April 21, 2022

Reaching Out At Late Term Abortion Facilities

Reaching Out At Late Term Abortion Facilities

Every abortion center presents unique challenges. Most abortion centers do early term abortions but some of these centers do them 20 weeks and past. In this episode, we talk through some strategies to reach out at these late term abortion facilities and how to be most effective in helping these moms choose life.

https://sidewalks4life.com/equipping-articles/ 

Transcript
WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.160 --> 00:00:08.000 This was a very sympathetic piece on a man who dismembers living twenty week and, 2 00:00:08.119 --> 00:00:15.000 above babies. Yeah, and for that to have been a sympathetic portrayal 3 00:00:15.240 --> 00:00:21.920 shows the power of good writing and good storytelling right, and I think we 4 00:00:21.960 --> 00:00:26.480 all need to keep that in mind because we need to change the narrative. 5 00:00:26.760 --> 00:00:32.039 I Am Yours, I am yours, I am yours, and me, 6 00:00:32.280 --> 00:00:38.039 Lord, I am yours, I am yours. I'm welcome to the Gospel 7 00:00:38.039 --> 00:00:43.719 Center pre life podcast, a podcast designed to equip, encourage and challenge you 8 00:00:43.719 --> 00:00:47.560 in pro life ministry, and always with a focus on the Gospel. Stay 9 00:00:47.600 --> 00:01:00.079 tuned. I felt show Passih touchs your home. Use Me. Welcome back 10 00:01:00.119 --> 00:01:04.079 to the Gospel centered pro life podcast. We appreciate you guys joining us and, 11 00:01:04.200 --> 00:01:08.439 as always, we'd appreciate if you guys would share this podcast with others. 12 00:01:08.519 --> 00:01:11.799 We're going to share our email addresses at the end of this episode so 13 00:01:11.840 --> 00:01:15.519 you can reach out to us because, as always, we'd like for you 14 00:01:15.560 --> 00:01:18.959 to reach out if you have any questions, if you have any other topics 15 00:01:18.959 --> 00:01:22.760 that you'd like for us to cover, suggestions for future podcast, we'd love 16 00:01:22.840 --> 00:01:26.079 to do those and the podcast episode that we're going to do today is going 17 00:01:26.079 --> 00:01:30.239 to be based on someone reaching out with some questions about sidewalk out reaching their 18 00:01:30.319 --> 00:01:34.879 area. Just real quick, I'll introduce myself. We've tried to do that 19 00:01:34.959 --> 00:01:38.799 in the most recent episodes just because there's some new people that are coming on 20 00:01:38.840 --> 00:01:42.200 and listening. So my name is Daniel Parks. I'm the director or the 21 00:01:42.200 --> 00:01:47.319 West Coast Regional Shepherd for love life, so oversee our efforts on the west 22 00:01:47.319 --> 00:01:49.200 coast. Even though I'm on the East Coast, I'm actually out on the 23 00:01:49.200 --> 00:01:55.760 west coast. A lot travel back and forth and I'm joined by Vicki Kessi 24 00:01:55.879 --> 00:02:00.079 Org. Hey, there everyone, and I am a sidewalk missionary here in 25 00:02:00.200 --> 00:02:05.200 Charlotte. have been doing this almost a decade, yeah, and these podcasts 26 00:02:05.239 --> 00:02:07.000 for about two years. Yeah, and so, you know, to toot 27 00:02:07.080 --> 00:02:13.000 our own horns and to let you guys know that we're like super official and 28 00:02:13.159 --> 00:02:17.360 we know everything about sidewalk ministry. Absolutely. We've been doing this for twenty 29 00:02:17.360 --> 00:02:21.759 five combined years. Yeah, right, one time, and we're super humble 30 00:02:22.039 --> 00:02:24.800 about that. Right now, we are super humble, like even though we've 31 00:02:24.840 --> 00:02:30.080 been doing this for a while combined, twenty five years experience we're still learning 32 00:02:30.080 --> 00:02:35.400 stuff, like every every day and time we're out there, something new. 33 00:02:35.759 --> 00:02:38.080 We get to interact with you guys that are listening and you throw out suggestions 34 00:02:38.159 --> 00:02:43.840 to us and questions to us and we learned stuff from you guys. So, 35 00:02:44.120 --> 00:02:46.439 to be honest, like we are humble to be able to serve you 36 00:02:46.439 --> 00:02:50.919 guys in this way and to speak into your situation, speak into your city 37 00:02:50.960 --> 00:02:57.639 and the sidewalk out reach ministry there. But we're also we realize that maybe 38 00:02:57.680 --> 00:03:02.400 if you view us as experts, you've been duped because we pretend to be 39 00:03:02.439 --> 00:03:07.039 experts. We play experts on a podcast, in a ministry like this, 40 00:03:07.080 --> 00:03:10.639 they're just there. No real experts. There is always something that is going 41 00:03:10.680 --> 00:03:14.039 to throw you for a loop pretty much every day. Yeah, we day, 42 00:03:14.039 --> 00:03:16.680 you work, and that's why I always say yeah, in the trainings 43 00:03:16.680 --> 00:03:19.759 that we do and stuff, it's like, if you want to know, 44 00:03:20.280 --> 00:03:25.080 I caught the super duper top secret trick, uhh, to being effective on 45 00:03:25.120 --> 00:03:28.960 the sidewalk right, you know what it is? Wiki beyond the sidewalk? 46 00:03:29.000 --> 00:03:31.120 I don't know. No, that's not it. Nice tribe, but that 47 00:03:31.159 --> 00:03:38.879 was wrong. The super duper top secret, secret, secret tip to be 48 00:03:38.919 --> 00:03:40.879 effective on the sidewalk. Oh, be in the Lord, be in the 49 00:03:40.879 --> 00:03:46.840 word. How about walk with Jesus? Men, walk with Jesus. That 50 00:03:46.919 --> 00:03:49.719 includes being a prayer, being in the word. Yeah, but we do 51 00:03:49.800 --> 00:03:52.360 think that we have some value to add you guys. We do think we 52 00:03:52.400 --> 00:03:55.879 can take some of our experiences and just share him, share them on this 53 00:03:55.919 --> 00:04:00.280 podcast. That's what we intend to do. So in this episode I'll let 54 00:04:00.319 --> 00:04:05.520 you introduce the topic, Vicki. Okay, well, this did come from 55 00:04:05.520 --> 00:04:13.560 a counselor who is working or surfing at a facility where they only do late 56 00:04:13.719 --> 00:04:16.800 term abortion. Yeah, and I didn't know there was such a facility. 