Nov. 27, 2019

Ministering to Post-abortive Men and Women

Ministering to Post-abortive Men and Women

As pro-lifers we not only have the opportunity to help save lives but also to help restore lives. Thousands of men and women in our churches have been ravaged by abortion in one way or another. Join Daniel as he talks with Pastor Brian Ottinger about...


As pro-lifers we not only have the opportunity to help save lives but also to help restore lives. Thousands of men and women in our churches have been ravaged by abortion in one way or another. Join Daniel as he talks with Pastor Brian Ottinger about ministering healing through the Gospel to those who have abortion in their past.

http://www.convergencechurchnc.com/

www.sidewalks4life.com

 

Transcript
WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.600 --> 00:00:06.440 I Am Yours, I am yours, I am yours and me, Lord, 2 00:00:06.919 --> 00:00:10.949 I am yours. Welcome to the Gospel Center pro life podcast. This 3 00:00:11.070 --> 00:00:13.710 episode we're going to speak with a friend of mine, Pastor Brian Audinger, 4 00:00:13.830 --> 00:00:17.829 of convergence church, about how to reach post aboard of men and women with 5 00:00:17.989 --> 00:00:29.100 the Gospel. Stay tuned, Lord, I felt show passis touch your heart. 6 00:00:34.020 --> 00:00:37.170 All right, we welcome to the Gospel Center pro life podcast. I 7 00:00:37.250 --> 00:00:40.210 appreciate all those who join us today. I have with me a friend of 8 00:00:40.289 --> 00:00:44.130 mine, Pastor Brian Ottinger. He's a pastor of convergence church and he has 9 00:00:44.170 --> 00:00:48.570 a real heart to Minister The Gospel, of course, to anybody, anybody 10 00:00:48.649 --> 00:00:52.920 that that's breathing. He's willing to Minister Gospel to him but also to reach 11 00:00:53.280 --> 00:00:55.880 post aboard of men and women. So we're going to talk a little bit 12 00:00:55.920 --> 00:00:58.439 about that. We're going to talk a little bit about his testimony. So 13 00:00:58.600 --> 00:01:00.840 introduce yourself and kind of introduce some of your heart, Pastor Brian. Yeah, 14 00:01:00.880 --> 00:01:04.790 thanks for having me on the show. Encouraged by you. Yeah, 15 00:01:06.109 --> 00:01:08.109 probably spend the whole hour talking about what what you guys have been doing. 16 00:01:08.230 --> 00:01:12.909 Man's just grateful for you guys, it is by God's grace, and thank 17 00:01:14.189 --> 00:01:15.670 him for connecting us. And allow me to share a little bit of my 18 00:01:15.790 --> 00:01:21.819 story. I'm forty two years old now. I got saved. Excuse me, 19 00:01:21.900 --> 00:01:23.219 I'm forty one years old. Wow, I before you said Yeah, 20 00:01:23.260 --> 00:01:26.459 to use let's you get past forty. It's kind of lose count. So 21 00:01:26.620 --> 00:01:30.019 turning forty two in January, but forty one now. The Lord Save me 22 00:01:30.060 --> 00:01:37.530 when I was thirty two, prior to Christ as savior and Lord of my 23 00:01:37.609 --> 00:01:42.930 life, my sin was and Satan really was the Lord of my life. 24 00:01:42.010 --> 00:01:46.650 Yeah, I mean just in the form of doing whatever I wanted to do, 25 00:01:46.890 --> 00:01:49.319 with whoever wanted to do it with whenever I wanted to do it. 26 00:01:49.439 --> 00:01:52.879 So I was really good at it, and I don't boast in that, 27 00:01:53.000 --> 00:01:55.560 but just to give you a perspective, man, I was. I was 28 00:01:55.599 --> 00:02:00.079 in the world pretty hard and chasing, you know, sex, drugs, 29 00:02:00.120 --> 00:02:05.790 entertainment, yeah, and everything that is involved with those things. And so 30 00:02:06.349 --> 00:02:08.909 the Lord at thirty two and his kindness, he sent one of my old 31 00:02:08.949 --> 00:02:13.949 friends and he shared the good news that that that God is good and His 32 00:02:14.110 --> 00:02:21.860 grace is being poured out on people and the form of Jesus Christ, that 33 00:02:21.979 --> 00:02:24.620 I'm a sinner who needed to be saved from my own sin, the condemnation 34 00:02:24.699 --> 00:02:28.900 that I deserve, rightfully, so place called Hell was reserved for me. 35 00:02:29.060 --> 00:02:32.569 Yeah, if I didn't repent. And in God's kindness, man, Holy 36 00:02:32.610 --> 00:02:37.530 Spirit broke through my heart and heart and I found myself, at thirty two 37 00:02:37.569 --> 00:02:39.449 years old, hitting my knees. Didn't grow up in the church, really 38 00:02:39.490 --> 00:02:44.210 didn't know what to do. Yeah, long backstory to that, but man, 39 00:02:44.250 --> 00:02:49.240 I'm just third story of a town house, wasn't in a church service 40 00:02:49.280 --> 00:02:53.120 or anything. Holy Spirit got a hold of me and I believed in Jesus 41 00:02:53.680 --> 00:03:00.270 and the next couple weeks and months were very interesting. And terms of adding 42 00:03:00.550 --> 00:03:06.469 theology to what that yeah, the Lord was kind to send me men to 43 00:03:06.590 --> 00:03:12.069 lead me to disciple me, men who are passionate about the Gospel, about 44 00:03:12.069 --> 00:03:17.819 the Scriptures, about evangelism, and they told me that's what Christian life looks 45 00:03:17.819 --> 00:03:21.580 like. Now that you're saved. It's our goal to help go save others. 