that and they'll come and talk to us. So when you said you kind of grease the wheels, it's it's not a bribe at all. It truly is just just showing I'm offering, through God's people, this this law, this demonstration of love, and they're willing then to trust and to come talk with you. It does. It Softens Hard It's softens hearts ex and now that lays the groundwork for the gospel. Except one's hearts are soft, then they can hear truth. Yeah, yeah, Amen. Well, I mean I think with that we're going to wrap this thing up. Yeah, we could talk to the food end on a positive note. Yeah, and just thank God for all that he's done. I appreciate you, shy ill. Appreciate Your faithfulness to the Lord and the encouragement that really you've given to so many, certainly to me, certainly to Vicky, into others. And if you guys want to reach out to share, where can they? They can reach you. Is it truth and mercy Pro Life Ministries Dot Org? That is okay. Spell out and truth and mercy pro life dot Org. Okay, cool, and they can get your email address there and reach out to you that way. And if you guys want to support Cheryl, like she said, a big ministry expense is the storage units that she has and there's other ministry expenses to come on gas and hallow these gifts and all of that stuff.

48:09 So you guys want to help out with that, you certainly could reach out to her and I'm sure she would receive your donation. And if you have baby items you want to give, yes, you can certainly give some baby items to her, but she year. We appreciate you coming and sharing and we appreciate you guys that listen. Please again, like I started out, share this podcast. I'm sure it'll be a blessing to somebody and reach out to us if you have ideas for future podcast. We're gonna be touching off on all kinds of subjects in the coming weeks. We just have a lot that the Lord is doing here in our ministry and we want to share some of the things that God is doing and also share just some of the issues that we're struggling with and helping you guys. This is for people who are in ministry and you guys are just got some questions and things you're struggling with. When to help you as we talk, there are struggles in the things that we're dealing with on a daily basis and help encourage you guys.

48:58 So we appreciate you guys listening and until next time, God bless give me our love for love, give me our love for gratitude. I know it will cost me my life. Nothing's too precious and some that you