57 00:04:16.800 --> 00:04:25.360 It's in Boulder, Colorado, and I relatively famous abortionist. Warn her famous, 58 00:04:25.360 --> 00:04:28.839 infamous, that's a better word. Warren Warren hern is his name, 59 00:04:29.079 --> 00:04:33.759 and I guess us, the La Times wrote recently wrote an article on him 60 00:04:33.800 --> 00:04:38.600 and then, I believe, the missionary saw that article and found out, 61 00:04:38.639 --> 00:04:42.560 wow, this is this is the facility where I'm going to be serving as 62 00:04:42.560 --> 00:04:49.959 a sidewalk missionary or counselor, and so she sent us the article that the 63 00:04:50.040 --> 00:04:55.800 La Times wrote and asked if we were familiar with this. Sent us a 64 00:04:55.879 --> 00:05:02.560 rebuttal from a pro life thinks live action. It was like action. And 65 00:05:02.560 --> 00:05:08.720 and then said, given that this is only late term abortions, would this 66 00:05:08.959 --> 00:05:15.279 altar how you would speak to the women and your strategy? And we answered 67 00:05:15.399 --> 00:05:19.720 separately, Daniel and I, in in letters. I've written an article that 68 00:05:19.839 --> 00:05:25.600 includes roughly both of our our answers, little bit different. In many ways 69 00:05:25.639 --> 00:05:29.319 we agreed, but we had some slight differences. But also I did a 70 00:05:29.360 --> 00:05:32.399 little bit further research. I did read both of these articles. I recommend 71 00:05:32.399 --> 00:05:38.160 everybody read them. And and then I did a little bit further research on 72 00:05:38.800 --> 00:05:44.319 why people come for a later term abortion, because that's important to know. 73 00:05:44.920 --> 00:05:48.839 Yeah, and that's what how this article developed in then this podcast developed. 74 00:05:49.000 --> 00:05:54.399 was trying to add it not only adequately answered that missionaries question, but then 75 00:05:54.439 --> 00:06:00.199 someone else wrote us in a very similar situation and said what would you say? 76 00:06:00.240 --> 00:06:04.759 That maybe as unique from what you would say to someone in a early 77 00:06:05.079 --> 00:06:10.079 term. Yeah, abortion. So that's how it Develta. Yeah, and 78 00:06:10.079 --> 00:06:15.680 we had talked about this a couple of episodes ago when we talked about getting 79 00:06:15.680 --> 00:06:19.120 in the mindset. The encouragement in that podcast was we need to we need 80 00:06:19.199 --> 00:06:21.800 to try the best we can to enter into the mindset of the women that 81 00:06:21.800 --> 00:06:27.800 were ministering to so that we can understand their perspective and accurately speak into their 82 00:06:27.839 --> 00:06:31.519 situation. Right, I mentioned this little bit kind of the interaction that we 83 00:06:31.560 --> 00:06:38.279 had yes the lady there in Colorado and that the mindset could be different. 84 00:06:39.000 --> 00:06:42.680 So this is a more in depth look at that. Like what is that? 85 00:06:42.759 --> 00:06:46.279 What is the mindset of a woman that's coming for late term abortion? 86 00:06:46.360 --> 00:06:50.120 Yeah, how would we tweak our language or what would we focus on? 87 00:06:50.199 --> 00:06:55.079 Because you depending on the situation, again, whether it's a late term abortion 88 00:06:55.199 --> 00:06:58.079 or whatever the situation might be. I mean, I'm even looking at the 89 00:06:58.079 --> 00:07:01.399 situation where if you're talking to someone who's taking the abortion pill versus someone who 90 00:07:01.399 --> 00:07:04.759 has a surgical abortion, is going in for a surgical abortion, there's a 91 00:07:04.759 --> 00:07:09.759 cut general framework is the three talking points, but there's a couple of things 92 00:07:09.800 --> 00:07:13.800 that I'm going to say to the abortion pill person that I wouldn't say to 93 00:07:13.879 --> 00:07:16.600 the surgical abortion person and vice versa. Right, correct. And so just 94 00:07:16.639 --> 00:07:20.399 there's a couple things to consider and as we're talking about late term abortions, 95 00:07:20.399 --> 00:07:24.319 there's a couple things to consider. Yeah, in the series. Yes, 96 00:07:24.399 --> 00:07:29.439 so in that article, one of the things that right off the bat they 97 00:07:29.480 --> 00:07:31.639 met. I well, the article where I tried to find out the mindset 98 00:07:31.680 --> 00:07:36.839 of the woman. So try to find out facts about late term abortions in 99 00:07:36.879 --> 00:07:42.000 the mindset of the women, they term abortion is a is kind of a 100 00:07:42.120 --> 00:07:45.399 term that they don't recommend you even use, right, because he doesn't really 101 00:07:45.399 --> 00:07:48.160 have a lot of meaning. What is a late term abortion? So in 102 00:07:48.199 --> 00:07:54.399 this article it it talked about abortions after twenty weeks, right. Yeah, 103 00:07:54.399 --> 00:07:58.839 so, and it's essentially third trum Mster abortion is socially essentially this a little 104 00:07:58.879 --> 00:08:03.519 bit before the third term. But but most abortion centers, I don't know 105 00:08:03.560 --> 00:08:09.199 even know if it's most. I know the abortion centers here in Charlotte are 106 00:08:09.279 --> 00:08:11.680 up to about twenty weeks. Yeah, and and that's what a lot of 107 00:08:11.720 --> 00:08:16.839 people are going to be coming in, you know, serving at. Although 108 00:08:16.879 --> 00:08:20.160 most