46 00:03:21.620 --> 00:03:25.180 Yeah, through the power of the spirit. And it was only till 47 00:03:25.180 --> 00:03:28.530 I got involved with some church folks. They told me, hey, you 48 00:03:28.650 --> 00:03:30.330 need to chill out, like that's not what you're supposed to do a little 49 00:03:30.330 --> 00:03:34.530 bit. Yeah, just real being a little bit. But Man, by 50 00:03:34.610 --> 00:03:38.050 the Lord's grace, friend of ours, Adam Tenant, we just got done 51 00:03:38.090 --> 00:03:42.280 talking about. Yeah, he told me, Hey, now that you're a 52 00:03:42.280 --> 00:03:45.039 Christian, it's time for stand up for the things that God cares about, 53 00:03:45.639 --> 00:03:49.599 and he brought me out here to the trope. Probably been a Christian that 54 00:03:49.680 --> 00:03:53.319 point for six months and there you right out in the yeah, I've always 55 00:03:53.319 --> 00:03:55.270 been all in. Right, whenever I was doing I was all in. 56 00:03:55.469 --> 00:03:59.310 So I was up for it. I didn't know what I was getting myself 57 00:03:59.349 --> 00:04:01.909 into. I never forget the day we came down here. We were living 58 00:04:01.909 --> 00:04:04.389 in Hunter's bill at the time and it was probably it felt like it was 59 00:04:04.469 --> 00:04:08.990 seventy degrees. I think I had shorts on. Brought the wife and my 60 00:04:09.030 --> 00:04:11.099 kids. Autam said it's a great place to bring your kids, you know. 61 00:04:11.780 --> 00:04:14.740 So I brought the wife. My wife was probably six months pregnant the 62 00:04:14.819 --> 00:04:19.139 time. Okay, brought her and and the kids out and got down here 63 00:04:19.259 --> 00:04:24.970 and it was like we entered into a different world. Yeah, I felt 64 00:04:25.009 --> 00:04:28.290 like it was thirty degrees colder. You could just feel the presence of evil 65 00:04:28.329 --> 00:04:30.810 man in a way. Yeah, and not experience that point. And at 66 00:04:30.850 --> 00:04:33.730 that point I was already doing street evangelism and so on and so forth, 67 00:04:33.810 --> 00:04:38.680 and just a cool you know stories that my wife She's from Columbia, South 68 00:04:38.720 --> 00:04:42.160 America, okay, and South Carolina, said, yeah, everyone always said 69 00:04:42.160 --> 00:04:44.839 South Carolina. She's from South America. She's beautiful, by the way. 70 00:04:44.920 --> 00:04:46.560 She ever watches or listens to this. I love my wife. Grateful for 71 00:04:46.800 --> 00:04:49.600 but the Lord used her in away that day, which rock my world because 72 00:04:49.600 --> 00:04:53.589 at that point I was kind of the mouthpiece. I was sharing the Gospel 73 00:04:53.670 --> 00:04:57.069 everybody, just in my zeal and, because she spoke Spanish. I think 74 00:04:57.069 --> 00:04:59.629 page said Hey, would you mind getting on the MIC? It's Adam's wife. 75 00:04:59.790 --> 00:05:01.149 Adam's wife said, hey, would you come in, and they put 76 00:05:01.149 --> 00:05:03.310 my wife on the mic and they just were telling her what to say and 77 00:05:03.389 --> 00:05:08.300 she was translating in Spanish to a Spanish family that went in hate. Come 78 00:05:08.300 --> 00:05:10.980 out. There's hope for you. There's yeah, there's there's another option and 79 00:05:12.300 --> 00:05:17.579 man, by God's grace, he used my wife that day to for this 80 00:05:17.660 --> 00:05:20.529 family to choose life. Yeah, that's powerful, and I'm over here looking 81 00:05:20.569 --> 00:05:28.529 like like beaux. That point my wife was very let's say immature, but 82 00:05:28.649 --> 00:05:30.769 she was very reserved. Maybe she was very rich, she still reserved, 83 00:05:30.810 --> 00:05:33.689 but she was just very young in the faith and she she wasn't outspoken at 84 00:05:33.689 --> 00:05:36.199 all for the Gospel at that point. So to see the Lord use her 85 00:05:36.240 --> 00:05:41.800 and lay maybe timid. Yeah, it's timid, just I don't know. 86 00:05:41.839 --> 00:05:44.639 Yeah, yeah, timid's good word. So, anyways, the Lord Jesus. 87 00:05:44.720 --> 00:05:48.160 Yeah, the Lord used it. I'm I'M A, I'm a blended 88 00:05:48.240 --> 00:05:50.269 we part of a blended family. So what I met my wife, I 89 00:05:50.670 --> 00:05:55.589 had one son and she had to and a few years actually, what she 90 00:05:55.670 --> 00:06:00.149 was pregnant at that point. And and so I remember when she got pregnant, 91 00:06:00.670 --> 00:06:03.819 you know, I started to realize the weight of what I had done. 92 00:06:03.860 --> 00:06:06.980 Yeah, in my past I was a post excume me, I was 93 00:06:06.980 --> 00:06:10.620 a I'm a post to board, a father. But at that point I 94 00:06:11.500 --> 00:06:16.060 started realizing man like it almost felt like the unforgivable sin. Yeah, to 95 00:06:16.180 --> 00:06:20.089 me was because I realized when I was in the world and I wasn't a 96 00:06:20.089 --> 00:06:25.009 Christian, I didn't give two thoughts about if it was a life. I 97 00:06:25.050 --> 00:06:28.930 could care less. Yeah, I didn't even consider the arguments of is it 98 00:06:29.050 --> 00:06:31.410 life, is it a Glob of cells. All I do is that a 99 00:06:31.490 --> 00:06:33.720 girl got pregnant, came to me, she told me she's pregnant, and 100 00:06:33.959 --> 00:06:38.319 my only response was to go get rid of the problem. Yeah, that 101 00:06:38.600 --> 00:06:43.160 was my mindset, and that happened at least twice, if not a few 102 00:06:43.199 --> 00:06:46.680 more times. Some of it's a little blurry and foggy. I mean that's 103 00:06:46.800 --> 00:06:50.470 that's how out there I was. But as a Christian who had a pregnant 104 00:06:50.509 --> 00:06:57.949 wife, now, I thought that God was going to punish me. MMM, 105 00:06:59.350 --> 00:07:02.060 I thought that I didn't the baby was going to maybe die in the 106 00:07:02.100 --> 00:07:06.699 womb or come out maybe defective. Yes, yeah, sure, probably weird 107 00:07:06.699 --> 00:07:11.660 word for it, but I just felt like, because of my past sin, 108 00:07:11.819 --> 00:07:14.540 like this was something that God was going to hold against me. Yeah, 109 00:07:15.220 --> 00:07:17.810 and I'm up until the point of Lucas, who's now seven years old, 110 00:07:17.850 --> 00:07:21.529 up until the point of his birth. And so when he came out 111 00:07:23.769 --> 00:07:27.290 the womb, I don't know if you've seen kids who are like gasping for 112 00:07:27.410 --> 00:07:30.720 air, their bodies are purple. Yeah, like when he came out the 113 00:07:30.759 --> 00:07:34.920 womb and I was I was I felt like something's wrong with him. M 114 00:07:35.360 --> 00:07:38.480 and at that moment I was like, man, this is just what I 115 00:07:38.600 --> 00:07:41.600 was going to bear. Yeah, and then, and then a few seconds 116 00:07:41.600 --> 00:07:45.870 later, he turned to deep read or pig or whatever, started crying and 