abortions occur in the first trimester. Yeah, but there are women that 109 00:08:20.199 --> 00:08:26.680 come in that third trimester and I think that most people believe, and I 110 00:08:26.680 --> 00:08:30.879 think you mentioned, that it's usually due to feed, a l abnormality of 111 00:08:31.000 --> 00:08:35.960 some sort. But I wanted to find out specifically why people come for late 112 00:08:35.039 --> 00:08:41.519 term abortion in this article. I think it was really interesting. Why, 113 00:08:41.559 --> 00:08:46.320 the main reasons, and it was a study, and of the main reasons 114 00:08:46.320 --> 00:08:52.120 why women over forty, over twenty weeks, come for an abortion? Yeah, 115 00:08:52.159 --> 00:08:54.960 and they may have faced more than one of the following issues, which 116 00:08:54.039 --> 00:09:01.279 I'm going to go over, but they they reported facing these issues and this 117 00:09:01.360 --> 00:09:05.519 is why they were coming for an abortion. Yeah, so they delayed the 118 00:09:05.519 --> 00:09:13.600 decision to abort because of these particular correct. Okay, correct. So first 119 00:09:13.639 --> 00:09:18.679 of all, the the first I don't know item, was any barrier, 120 00:09:18.720 --> 00:09:24.240 if there was any barrier present, thirty one percent of the women said that 121 00:09:24.519 --> 00:09:28.679 there was some sort of a barrier, okay, and a barrier between them 122 00:09:28.720 --> 00:09:33.440 and having the abortion. Correct, okay, correct. So now that they 123 00:09:33.639 --> 00:09:43.240 don't specifically in this article ever list fetal abnormality, okay, or health risk 124 00:09:43.440 --> 00:09:48.399 with the mom okay, but the article did point out that that is those 125 00:09:48.399 --> 00:09:52.639 are both main issues for people in late term abortions. Not not necessarily the 126 00:09:52.679 --> 00:09:56.120 only issue, maybe not an issue at all. Yeah, but those do 127 00:09:56.240 --> 00:10:03.320 occur and and a question that came to my mind right away was why wait 128 00:10:03.360 --> 00:10:05.799 if there's a maternal risk? Why did they wait? Yeah, and one 129 00:10:05.799 --> 00:10:11.919 of the things the article pointed out is some maternal risk don't show up till 130 00:10:11.960 --> 00:10:16.240 the third term right, which I hadn't really thought about. High Blood Pressure, 131 00:10:16.240 --> 00:10:20.519 pretty clamsy CLAMPSIA, all those sorts of things. So it's good to 132 00:10:20.600 --> 00:10:22.799 know that. But any barrier? Thirty one percent of them said that there 133 00:10:22.879 --> 00:10:28.399 was some sort of a barrier preventing them from getting an earlier abortion. Forty 134 00:10:28.480 --> 00:10:35.279 percent of them said raising money for the procedure and related costs. Now that's 135 00:10:35.399 --> 00:10:41.919 interesting because a third term abortion is thousands of dollars right, very expensive. 136 00:10:41.519 --> 00:10:48.240 So that means they couldn't even afford less expensive abortion. Yeah, and had 137 00:10:48.279 --> 00:10:54.600 to go about somehow raising the money. Yeah, forty percent not knowing about 138 00:10:54.639 --> 00:10:56.639 the pregnancy. Twenty percent. Again, a lot of us will look at 139 00:10:56.639 --> 00:11:01.159 that and say what, they don't know? They're twenty weeks pregnant. They 140 00:11:01.159 --> 00:11:03.360 don't know it. I'll tell you there was one time I went on the 141 00:11:03.440 --> 00:11:07.480 RV there was a woman didn't even know she was pregnant on our mobile ultra 142 00:11:07.519 --> 00:11:11.159 sound rvy. She didn't even know she was pregnant. She was thirty two 143 00:11:11.399 --> 00:11:15.399 weeks. Yeah, so it happens, but it does happen. Twenty percent 144 00:11:15.440 --> 00:11:18.279 of them didn't know about the pregnancy. Yeah, by the way, I 145 00:11:18.360 --> 00:11:22.080 want y'all to keep in mind as I'm listing all these things, these are 146 00:11:22.159 --> 00:11:28.120 not fetal abnormality or maternal risk. These are the same things that we sometimes 147 00:11:28.120 --> 00:11:33.200 hear from the first term. Yeah, abortion, their doubt, difficulties securing 148 00:11:33.320 --> 00:11:39.799 insurance coverage. Forty one percent. Now, that one made me gag, 149 00:11:39.840 --> 00:11:43.720 because that means that some people do get insurance coverage for an abortion. Yeah, 150 00:11:43.759 --> 00:11:46.960 and if you don't know that, you need to know that. That's 151 00:11:46.039 --> 00:11:52.960 kind of sad as yeah, that insurance pays for abortions. Forty percent. 152 00:11:52.039 --> 00:11:56.480 This is key. I think this might be the most important one. Trouble 153 00:11:56.639 --> 00:12:01.559 deciding about the abortion. Forty percent end. That means forty percent of the 154 00:12:01.559 --> 00:12:07.279 women coming for a late term abortion still have conflict in their heart. We 155 00:12:07.519 --> 00:12:13.480 know we can speak to that. Yeah, thirty eight percent did not know 156 00:12:13.519 --> 00:12:16.960 where to go for an abortion. That floors me. Yeah, that's a 157 00:12:16.960 --> 00:12:22.399 big percentage. There's some abortion centers. I advertise they're all over the place, 158 00:12:22.559 --> 00:12:26.679 but thirty eight percent don't know where to go. Yeah, difficult difficulty 159 00:12:26.759 --> 00:12:33.200 getting to an abortion se facility. Twenty seven percent disagreeing about the abortion with 160 00:12:33.240 --> 00:12:39.639 the man involved. Twenty percent. Yeah, so, while fetal abnormality maternal 161 00:12:39.720 --> 00:12:45.799 risk are big reasons for a late term abortion, they are hardly the only 162 00:12:45.840 --> 00:12:52.720 reason, sometimes not even the most important reason, and that's very important for 163 