117 00:07:46.310 --> 00:07:48.269 doctors like you have a healthy baby boy, and I was like Whoa. 118 00:07:48.550 --> 00:07:51.389 Yeah, you know, but you know one sense, I mean that mentality 119 00:07:53.310 --> 00:07:57.350 and I want to say it's a it's a fully biblical mentality. But we, 120 00:07:57.790 --> 00:08:01.939 we are all undeserving of the good gifts that God absolutely, because all 121 00:08:01.980 --> 00:08:07.899 of our past are tainted with sin and rebellion against God. Man, but 122 00:08:07.060 --> 00:08:09.620 part of you, know, I just know, part of your heart is 123 00:08:11.259 --> 00:08:15.889 sort of ministering from the way the Lord has done a work in your life 124 00:08:16.129 --> 00:08:20.490 and where he's brought you from and minister into other guys and even even ladies 125 00:08:20.930 --> 00:08:24.610 in you know, a pastoral capacity. You get all kinds of stuff that's 126 00:08:24.689 --> 00:08:28.800 throwing your way and you get these opportunities really bring people from a place of 127 00:08:28.959 --> 00:08:33.879 brokenness and a place of just mistrusting God and mistrust him whatever to a place 128 00:08:33.960 --> 00:08:37.600 of healing. Yeah, man, so talk a little bit about sort of 129 00:08:37.639 --> 00:08:41.309 the springboard of your past and how that sort of sprung you into, you 130 00:08:41.389 --> 00:08:46.789 know, bringing people to a place of healing and reaching people with the Gospel 131 00:08:46.990 --> 00:08:50.309 and with, you know, with God's ability to heal. Yeah, it's 132 00:08:50.389 --> 00:08:54.149 great question. I'm glad I got to share some of the earlier stuff because 133 00:08:54.149 --> 00:08:58.179 it really had some contact to yeah, the next part. But I've always 134 00:08:58.620 --> 00:09:01.980 firmly believed, I mean, scriptures true and God's words infallible, right. 135 00:09:03.019 --> 00:09:07.019 But said Corinthians, one says the God of All Comfort Comfort you to comfort 136 00:09:07.059 --> 00:09:11.929 others in their suffering. Yeah, and so I remember about about a year 137 00:09:11.970 --> 00:09:13.169 after I got saved. I remember I was on fire for the Lord the 138 00:09:13.250 --> 00:09:20.289 first year and I remember one day hit me up started become a little depressed 139 00:09:20.889 --> 00:09:24.360 because I started thinking back to my past. was rugged. Yeah, I 140 00:09:24.399 --> 00:09:28.559 had suicidal thoughts. I was many broken relationship, heard a lot of people. 141 00:09:28.559 --> 00:09:31.440 I was hurt along the way, and so I started in my mind 142 00:09:31.480 --> 00:09:35.559 questioning the goodness of God. Yeah, you know, why would a good 143 00:09:35.600 --> 00:09:37.990 God allow me to go through these things for thirty two years? I mean, 144 00:09:37.990 --> 00:09:41.230 yes, I'm glad I'm saved and having a brand new heart and new 145 00:09:41.269 --> 00:09:45.149 eternity and all that stuff great, but man, there's some real pain I 146 00:09:45.230 --> 00:09:48.549 experience. And Yeah, brother Actually Justin Edwards for years. Yeah, he 147 00:09:48.629 --> 00:09:52.470 shared Seton Corinthians one with me and it changed my outlook. Is like, 148 00:09:52.509 --> 00:09:56.580 man, God's given me a testimony, and so I started having an understanding 149 00:09:56.659 --> 00:10:01.860 of that. But it wasn't until week forty and I've been coming out to 150 00:10:01.860 --> 00:10:05.539 the abortion milling and doing some some ministry with cities for life and the tenants 151 00:10:05.580 --> 00:10:09.129 and others. But likely going through some pictures some months ago, I think 152 00:10:09.129 --> 00:10:13.090 I sent you the picture, but it's like, I don't remember. It 153 00:10:13.330 --> 00:10:16.970 was back in two thousand and I mean it was probably shortly after you got 154 00:10:16.049 --> 00:10:18.129 saved, maybe the first couple of times you've come out. I was like 155 00:10:18.529 --> 00:10:22.559 that's that's passed a yeah, it was us a lot thunder back then. 156 00:10:22.600 --> 00:10:24.200 You're a lot of thanner. Yeah, I was too. Well, I 157 00:10:24.399 --> 00:10:26.919 was a lot more baby faced. I guess it was. You probably had 158 00:10:26.960 --> 00:10:30.600 less gray hair. I had less gray hairs. You had gray hair back 159 00:10:30.639 --> 00:10:31.960 then. To them it was kind of a block where you one of Tho 160 00:10:33.000 --> 00:10:35.710 guys who started getting gray hair in high school? Yeah, pretty much, 161 00:10:35.230 --> 00:10:37.789 but anyway, yes, so you say, yeah, yeah, better have 162 00:10:37.870 --> 00:10:41.669 gray hair than though here. Yeah, so, man. Yeah, so 163 00:10:41.750 --> 00:10:48.070 I've been coming out and I understood and in my theological background, in my 164 00:10:48.190 --> 00:10:54.659 denomination, real heavy emphasis on good hermoneutics, but good biblical Hermoneutics. Yeah, 165 00:10:54.700 --> 00:10:58.980 we want to understand the context of scripture. We want to understand that 166 00:10:58.059 --> 00:11:01.419 we're saved by grace alone, through faithfulone in Christ alone, for God's glory 167 00:11:01.419 --> 00:11:07.450 alone. We know it through the scripture alone. And I would say well, 168 00:11:07.490 --> 00:11:11.649 well intended, but under emphasis on healing. Yeah, and deliverance. 169 00:11:13.250 --> 00:11:16.210 And so at week forty, the first year they did it, I was 170 00:11:16.250 --> 00:11:18.799 actually step life. Yeah, so love life, Super Skeptical of the ministry 171 00:11:20.200 --> 00:11:22.480 in general. Who are these goodlooking guys? And, yeah, and these 172 00:11:22.559 --> 00:11:26.559 hipsters and yeah, hipsters, and and these soft colored shirts, even though 173 00:11:26.559 --> 00:11:31.600 I think we both have on like soft colored shirts today. Maybe, maybe 174 00:11:31.679 --> 00:11:33.070 not, but it is a strong colored sure. Isn't what you're talking about? 175 00:11:33.070 --> 00:11:35.070 Yeah, is this? Yeah, I don't know. Blue. I 176 00:11:35.149 --> 00:11:37.750 like T tario. So we're good. There's a baby blue baby shower right 177 00:11:37.789 --> 00:11:41.230 there. But yeah, man, just seeing these guys are being skeptical, 178 00:11:41.389 --> 00:11:46.179 skeptical of their ministry, not primarily because of their good looks and they're soft 179 00:11:46.220 --> 00:11:52.500 blue shirts, but because they weren't preaching the Gospel explicitly. Yeah, they 180 00:11:52.539 --> 00:11:58.220 were praying and worshiping. I'm like, what's up with that and somebody connected 181 00:11:58.259 --> 00:12:01.419 me with Andre. went out for lunch and I think it was me. 182 00:12:01.610 --> 00:12:03.490 Man, was it you? Was it feather? You definitely was like the 183 00:12:03.529 --> 00:12:07.210 Holy Spirit just connected you, just getting active. So so somebody connected me 184 00:12:07.370 --> 00:12:11.250 Andre. Okay, excuse me, Daniel, you connect me with Andre. 185 00:12:11.090 --> 00:12:15.960 And I wasn't, I wasn't not going to come out, but I wasn't 186 00:12:15.960 --> 00:12:18.840 like excited about it, for say, because I knew the good work the 187 00:12:18.919 --> 00:12:22.639 cities for life was doing, knew the good work that other ministries were doing. 188 00:12:22.720 --> 00:12:26.840 And remember talking Andrea said all y'all doing is just praying. MM. 189 00:12:28.799 --> 00:12:31.870 And he said what do you mean, brother? He said don't you believe 190 00:12:31.909 --> 00:12:37.110 in the power of prayer? And it hit me. I've been a Christian 191 00:12:37.149 --> 00:12:41.269 this point for five years, maybe six, and when you asked me that 192 00:12:41.309 --> 00:12:45.580 question I realized that I didn't. I didn't believe in the Po of prayer. 193 00:12:45.620 --> 00:12:48.980 Yeah, that if I thought that that prayer was some sort of, 194 00:12:52.740 --> 00:12:54.860 you know, unpowerful tool that God had given the church, that was something 195 00:12:56.059 --> 00:12:58.500 or for me was I we could do that in a prayer closet. So 196 00:12:58.570 --> 00:13:00.330 we're going to go out. That about the thing. I was like, 197 00:13:00.330 --> 00:13:01.090 we're going to go out there. We need to preach the Gospel. That's 198 00:13:01.090 --> 00:13:05.889 the way of salvation, like and just really undermining the work of the spirit 199 00:13:05.970 --> 00:13:09.529 through prayer. And so that challenged me and so I came out on week 200 00:13:09.570 --> 00:13:13.320 forty, brought a couple guys from our church and brought a few of my 201 00:13:13.440 --> 00:13:18.399 sons. I five boys and my oldest son during week forty. Either you 202 00:13:18.440 --> 00:13:22.960 know, this great experience or praising, worshiping. You're they're talking about words 203 00:13:24.000 --> 00:13:26.720 of healing and deliverance. Some oldest son looked at me that day and he 204 00:13:26.799 --> 00:13:30.669 said that have you ever had an abortion? Now, I don't remember if 205 00:13:30.669 --> 00:13:33.309 we ever had the conversation before, but I've never been as clear as it 206 00:13:33.470 --> 00:13:37.230 was that day that I looked at him with tears of my eyes and told 207 00:13:37.269 --> 00:13:41.110 him yes, I had, and I'm start crying and he started crying with 208 00:13:41.230 --> 00:13:43.500 me. Yeah, and next thing I know he's hugging me, my oldest 209 00:13:43.539 --> 00:13:46.779 son. I start thinking about, you know, my children in heaven that 210 00:13:46.860 --> 00:13:50.100 I, you know, sent to the slaughter yeah, and man, I 211 00:13:50.259 --> 00:13:54.539 just broke down and started crying and so crying with him. Other son comes 212 00:13:54.580 --> 00:13:58.409 over, we start crying. Dues from the church come over and I don't 213 00:13:58.409 --> 00:14:01.769 even know if they knew why. They start crying with us weep and yeah, 214 00:14:01.809 --> 00:14:05.889 man, and so the Lord really that day, I believe he initiated 215 00:14:05.970 --> 00:14:13.120 a major movement of healing in my life. And soon after, you know, 216 00:14:13.320 --> 00:14:15.799 meet with Andrea and Justin, who are now good friends of mine and 217 00:14:15.960 --> 00:14:18.799 yours as well. I told them my story about how the Lord healed me 218 00:14:18.919 --> 00:14:24.470 and just uniquely, I don't think there's probably a lot of pastors who have 219 00:14:24.549 --> 00:14:28.549 that testimony. Yeah, and you know, what we can look at is 220 00:14:28.669 --> 00:14:33.750 a painful, you know, post Christian life the Lord will use to glorify 221 00:14:33.830 --> 00:14:37.110 himself and help bring healing to others. And so they were really adamant about 222 00:14:37.110 --> 00:14:41.500 me sharing that story and they and I was really adamant to share that story 223 00:14:41.500 --> 00:14:45.259 as well. I've never been quick to turn out opportunity to declare the glory 224 00:14:45.299 --> 00:14:48.019 of God. Yeah, and so I think the next year at love life, 225 00:14:48.019 --> 00:14:52.049 I begin sharing that testimony on Saturday mornings and I got to go into 226 00:14:52.090 --> 00:14:56.370 some churches and talk about it and then really just begin to personally heal. 227 00:14:56.730 --> 00:15:00.370 And then to realize, man, as I looked at the landscape of, 228 00:15:01.570 --> 00:15:03.250 you know, my wife and other Christians, that there was a lot of 229 00:15:03.330 --> 00:15:09.159 Christians who had had abortions. Yeah, and so you know, we're a 230 00:15:09.279 --> 00:15:11.799 messed up bunch man, apart from the grace of God, you know, 231 00:15:11.879 --> 00:15:16.399 we're kind of like, you know, with David in the in the men 232 00:15:16.480 --> 00:15:20.840 who come to stand with David when he was running away from saw, it 233 00:15:20.879 --> 00:15:24.309 says they were basically that the indebted, the the rejects of society. That's 234 00:15:24.389 --> 00:15:30.070 that's the Church of Jesus Christ. Now, yeah, we're rejects of society, 235 00:15:30.190 --> 00:15:31.950 but we're embraced by by the Lord and we're changed by the power of 236 00:15:33.029 --> 00:15:35.779 