00:12:52.320 --> 00:12:58.679 people who are serving at those facilities to know you can speak to all these 164 00:12:58.720 --> 00:13:03.399 other issues, not just to the fetal abnormality and internal risk. Yeah. 165 00:13:03.840 --> 00:13:11.600 So, so this this this abortionist Warren Hearne, something that I really spoke 166 00:13:11.639 --> 00:13:13.759 to me as I read that article, and I would recommend that everybody read 167 00:13:13.799 --> 00:13:22.799 that article. They present him so sympathetically that he comes across as a victim 168 00:13:22.799 --> 00:13:26.879 and a hero. Yeah, of course he's. He's a victim, not 169 00:13:26.960 --> 00:13:30.559 the baby, cit he kills their abord exactly. He's a hero because he 170 00:13:30.639 --> 00:13:35.000 gives a woman her life back or whatever. Yeah, ever, yeah, 171 00:13:35.080 --> 00:13:41.399 they deem that he's fighting for these poor woman. Right, and never the 172 00:13:41.480 --> 00:13:48.399 article never once mentions the murdered babies. Of course, course. But but 173 00:13:48.440 --> 00:13:52.080 what struck me as a writer, and I think it will strike you, 174 00:13:52.200 --> 00:13:58.240 Daniel, because you were always talking about the value of stories, this was 175 00:13:58.639 --> 00:14:05.519 a a very sympathetic piece on a man who dismembers living twenty week and above 176 00:14:05.639 --> 00:14:13.279 babies. Yeah, and for that to have been a sympathetic portrayal shows the 177 00:14:13.279 --> 00:14:18.679 power of good riding and good storytelling, right, and I think we all 178 00:14:18.720 --> 00:14:24.799 need to keep that in mind because we need to change the narrative in our 179 00:14:24.840 --> 00:14:31.799 stories. Stories are powerful. Yeah, our stories can equally paint the truth 180 00:14:31.879 --> 00:14:35.720 of what happens to that baby, yeah, and the devastation to the mother, 181 00:14:35.919 --> 00:14:39.759 and all of us need to be aware of aware of that and how 182 00:14:39.799 --> 00:14:43.799 to do that. Well. Yeah. Yeah, so the other article live 183 00:14:43.840 --> 00:14:48.039 action to bunks the time's peace, and I think it's important for us to 184 00:14:48.039 --> 00:14:52.639 read that so that we have the balance of the truth bumped up against this 185 00:14:52.799 --> 00:14:56.559 very well written la La Times story. Yeah, but anyway, you gave 186 00:14:56.600 --> 00:15:05.360 the your feedback to the missionary in Oregon, in bolder, who wrote tested 187 00:15:05.639 --> 00:15:09.200 US Colorado. I'm sorry that that asked us what do we do and I 188 00:15:09.200 --> 00:15:13.440 thought your feedback was really good. So maybe you could talk about the things 189 00:15:13.440 --> 00:15:20.240 that you mentioned. Yeah. So my point was that the women that we're 190 00:15:20.240 --> 00:15:28.639 seeing that come in for an early first trimester even second trimester abortion are typically 191 00:15:28.720 --> 00:15:35.039 like and you know, we've seen women who come in who are amazed. 192 00:15:35.039 --> 00:15:37.120 When we we do, by God's grace, get to show them an ultrasound 193 00:15:37.120 --> 00:15:41.279 and they see their baby at nine eight, nine weeks, got a heartbeat. 194 00:15:41.720 --> 00:15:45.600 They're amazing. They'll say it's a baby right. So there's this ability, 195 00:15:45.639 --> 00:15:48.519 in a sense, even though there's really no excuse for it because the 196 00:15:48.519 --> 00:15:52.240 technology we have, but there's this ability to kind of disconnect themselves from the 197 00:15:52.279 --> 00:15:56.440 reality that they're carrying a baby because I don't yet feel that baby. It's 198 00:15:56.480 --> 00:16:02.519 not a clear maybe in their bodies there some changes, but they're not a 199 00:16:02.559 --> 00:16:04.759 clear change in our don't have a baby bump and that sort of thing. 200 00:16:06.120 --> 00:16:08.320 When you get into, of course, the third trimester, but even like 201 00:16:08.320 --> 00:16:11.919 twenty weeks. We all know and have seen people who are pregnant at twenty 202 00:16:11.960 --> 00:16:15.080 weeks. You can see their baby. Yeah, you can see that baby 203 00:16:15.200 --> 00:16:19.879 kick. They can feel the baby kick right. So there's no denying that 204 00:16:19.919 --> 00:16:25.759 it's a baby at that point. So my response was one like we certainly 205 00:16:25.799 --> 00:16:30.600 can appeal to that mother and talk to her about the fact that her baby 206 00:16:30.840 --> 00:16:33.480 is a human being, that it's a human life, but she already knows 207 00:16:33.559 --> 00:16:38.519 that likely and especially if she's already had because when a woman does find out 208 00:16:38.559 --> 00:16:41.120 she's pregnant, I'll say she wanted to get pregnant, but then she finds 209 00:16:41.120 --> 00:16:45.559 out she's pregnant with a baby that has some feet or outdoor abnormality or some 210 00:16:45.679 --> 00:16:49.240 issue, she's going to go for multiple ultrasounds. Like the doctor. We 211 00:16:49.279 --> 00:16:53.120 went through this with our twins. So we have twin twin girls, and 212 00:16:53.159 --> 00:16:59.159 they're precious. But at like twelve weeks my wife was twelve weeks pregnans. 213 00:16:59.200 --> 00:17:03.200 We found out, I think maybe it was nine weeks, that she was 214 00:17:03.240 --> 00:17:07.680 having twins. About twelve weeks my wife woke up in a pool of blood 215 00:17:07.720 --> 00:17:10.519 and we thought we were losing the babies. Thought she's miscaring. By God's 216 00:17:10.519 --> 00:17:15.759 grace she did not and they lived and continued. And about twenty weeks she 217 00:17:15.759 --> 00:17:18.599 had an ultra sound because we have twins. They do regular ultrasound. So 218 00:17:18.759 --> 00:17:22.759 twins is sort of an abnormality right. It's sort of a rare they considered 219 00:17:22.799 --> 00:17:27.160 a high risk any any situation where a woman has twins, it's a high 220 00:17:27.240 --> 00:17:33.920 risk situation for her in for the babies, and so she had multiple ultra 221 00:17:33.960 --> 00:17:36.839 sounds and then it like nineteen or twenty weeks. There were some issues. 