a spirit. And those men became what David's mighty men. Ye, right, 237 00:15:35.899 --> 00:15:39.019 yeah, and that cool. Well, the Lord David Himself, I 238 00:15:39.100 --> 00:15:41.419 mean, yeah, he's like a man after God's own heart and he was 239 00:15:41.460 --> 00:15:45.700 a adulters murder like you missed us, so h so, yeah, man, 240 00:15:45.779 --> 00:15:48.659 that the Bible is quite I want to touch him one point you just 241 00:15:48.700 --> 00:15:50.490 came to mind, which I think is pretty cool and it's maybe a rabbit 242 00:15:50.529 --> 00:15:54.490 trail, but I think this will help others. When you said your son 243 00:15:54.210 --> 00:15:56.690 just turned to you and howld you, how would your sign that time? 244 00:15:56.889 --> 00:16:00.929 That point he was probably thirteen or fourteen yeah, so I remember. Do 245 00:16:00.970 --> 00:16:03.649 you remember how long love life's been in existence? So it was two thousand 246 00:16:03.690 --> 00:16:04.720 and sixteen, I think, was our first prayer walk. Okay, so 247 00:16:06.039 --> 00:16:08.600 he was was that three years ago? He's sixteen, Thirteen. Yeah, 248 00:16:10.159 --> 00:16:14.360 so I'm thinking how would this young man know the turn to his dad and 249 00:16:14.440 --> 00:16:17.039 ask him that question. Dad, if you ever had an abortion? Obviously 250 00:16:17.080 --> 00:16:19.029 the implications. You ever taken someone to have an abortion or paid for an 251 00:16:19.070 --> 00:16:23.029 abortion? And I think it's this is important for us as dad's that, 252 00:16:23.230 --> 00:16:27.029 you know, we don't have to share every golry gruesome detail of our lives 253 00:16:27.070 --> 00:16:30.710 and our past, but we need to be sharing on a regular basis with 254 00:16:30.830 --> 00:16:33.340 our kids a testimony what we were. Yeah, and I'll bet you you 255 00:16:33.820 --> 00:16:37.299 cheered with him kind of what you were, where you came from, and 256 00:16:37.340 --> 00:16:38.259 it was sort of to him as like well, my dad's done this, 257 00:16:38.460 --> 00:16:41.179 he's done that. Yeah, but I bet this might be in his past 258 00:16:41.299 --> 00:16:45.259 to that kind of how that how that played out? Well, you know, 259 00:16:45.500 --> 00:16:48.409 so thirty two years of of and I'm but I wasn't just like a 260 00:16:51.090 --> 00:16:53.289 kind of halfway center, like I was full on, like we're all full 261 00:16:53.409 --> 00:16:56.529 on. But I know what you mean. But everyone that knew me knew 262 00:16:56.529 --> 00:16:59.129 what I was about. I was about drinking, drugging, you know, 263 00:16:59.850 --> 00:17:02.159 pouring around part whatever it was, man, that's what I was about. 264 00:17:02.279 --> 00:17:06.039 Yeah, and so because I had thirty two years of that, it's I've 265 00:17:06.079 --> 00:17:08.079 only been living less than ten years under the blood of Christ. Yeah, 266 00:17:08.119 --> 00:17:11.359 and so I can't forget my testimony. Yeah, like, whether it's through, 267 00:17:12.960 --> 00:17:17.349 you know, seeing things or hearing things or smelling things, like, 268 00:17:17.470 --> 00:17:19.829 I'm reminded constantly of who I used to be. Yeah, and and so, 269 00:17:21.269 --> 00:17:23.869 by the grace of God, when Satan reminds me who I used to 270 00:17:23.869 --> 00:17:26.789 be, I remind him of who I am now, and he reminds me 271 00:17:26.829 --> 00:17:30.220 of my past, I remind him of my future a man. And so, 272 00:17:30.140 --> 00:17:33.660 yeah, we've never skirted away from from sharing with our kids, and 273 00:17:33.740 --> 00:17:37.859 even as a Christian now, who who? Maybe I'm not like doing a 274 00:17:37.980 --> 00:17:41.900 cocaine and sewing and so forth, but man, I still mess up around 275 00:17:41.900 --> 00:17:45.490 my kids. Yeah, and there's Times where dad gets angry, or there's 276 00:17:45.529 --> 00:17:52.970 Times where dad maybe was passive, or there was times where dad has chose 277 00:17:52.210 --> 00:17:56.730 himself over his children. Yeah, and so I use those opportunities to go 278 00:17:56.730 --> 00:17:57.839 to my kids and say I'm sorry. Yeah, this, I didn't. 279 00:17:57.839 --> 00:18:00.480 I didn't. I wasn't being Christ like. Yeah, and so, yeah, 280 00:18:00.519 --> 00:18:07.160 we don't hesitate to ask for forgiveness and to share our sinfulness, because 281 00:18:07.240 --> 00:18:11.359 it only leads us to basking the glory of God even so much more so. 282 00:18:11.519 --> 00:18:15.549 Another rabbit trail on how long you got on this podcast, but thirty 283 00:18:15.589 --> 00:18:21.230 four. Yeah, yes, to two nights ago my two youngest came to 284 00:18:21.309 --> 00:18:26.349 my room and they were arguing about something. And there's five years old and 285 00:18:26.390 --> 00:18:30.059 seven years old, Moses and Lucas, and I've got a Moses. I 286 00:18:30.180 --> 00:18:33.220 got a Moses Bro Yeah, yeah, we'll see how he lives out that 287 00:18:33.259 --> 00:18:37.539 name. said. Doesn't have the staff yet, but he's working on it. 288 00:18:37.660 --> 00:18:41.049 So but men that they got to come in my room and I forget 289 00:18:41.049 --> 00:18:45.890 what happened specifically, but there was some sins, some tension between those two. 290 00:18:45.529 --> 00:18:48.769 I just said Hey, come sit down beside me and I walked him 291 00:18:48.809 --> 00:18:49.690 through what it meant to be a man and what it meant to be a 292 00:18:49.730 --> 00:18:53.049 leader. I pointed back to Adam and said if Adam would have been doing 293 00:18:53.130 --> 00:18:56.359 his job and leading as a man like we wouldn't even had this in the 294 00:18:56.400 --> 00:19:00.240 first place. Yeah, like Adam drop the ball, and that's why eve 295 00:19:00.279 --> 00:19:07.440 ate of the fruit, and and so through that I'm trying to remember why 296 00:19:07.440 --> 00:19:10.910 I got rabbit trailed. Well, you're talking about but ring board. Yeah, 297 00:19:11.230 --> 00:19:12.430 and so then I got to tell them back, you know, because 298 00:19:12.430 --> 00:19:15.349 we just got off week forty last weekend, and I got to share with 299 00:19:15.470 --> 00:19:18.390 them. I said, listen, if it wasn't for the grace of God, 300 00:19:18.470 --> 00:19:21.430 we're all sinners, but if it wasn't for the grace of God that 301 00:19:21.509 --> 00:19:25.619 genesis is three fifteen. Promise you two wouldn't be here. Yeah, like 302 00:19:25.779 --> 00:19:29.579 Moma and I wouldn't even be together. And so I don't want them to 303 00:19:30.059 --> 00:19:32.700 wallow in their sin, but to say, Hey, because of God we 304 00:19:32.859 --> 00:19:36.339 are, yeah, because of God we can and because of God we will. 305 00:19:36.339 --> 00:19:38.690 Yeah. And so yes, we sometimes we need to meditate on our 306 00:19:38.690 --> 00:19:42.410 sinfulness and not just think we're God's gift to the world, we've done nothing 307 00:19:42.490 --> 00:19:45.250 wrong, that we don't deserve this grace. But he's given it his grace 308 00:19:45.329 --> 00:19:48.970 and he's given us and empowered us to live and empowered life now and then 309 00:19:48.970 --> 00:19:55.440 for the future. And because of God's grace I now have Moses and Lucas. 310 00:19:55.480 --> 00:19:57.599 Yeah, yeah, and they've they're seeing a mother and father who love 311 00:19:57.720 --> 00:20:03.920 each other IM perfectly, who mess up as parents frequently but quick to say 312 00:20:03.960 --> 00:20:07.150 hey, I'm wrong, we you forgive me and God's graces sufficient. So, 313 00:20:07.230 --> 00:20:10.670 yeah, yeah, and so you know, you just in the realm 314 00:20:10.710 --> 00:20:15.710 of ministry as a pastor and then sort of the Lord using your past, 315 00:20:15.910 --> 00:20:18.869 you know, minister your kids, also to minister to others and ministering in 316 00:20:18.950 --> 00:20:22.339 particular to post aboard of father. Yeah, men share some of those stories 317 00:20:22.460 --> 00:20:26.220 or share some of your heart as far as minister and the post aboard of 318 00:20:26.299 --> 00:20:30.180 men. Because, you know, people think that it's just women that are 319 00:20:30.180 --> 00:20:33.500 affected by abortion, it's just women in the church that have had abortions, 320 00:20:33.819 --> 00:20:37.089 which, you know, the statistics are one third of all women in United 321 00:20:37.130 --> 00:20:40.730 States of America have had an abortion. Probably even higher within the church. 322 00:20:40.809 --> 00:20:44.089 I don't know exactly, but at least one third of the women that you're 323 00:20:44.130 --> 00:20:45.769 preaching to, yeah, have been affected by abortion. Yeah, but we 324 00:20:45.890 --> 00:20:51.200 often do affect forget about the men. They're affected by abortion. That's thing 325 00:20:51.519 --> 00:20:55.119 is like. You know, it's like a snake, slither's where ever you 326 00:20:55.200 --> 00:20:57.400 can go and just devours whatever it can. You know, to talk about 327 00:20:57.400 --> 00:21:00.400 the ministry to post able to fathers. Yeah, man, I mean it's 328 00:21:00.440 --> 00:21:07.750 messy. It's messy because if you're plowing a field, you know, when 329 00:21:07.750 --> 00:21:10.470 you start plowing the field, and I'm not a farmer at all. I 330 00:21:10.630 --> 00:21:12.589 don't know if you are, I'm not, but tried, I've been if 331 00:21:12.630 --> 00:21:15.710 dad when I tried to cultivate it, and because it's hard. It's hard 332 00:21:15.750 --> 00:21:18.549 work, right, hard work. Yeah, and got to stick with it. 333 00:21:18.579 --> 00:21:27.339 So the women, they're usually it's usually it's not hard to maybe get 334 00:21:27.380 --> 00:21:30.460 them to tap back into that moment because they were in the room. Yeah, 335 00:21:30.660 --> 00:21:34.170 they physically had things done to them and the men was absent from that. 336 00:21:34.369 --> 00:21:38.250 Yeah, and I think just in our society in general, the way 337 00:21:38.329 --> 00:21:41.970 God's design the family is that the man is supposed to lead. In our 338 00:21:41.089 --> 00:21:45.049 society says, Hey, who, do whatever you want to do. Yeah, 339 00:21:45.410 --> 00:21:48.240 women can lead and men. Just saw a picture yesterday of a woman 340 00:21:49.200 --> 00:21:52.359 proposing to a man and she was on one knee and he stand there getting 341 00:21:52.359 --> 00:21:56.000 the ring, and I that's a and so we live in a society that 342 00:21:56.480 --> 00:22:00.470 that calls meat vegetables and cause vegetables meat and women can be men if they 343 00:22:00.509 --> 00:22:03.509 want to. And identifies whatever they want, down and down as up. 344 00:22:03.549 --> 00:22:07.990 It's just so yeah, it's so scattered. And so when you start getting 345 00:22:07.990 --> 00:22:11.269 back to the biblical rolls of men and women, we have to we have 346 00:22:11.349 --> 00:22:14.789 to drudge through all that. We got to plow those fields and say we 347 00:22:15.069 --> 00:22:18.019 don't care what culture says. Right, because cultures say man, be strong, 348 00:22:18.539 --> 00:22:22.460 pull, pull yourself up by the bootstraps and move on and not deal 349 00:22:22.579 --> 00:22:25.539 with, yeah, the pain of your heart. And so, going back 350 00:22:25.579 --> 00:22:27.619 to your question is, what has it been like? Well, I've ministered 351 00:22:27.700 --> 00:22:33.130 to several men and some of these men have abortions from thirty years ago. 352 00:22:33.250 --> 00:22:36.690 Yeah, and so the hard part is to get them to go back, 353 00:22:36.730 --> 00:22:42.690 yeah, right, to get them to go back and and and see the 354 00:22:42.849 --> 00:22:52.240 reality of that moment and the reality of their failed responsibility. They're failed action 355 00:22:53.359 --> 00:22:57.630 or even there, whether it's their complacency or they're pushing the woman to do 356 00:22:57.710 --> 00:23:02.150 it. Yeah, and then dealing with it at that moment, because you 357 00:23:02.190 --> 00:23:04.190 can't deal with you can't move on till you've done with the past. You 358 00:23:04.269 --> 00:23:07.549 want to live in the past, but you got to deal with that moment. 