222 00:17:36.920 --> 00:17:40.319 One of the babies was smaller than the other and so they did an ultrasound, 223 00:17:40.400 --> 00:17:44.319 they ended up, we end up get an MRI, all these things. 224 00:17:44.359 --> 00:17:47.759 Now I'm saying that from our experiences. Like you've seen multiple ultrasounds, 225 00:17:48.039 --> 00:17:51.279 right, if there's some some issues with that baby, they're not just going 226 00:17:51.359 --> 00:17:55.880 to hopefully at least they're not just going to do one ultrasound and say you 227 00:17:55.880 --> 00:17:57.559 got problems with this child, you need to have an abortion. Now, 228 00:17:57.599 --> 00:18:02.799 some doctors probably would would do that, but for the most part doctors even 229 00:18:02.839 --> 00:18:04.440 that are pro abortion or probably not going to do that, especially if it's 230 00:18:04.480 --> 00:18:07.599 with a woman who wanted the child. Does that Make Sen exactly? Yes. 231 00:18:07.759 --> 00:18:11.200 Yeah, so they're going to do multiple ultrasound. So there's not like 232 00:18:11.279 --> 00:18:15.279 if I'm standing in front of a place where, you know, they're killing 233 00:18:15.279 --> 00:18:21.000 babies twenty weeks and above, I would mention the ultrasound, but they've probably 234 00:18:21.000 --> 00:18:23.799 already had an ultrasound, right, and so probably what I will mention is 235 00:18:25.119 --> 00:18:29.200 you probably saw the ultrasound of your baby. Didn't you see that? Your 236 00:18:29.279 --> 00:18:30.880 child is alive. You know, I want to remind them what they've already 237 00:18:30.880 --> 00:18:33.759 seen rather than hey, come over here, we have a free ultrasound for 238 00:18:33.839 --> 00:18:37.279 you now. If I had that available. I would certainly offer that. 239 00:18:37.559 --> 00:18:42.440 I would always talk about a second opinion. I would always say did you 240 00:18:42.440 --> 00:18:45.640 get a second opinion to me, and I think I'm pretty sure I responded 241 00:18:45.720 --> 00:18:49.359 to the responded to that email in this way. Yeah, that having a 242 00:18:49.400 --> 00:18:55.079 high risk doctor and a doctor that is willing to give a second opinion to 243 00:18:55.160 --> 00:18:57.359 be that would be on the top of my list to find. I would 244 00:18:57.400 --> 00:19:02.799 be finding that high risk doctor. It would. And let me just interjecting 245 00:19:02.960 --> 00:19:07.559 in there, make sure it's a pro life high risk because we know that 246 00:19:07.599 --> 00:19:11.319 there are high risk doctors who will then just say go ahead and kill the 247 00:19:11.319 --> 00:19:17.640 baby because that is the least likely to be sued over response and there their 248 00:19:17.720 --> 00:19:19.599 risk converse. So be sure it's a pro life high risk doctor. Yeah, 249 00:19:19.680 --> 00:19:23.680 yeah, no doubt. Yeah, and so some of the things that 250 00:19:23.720 --> 00:19:26.559 I encourage her to do is, yes, I would use the three talking 251 00:19:26.640 --> 00:19:32.599 points and I would talk about out resources and things like that. I would 252 00:19:32.640 --> 00:19:37.319 talk certainly about the humanity of the baby. That's that's where I would probably 253 00:19:37.319 --> 00:19:41.480 rest most of my words and the humanity the baby. Yeah, and and 254 00:19:41.599 --> 00:19:45.640 their accountability to accountability to God. I would be reminding them of what they've 255 00:19:45.680 --> 00:19:49.720 already seen, because again, they've likely already seen an ultra sound. I 256 00:19:49.759 --> 00:19:53.680 would be reminding them of what they're already feeling. You feel your baby kick? 257 00:19:53.759 --> 00:20:02.079 Yeah, now I haven't dug into the numbers that that you shared earlier 258 00:20:02.079 --> 00:20:07.279 about these percentages of why people come for late term abortions. Obviously, if 259 00:20:07.319 --> 00:20:10.039 you do the math, the percentages don't come out to be a hundred percent 260 00:20:10.119 --> 00:20:12.279 because because they could have more than one of those factors. They music a 261 00:20:12.359 --> 00:20:15.960 point, right, exactly. My point is that there's probably a compounded, 262 00:20:17.319 --> 00:20:21.079 right, yes, of each of these things or some level of each of 263 00:20:21.079 --> 00:20:25.559 these things. So kind of what I'm getting at is, do people have 264 00:20:25.640 --> 00:20:29.440 late term abortions because their baby has down syndrome? Yes, they do, 265 00:20:30.000 --> 00:20:33.200 but probably not just because of that, right. There's probably these other things 266 00:20:33.400 --> 00:20:38.359 and so trouble deciding about the abortion. So maybe they've found out at twelve 267 00:20:38.400 --> 00:20:41.720 weeks. I mean they can do blood tests now, yeah, to find 268 00:20:41.759 --> 00:20:45.759 out whether you're not your baby has down syndrome or the percentage that your baby 269 00:20:45.839 --> 00:20:48.759 is likely to have down syndrome or something, which I think is absurd, 270 00:20:48.759 --> 00:20:49.960 but they you can do that, right, so you can find out a 271 00:20:51.079 --> 00:20:53.440 like you know, teve fourteen weeks. Yeah, if your baby has down 272 00:20:53.480 --> 00:20:56.680 syndrome, and some of these women could have been going back and forth in 273 00:20:56.720 --> 00:21:00.519 their mind of whether or not they should do the abortion, get and advice 274 00:21:00.599 --> 00:21:04.599 from people, and then, of course it pushes the the baby on end 275 00:21:04.640 --> 00:21:08.240 to twenty weeks. So they right becomes a yeah, it's a third trimester 276 00:21:08.319 --> 00:21:12.640 abortion and I agree with where you're going. But I have met women who 277 00:21:12.640 --> 00:21:18.880 are twenty weeks pregnant who have not had any fetal or maternal abnormality or risk 278 00:21:19.200 --> 00:21:25.559 mentioned, but just cannot decide. They know it's wrong, they just are 279 00:21:25.680 --> 00:21:30.039 filled with conflict. Yeah, and that's why they're now entering into, you 280 00:21:30.079 --> 00:21:33.359 know, the second and third trimester and still haven't done it. Yeah, 281 00:21:33.359 --> 00:21:40.599 so there can be conflict without a factor of some sort of risk grabumality. 282 00:21:40.759 --> 00:21:45.799 Yeah, absolutely, speaking about the kind of the health risk of the woman. 283 00:21:45.920 --> 00:21:52.960 Yeah, especially when they're in you know, the twenty four to twenty 284 00:21:52.960 --> 00:21:56.720 eight week really up into twenty eight, when you get closer to thirty weeks, 285 00:21:56.839 --> 00:22:00.440 babies like babies have been born at twenty four weeks, twenty six weeks 286 00:22:00.599 --> 00:22:04.279 that have survived. Yeah, now it it's not, of course, the 287 00:22:04.319 --> 00:22:08.839 best scenario. But you would have to ask yourself, okay, if the 288 00:22:08.839 --> 00:22:14.880 woman has pre ECLAMPSIA and she's twenty five weeks, twenty four weeks along, 289 00:22:15.960 --> 00:22:19.119 why would they abhort the Child? Why would they kill the child and then 290 00:22:19.200 --> 00:22:25.039 have the child delivered? Because is it would in the process generally be the 291 00:22:25.039 --> 00:22:27.799 same. You can leave the child alive and deliver the child. Do you 292 00:22:27.839 --> 00:22:32.359 have to kill the child in the deliver the child to stop the symptoms of 293 00:22:32.400 --> 00:22:37.039 preclamsy? And you don't, right. And so to me it's like it's 294 00:22:37.319 --> 00:22:40.759 it doesn't make sense. Why not just deliver the Child? Is it that 295 00:22:41.079 --> 00:22:45.359 this person's looking for a justification to kill the child? Yeah, so that 296 00:22:45.359 --> 00:22:49.160 that to me doesn't make sense. And again, I know that that's I 297 00:22:49.200 --> 00:22:52.160 want to say this and be kind of careful what I'm saying, but no 298 00:22:52.279 --> 00:23:00.319 one goes about to have a late term abortion or, you know, later 299 00:23:00.359 --> 00:23:03.720 in the second trimester, in third trimester abortions, and does it kind of 300 00:23:03.759 --> 00:23:07.480 on a whim. Right, it's pretty well thought out for the most part, 301 00:23:07.680 --> 00:23:11.000 right. Yeah, and it's not just money, it is a big 302 00:23:11.039 --> 00:23:15.000 expense. Yeah, when you're getting into the third trimester, you're talking like 303 00:23:15.039 --> 00:23:21.359 Tenzero for the abortion proceed right, and so there's there's got to be a 304 00:23:21.359 --> 00:23:26.279 compounded amount of things going on right and things that are, you know, 305 00:23:26.519 --> 00:23:34.400 similar but maybe even more traumatic, more stressful than people that have an early 306 00:23:34.559 --> 00:23:41.359 term abortion. Yeah, and so understanding that, understanding that these we see 307 00:23:41.400 --> 00:23:45.359 it all the time. We see women walking into the latrobe abortion center, 308 00:23:45.400 --> 00:23:49.720 other abortion centers, the most most of the abortion centers we minister at are 309 00:23:49.759 --> 00:23:53.319 going to be twenty weeks in before, like you said, right, and 310 00:23:53.359 --> 00:23:56.279 we see people going in flipping us off. It's not a baby. You 311 00:23:56.319 --> 00:24:00.759 know, I don't imagine you see a lot of that at these late term 312 00:24:00.799 --> 00:24:03.920 abortion facilities. I don't imagine you see a lot of people coming out getting 313 00:24:03.960 --> 00:24:08.240 in your face. I don't imagine you do. Now I will say, 314 00:24:08.240 --> 00:24:12.559 I'll put it on you guys who reach out at those abortion facilities. Maybe 315 00:24:12.640 --> 00:24:15.680 you do see that a lot. Maybe the attitude is different, but I'm 316 00:24:15.720 --> 00:24:22.480 imagining in attitude that's more somber, that's more broken, and so there's a 317 00:24:22.519 --> 00:24:26.240 way to reach out to those people. HMM. Yeah, I think that 318 00:24:26.240 --> 00:24:33.279 that is a very important point that you just raised, because I think there 319 00:24:33.319 --> 00:24:37.319 may be doctors who just think the simpler thing to do than delivering an early 320 00:24:37.400 --> 00:24:44.440 baby is to just tell them to abort the baby. But they could in 321 00:24:44.519 --> 00:24:48.160 most cases, maybe in all cases, in a late term abortion, they 322 00:24:48.279 --> 00:24:52.400 do not need to kill the baby. They could deliver the baby and the 323 00:24:52.400 --> 00:25:00.160 baby may or may not make it, but there is a choice to kill 324 00:25:00.160 --> 00:25:03.359 one human being. Yeah, to reduce whatever the risk to the to the 325 00:25:03.359 --> 00:25:07.480 MOM. Late term abortions are risky. Yeah, the MOM. There is 326 00:25:07.519 --> 00:25:12.519 a lot that can go wrong in in a late term abortion. That is 327 00:25:14.240 --> 00:25:18.519 it is not a small risk factor. Yeah, so I think that it's 328 00:25:18.559 --> 00:25:22.839 important to point that out. Yeah, but undoubtedly there it might be the 329 00:25:22.880 --> 00:25:29.000 doctor that she is seen who is going with what he sees as the least 330 00:25:29.160 --> 00:25:33.400 risky right option, but it could be well be her having more than just 331 00:25:33.480 --> 00:25:38.880 the concern about whatever abnormality. Yeah, being concerned about those other issues. 