359 00:23:07.670 --> 00:23:11.390 Yeah, and so the hard part for for you know, post aboard 360 00:23:11.430 --> 00:23:14.339 of fathers that we've been taught all our life is that we need to be 361 00:23:14.420 --> 00:23:18.299 tough and just keep moving on. And so this thing extends past abortion. 362 00:23:18.339 --> 00:23:21.380 I know that's the purpose of this, but but men in general have been 363 00:23:21.380 --> 00:23:26.180 abused sexually, physically mentally at early ages. Yeah, and we just been 364 00:23:26.220 --> 00:23:27.529 taught, Hey, we got to keep it moving. But until we go 365 00:23:27.730 --> 00:23:32.450 back to those moments and see our failure and action, whether it's, you 366 00:23:32.529 --> 00:23:37.170 know again for against apathy or pushing, until we get back to that moment, 367 00:23:37.210 --> 00:23:40.089 we're not going to we're not going to move on. So that's the 368 00:23:40.170 --> 00:23:42.160 hard part. Yeah, for men because, like again we just been talking. 369 00:23:42.359 --> 00:23:45.240 Do you find that? Because you know, just in my experience at 370 00:23:45.240 --> 00:23:48.200 the abortion clanking up, talk to men and you've been there and you've talked 371 00:23:48.200 --> 00:23:52.400 to man. We've probably even ministered together some men at the abortion clinic. 372 00:23:52.440 --> 00:23:56.630 There you find a lot of apathy, but you also find a lot of 373 00:23:56.670 --> 00:23:59.470 brokenness even within the men. I mean some of them are coercing her to 374 00:23:59.549 --> 00:24:03.029 having a passionate but but the majority of men that I've talked to have taken 375 00:24:03.029 --> 00:24:06.349 the attitude of well, if it was up to me, she wouldn't have 376 00:24:06.390 --> 00:24:07.710 the abortion, but it's her body, her choice, and of course the 377 00:24:07.750 --> 00:24:11.819 implication was that her body, her choice, her fault, her problem, 378 00:24:11.940 --> 00:24:15.140 she bears the weight of it. Yeah, but they're still feeling some guilt 379 00:24:15.180 --> 00:24:18.859 there. But do you find that that maybe they some men, in order 380 00:24:18.859 --> 00:24:22.059 to make themselves feel less guilty or feel sort of like they weren't a part 381 00:24:22.059 --> 00:24:25.809 of it, do sort of push that off on the woman, like, 382 00:24:25.930 --> 00:24:27.210 you know, I didn't really want her to do it, but she did 383 00:24:27.289 --> 00:24:30.809 it, and so they're trying to shirk the guilt that they actually feel, 384 00:24:30.930 --> 00:24:33.410 yeah, by blaming it on her. Do you find that to be the 385 00:24:33.490 --> 00:24:37.049 case's go back to scripture. Right, Huh, kind of. What is 386 00:24:37.089 --> 00:24:41.119 that? Amy And hey, this is the woman you gave me. Yeah, 387 00:24:41.279 --> 00:24:42.799 it's like no, dude, you had a responsibility. Yeah, and 388 00:24:44.000 --> 00:24:48.519 so, whether it's abortion or whatever, since we're dealing with it's the man's 389 00:24:48.559 --> 00:24:52.829 responsibility, right, doesn't it doesn't usurp that or negate that the woman has 390 00:24:52.869 --> 00:24:56.829 a responsibility as well, or the children. Absolute the man's been called to 391 00:24:56.869 --> 00:25:00.470 lead. Yeah, and so I've been out there on the sidewalks and it 392 00:25:00.789 --> 00:25:06.630 sounds harsh to say hey, hey, brother or hey fella, yeah, 393 00:25:06.750 --> 00:25:08.700 like if you don't go stand up, you're being a coward. Yeah, 394 00:25:10.140 --> 00:25:12.619 and man, that sounds harsh, but it's true. It is, it's 395 00:25:12.700 --> 00:25:19.819 true, and the reality is as the as the abortive father. Years ago, 396 00:25:21.809 --> 00:25:23.490 I was being a coward, like I was. I had to deal 397 00:25:23.569 --> 00:25:29.809 with my cowardlessness. I want. I preferred comfort over responsibility. My responsibility 398 00:25:29.890 --> 00:25:33.089 to myself was having fun. Yeah, and this is just an accident that 399 00:25:33.170 --> 00:25:37.119 happened and a problem. You got a problem I got to take care of. 400 00:25:37.200 --> 00:25:40.039 It's going to get in the way of, you know, her life 401 00:25:40.039 --> 00:25:41.480 or my life, because I don't plan on being with her anyways. Yeah, 402 00:25:41.839 --> 00:25:45.880 yeah, just, yeah, man, in general, man, we 403 00:25:47.759 --> 00:25:52.390 we like to blame shift and people who don't have the Holy Spirit. You 404 00:25:52.470 --> 00:25:56.109 can't fault them for that because they don't know any better. In a sense, 405 00:25:56.109 --> 00:26:00.190 I mean the stull the responsibility to take responsibility, but it's just the 406 00:26:00.269 --> 00:26:03.630 it's the default, yeah, for our society, is to blame others. 407 00:26:03.829 --> 00:26:04.779 Yeah, you know, we don't like the way society goes. Blame the 408 00:26:04.819 --> 00:26:10.539 president. Yeah, we don't like the way the sandwich tasted. Blame who, 409 00:26:10.700 --> 00:26:12.539 like you, probably blame the chef for that. But but you know, 410 00:26:12.619 --> 00:26:15.500 I'm saying, like we lame the mayonnaise company. Yeah, we can 411 00:26:15.539 --> 00:26:17.539 blame everybody. Yeah, it's like you don't want to cook it, Bro 412 00:26:17.740 --> 00:26:22.650 Yeah, yeah, yeah, just so, how don't you go away? 413 00:26:22.809 --> 00:26:25.529 Yeah, well, and less. Yeah, unless the Holy Spirit comes in 414 00:26:25.650 --> 00:26:26.450 and does his work, which is sort of that. You know, that 415 00:26:26.690 --> 00:26:30.609 is the focus of this podcast. You're talking about pro life stuff and talk 416 00:26:30.650 --> 00:26:32.880 about, you know, abortion, but it is always in light of the 417 00:26:32.960 --> 00:26:37.519 Gospel and what God has done, obviously in our hearts, what God has 418 00:26:37.559 --> 00:26:40.359 done in your heart. We minister out of that. You know, I 419 00:26:40.440 --> 00:26:44.160 have a story. I've shared it in a previous podcast, my my past 420 00:26:44.279 --> 00:26:47.869 and how the Lord took me from a father at seventeen years old. My 421 00:26:47.990 --> 00:26:51.069 wife got pretty if you know, my wife was pregnant in high school, 422 00:26:51.269 --> 00:26:55.230 sixteen, I was seventeen. Our baby was born when I turned eighteen and 423 00:26:56.910 --> 00:26:59.150 then, you know, we have a twenty one year old daughter now and 424 00:26:59.349 --> 00:27:02.740 God has really done a work in our lives through that. That's actually what 425 00:27:02.859 --> 00:27:06.500 the Lord used to bring me to himself, is that unwanted pregnancy situation. 