332 00:25:40.519 --> 00:25:45.160 So I liked what you said also when when you wrote that letter, that 333 00:25:45.640 --> 00:25:49.279 of the convenience factor. Right. I'm not sure that you mentioned that. 334 00:25:49.599 --> 00:25:53.319 And Yeah, talking about the mindset, right. Yeah. So, yeah, 335 00:25:55.000 --> 00:26:00.519 it's a very inconvenient thing to go in for a late term abortion. 336 00:26:00.599 --> 00:26:03.480 Yeah, sure, I mean, especially when you've got people that are flying 337 00:26:03.559 --> 00:26:07.920 to Colorado there. I mean I'm sure there are local people, but people 338 00:26:08.000 --> 00:26:14.799 do fly to Colorado. Colorado's a destination for late term abortions. I believe. 339 00:26:15.920 --> 00:26:18.720 Massachusetts or Maryland, either one of those, maybe both of those, 340 00:26:19.400 --> 00:26:23.119 are places where people go for late term abortions. And then New Mexico's another 341 00:26:23.119 --> 00:26:26.559 place, yeah, where people go for late term abortions. There's like these 342 00:26:26.640 --> 00:26:30.839 kind of late term abortion destinations. There's a documentary, it came out a 343 00:26:30.839 --> 00:26:36.720 couple of years ago about late term abortion facilities. I forget the name of 344 00:26:36.720 --> 00:26:38.640 the documentary. Maybe if I find it I can put a link in the 345 00:26:38.640 --> 00:26:44.400 show notes, but it was really is really informative and as a matter of 346 00:26:44.440 --> 00:26:48.880 fact, I kind of rewinded that videos. kind of went back a little 347 00:26:48.880 --> 00:26:52.920 bit on it because as they were showing the office, I noticed on the 348 00:26:52.960 --> 00:26:56.400 wall there was like a payment schedule for there was like prices. So I 349 00:26:56.440 --> 00:27:00.319 went back and kind of like zoomed into it because I wanted to see what 350 00:27:00.480 --> 00:27:03.599 is is, and that's where I saw the tenzero dollars for I think it 351 00:27:03.680 --> 00:27:07.240 was like twenty eight weeks or thirty weeks or something like that. I can't 352 00:27:07.279 --> 00:27:12.000 remember, but they kind of have how much it cost to do abortions at 353 00:27:12.000 --> 00:27:15.200 those stages. Yeah, and so, yeah, that's that's very telling. 354 00:27:15.240 --> 00:27:22.359 But you do have the convenience factor with early term abortions, where it's just 355 00:27:22.480 --> 00:27:26.400 more convenient to go have an abortion than to let a baby take over your 356 00:27:26.440 --> 00:27:30.160 body, to have your work schedule thrown off for or whatever. And I 357 00:27:30.200 --> 00:27:36.319 don't mean to say that every woman that has an abortion is doing it for 358 00:27:36.359 --> 00:27:40.519 the sake of convenience, because it's not convenient to go to the abortion clinic 359 00:27:40.559 --> 00:27:44.240 and wait for three hours and do do all that stuff and then they're subjecting 360 00:27:44.279 --> 00:27:48.759 their bodies to, you know, some pretty pretty harsh stuff. So I 361 00:27:48.759 --> 00:27:52.359 don't mean to say that it's just convenient in the senses easy, but it 362 00:27:52.440 --> 00:27:56.440 is more convenient just to have your abortion one day then to raise a child 363 00:27:56.440 --> 00:27:59.799 for eighteen years. We hear that a lot. Right, you're going to 364 00:27:59.880 --> 00:28:02.279 raise this baby. I don't want to raise this baby for eighteen years. 365 00:28:02.359 --> 00:28:06.160 Right. What are you saying? You don't want to be inconvenienced. Right. 366 00:28:06.200 --> 00:28:08.119 And so my point is with the late term abortion thing is that people 367 00:28:08.160 --> 00:28:12.200 are not coming there for the sake of convenience. They've already went through several 368 00:28:12.240 --> 00:28:17.359 months of the pregnancy already. Their body is already been subjected to what a 369 00:28:17.400 --> 00:28:22.799 one's body goes through when she's pregnant, and so that factors is likely not 370 00:28:22.880 --> 00:28:29.559 they're are not as prominent in these situations. And again I'm imagining the just 371 00:28:29.599 --> 00:28:33.480 the faces of the women are more somber, more like. You know, 372 00:28:33.640 --> 00:28:37.640 this is not something that they're doing glibly. Right, will say right, 373 00:28:37.640 --> 00:28:41.920 and so I wonder if you do have a harder time convincing them. I 374 00:28:41.920 --> 00:28:47.880 think that is possible. Yeah, in in I imagine there's more fear. 375 00:28:48.319 --> 00:28:52.440 Talking about their mindset. They're probably right fearful, because they really are afraid 376 00:28:52.480 --> 00:28:56.079 for their life or for for what is going to be the baby's life. 377 00:28:56.160 --> 00:29:00.440 Yeah, and and so again, going back to that, one of the 378 00:29:00.440 --> 00:29:04.680 original points I'm made, testimony, telling stories. There are women who have 379 00:29:04.759 --> 00:29:10.799 made it through high risk pregnancies, many there are many women who have had 380 00:29:10.839 --> 00:29:15.279 a special needs child and could testify to the joy of that child. There's 381 00:29:15.359 --> 00:29:19.440 many women who have delivered a baby who is only going to live for a 382 00:29:19.480 --> 00:29:25.359 few minutes, yeah, or maybe hours after birth, who say that that 383 00:29:25.440 --> 00:29:30.839 time was so precious and it was worth going through the pregnancy in the sorrow 384 00:29:30.880 --> 00:29:34.680 to have that baby for those few hours or whatever time that they had. 385 00:29:34.720 --> 00:29:40.640 And so those testimonies, I think we should all know about them and especially 386 00:29:40.720 --> 00:29:44.920 if this is a the type of facility you're serving at, being able to 387 00:29:44.920 --> 00:29:49.759 tell those stories and give those women help and hope, hope that, even 388 00:29:49.759 --> 00:29:55.960 though this is a terrible situation, that there is even there is even joy 389 00:29:56.039 --> 00:30:02.599 possible in bringing that baby you know, I'll testimonies are a powerful way for 390 00:30:02.720 --> 00:30:06.720 any situation that you're dealing with. If you have a corresponding testimony of your 391 00:30:06.759 --> 00:30:10.160 story, if you have a personal testimony, yeah, or testimony that you 392 00:30:10.160 --> 00:30:15.519 can share somebody you know or something you've read or video. It's just powerful 393 00:30:15.519 --> 00:30:19.559 because it really overcomes the you know, all of the lies that there can't 394 00:30:19.559 --> 00:30:23.519 be any good that comes out of this bad situation. Testimonies show that, 395 00:30:23.880 --> 00:30:27.599 well, God's not a respective persons and is if he was there with this 396 00:30:27.599 --> 00:30:33.440 woman in her story. Yeah, and there's a positive outcome here. It 397 00:30:33.480 --> 00:30:37.960 brings hope. Right, there can there can be a similar testimony in your 398 00:30:37.039 --> 00:30:45.119 situation, right, right. What reading that one article helped me to know 399 00:30:45.359 --> 00:30:49.240 and understand was like you. I don't think I would focus on the resources 400 00:30:49.319 --> 00:30:55.400 so much with a later term abortion, but I might not ignore it because 401 00:30:55.519 --> 00:30:59.720 if, if all of those reasons that I listed at the beginning of this 402 00:30:59.799 --> 00:31:04.119 podcast are true, then you've still got women who are conflicted, women who 403 00:31:04.200 --> 00:31:08.160 are being pressured by a boyfriend, women who are still in shock because they 404 00:31:08.200 --> 00:31:14.519 just found out that they were pregnant not long ago. And and so I 405 00:31:14.519 --> 00:31:19.839 think using our three talking points are still important. Yeah, especially focusing on 406 00:31:19.880 --> 00:31:26.039 the to humanity of the baby and and what God has has to say. 407 00:31:26.200 --> 00:31:29.200 Yeah, and the value of that child, yea for God. Yeah, 408 00:31:29.240 --> 00:31:33.960 absolutely. So, yeah, yeah, well, I think that we'll wrap 409 00:31:33.079 --> 00:31:36.920 this episode up. If you're if you're good to go on that. Yeah, 410 00:31:37.119 --> 00:31:38.680 yeah, I mean most people, I just want to say most of 411 00:31:38.720 --> 00:31:44.039 you will not face this. There were very few that are solely late term 412 00:31:44.200 --> 00:31:48.440 abortion centers, but you will. If you're in one of those destination states, 413 00:31:48.480 --> 00:31:52.279 you may come and meet up with women who are in a later term 414 00:31:52.319 --> 00:31:56.160 abortion, and I think it is important to to read these articles in and 415 00:31:56.240 --> 00:32:00.359 to think about what we've yeah, suggest absolutely, and we love to hear 416 00:32:00.400 --> 00:32:05.279 you guys feedback. Maybe you're listening to this podcast and you've ministered at one 417 00:32:05.279 --> 00:32:07.799 of these late term abortion facilities for a long time. If you've learned some 418 00:32:07.839 --> 00:32:12.160 things that you can teach us, we would love to hear from you, 419 00:32:12.240 --> 00:32:15.680 maybe even interview you and get some wisdom from you, because we've not been 420 00:32:15.720 --> 00:32:19.640 in that scenario. I'm have debt with women that are further along in pregnancy, 421 00:32:19.920 --> 00:32:22.799 twenty weeks plus, right, but, and I know you have to, 422 00:32:22.039 --> 00:32:25.400 but it's not a regular occurrence and we're certainly not ministering out an abortion 423 00:32:25.440 --> 00:32:29.680 clinic that that's all they do, right. So we're speaking from you know, 424 00:32:29.759 --> 00:32:31.319 some knowledge, but not full knowledge of what that might look like. 425 00:32:31.359 --> 00:32:35.039 So if you have a unique perspective on that, we'd love to hear from 426 00:32:35.079 --> 00:32:38.200 you. And if you have any feedback on this episode or other episodes, 427 00:32:38.279 --> 00:32:42.359 please reach out to us. You can reach me Daniel at Love Life Dot 428 00:32:42.480 --> 00:32:45.599 Org. You reach her Vicky at Love Life Dot Org. Also want to 429 00:32:45.599 --> 00:32:49.960 say if you guys could leave us review and whatever service you use for podcasts, 430 00:32:50.599 --> 00:32:54.759 we would really like to get our one point two stars up to four 431 00:32:54.759 --> 00:33:00.559 stars, maybe maybe three stars, because our pro abortion friends have trodde our 432 00:33:00.640 --> 00:33:02.720 reviews. They're still putting reviews out every once in a while. We have 433 00:33:02.799 --> 00:33:07.400 more reviews than any other pro life podcast. Yeah, they just happen to 434 00:33:07.400 --> 00:33:14.640 all be one starry using pro abortion to our pro abortion friends have have really 435 00:33:14.640 --> 00:33:16.519 given us a lot of reviews and if you want to have some fun, 436 00:33:16.799 --> 00:33:22.359 read the reviews. Well, maybe not, they're pretty pretty nasty, but 437 00:33:22.480 --> 00:33:25.480 anyway, leaves a review if you have an opportunity to do that if you 438 00:33:25.480 --> 00:33:30.559 like these podcasts. But until next time, God bless God, bless you 439 00:33:30.599 --> 00:33:43.839 all. Give me our love for love, give me our love for gratitude. 440 00:33:45.880 --> 00:33:54.279 I know it will cost me my life. Nothing's too precious, and 441 00:33:54.599 --> 00:34:05.799 some that you