426 00:27:07.180 --> 00:27:08.460 So I minister out of that. I minister out of what the Lord has 427 00:27:08.500 --> 00:27:11.619 done in my heart. You know, freely you have received, so freely 428 00:27:11.700 --> 00:27:15.460 give, Jesus said, and you men are shadow that same thing. So 429 00:27:15.660 --> 00:27:18.890 talked then, if you can, about the healing you. So you talked 430 00:27:18.930 --> 00:27:21.569 a little bit about it. Love Life, yeah, and how the Lord, 431 00:27:21.849 --> 00:27:25.769 I guess, confronted you in that sin but also brought you know, 432 00:27:26.049 --> 00:27:29.130 a brokenness. You know, we don't we don't begin with God until we 433 00:27:29.170 --> 00:27:30.400 end up with ourselves. Right, we got to be done with ourselves and 434 00:27:32.000 --> 00:27:33.680 even in our Christian lives. So we've got to lay it down right, 435 00:27:33.720 --> 00:27:37.559 we've got to lay down and we go from glory to glory by laying stuff 436 00:27:37.599 --> 00:27:41.440 down good and and it seems like that week forty and two thousand and sixteen 437 00:27:41.599 --> 00:27:45.589 when the Lord did that for you. As far as the abortions in the 438 00:27:45.630 --> 00:27:48.430 past, yeah, so talk about how the Lord has brought you from that 439 00:27:48.549 --> 00:27:51.430 point of brokenness to healing. And then, you know, you've already talked 440 00:27:51.430 --> 00:27:53.269 a little bit about ministering to others. Maybe you share a story of a 441 00:27:53.309 --> 00:28:02.380 guy that you've ministered to, if you can. Yeah. Well, so 442 00:28:02.819 --> 00:28:06.859 I've been a pastor church planter for three years and probably my favorite thing that 443 00:28:06.900 --> 00:28:08.380 I've learned that I quote myself on is you don't know what you don't know. 444 00:28:08.660 --> 00:28:12.289 Yeah, so I think I might have got that from you, because 445 00:28:12.289 --> 00:28:15.329 I say I say that a lot. I mean I'm sure about the first 446 00:28:15.329 --> 00:28:17.609 guy to ever said but if I was writing a book, that might be 447 00:28:17.650 --> 00:28:22.690 the title. And what that does it allows you some freedom from you know, 448 00:28:22.769 --> 00:28:27.279 the Lord's sanctifying us. Right. So sometimes we you know, like 449 00:28:27.359 --> 00:28:32.200 that week forty moment happened. Yeah, instead of feeling condemnation, I felt 450 00:28:32.240 --> 00:28:36.240 release. Yeah, but, but, but sometimes in the Christian walk, 451 00:28:36.279 --> 00:28:40.240 when we realize the weight of our sin or something, sometimes it can cause 452 00:28:40.279 --> 00:28:42.829 us to look back and even drudge or put our heads down. And so 453 00:28:42.990 --> 00:28:47.470 God's not in the business of having US walk through life with our heads down. 454 00:28:47.509 --> 00:28:49.589 He wants us to look up and see him and push on. Fhlippings, 455 00:28:49.589 --> 00:28:53.109 three hundred and thirteen fourteen, the upward call. Yeah, not looking 456 00:28:53.150 --> 00:29:00.019 back, but looking forward. And so again, the first five six years 457 00:29:00.059 --> 00:29:06.660 of being a Christian we just didn't hear about healing another's it's kind of implied, 458 00:29:06.779 --> 00:29:08.019 right, when you need to the Gospels, and I mean the way 459 00:29:08.019 --> 00:29:11.609 the Holy Spirit works, you're going to you're going to receive healing. Yeah, 460 00:29:11.769 --> 00:29:12.970 but for someone to shine a light and say, man, brother, 461 00:29:14.089 --> 00:29:18.410 you need to be healed. Like I just hadn't heard that kind of language 462 00:29:18.410 --> 00:29:21.089 until week forty and it happened and I don't even it was the Holy Spirit. 463 00:29:21.170 --> 00:29:23.559 Yeah, the clearly was was doing the healing. But so for me 464 00:29:23.720 --> 00:29:30.599 even lately, it's just being around you know, my you know my pentecostal 465 00:29:30.680 --> 00:29:37.519 brothers, and and it just being around different denominations where people are focused on, 466 00:29:37.599 --> 00:29:40.789 Hey, let's let's tend to the wounds of your heart. Our Church 467 00:29:40.910 --> 00:29:45.269 plant is where, in the adoption process of a church planning network, really 468 00:29:45.390 --> 00:29:48.309 not network of family, of church is called Soma, okay, and some 469 00:29:48.509 --> 00:29:52.859 of the Greek word for body. And there they've been really instructive about getting 470 00:29:52.859 --> 00:29:56.539 on the front end of soul care. Yeah, and ways I've never really 471 00:29:56.660 --> 00:30:00.660 heard and comprehensive ways, which has been so refreshing to me, because as 472 00:30:00.700 --> 00:30:04.019 ministers of the Gospel, we all are going to struggle, yeah, as 473 00:30:04.099 --> 00:30:07.210 fathers were all going to every Christian is going to struggle. Yeah, as 474 00:30:07.250 --> 00:30:11.210 we battle our sin, and so some moons are going to come up. 475 00:30:11.210 --> 00:30:15.890 So if we don't have our identity rooted in Christ, if we're not trusting 476 00:30:15.930 --> 00:30:19.049 and depending on the spirit of God and realizing that we've been adopted into a 477 00:30:19.089 --> 00:30:22.240 family that we can't get out of. And so God loves us and he 478 00:30:22.319 --> 00:30:26.440 cares for us and he wants us to to be healed. If we don't 479 00:30:26.640 --> 00:30:33.000 walk in that kind of light, then we're never going to progress or to 480 00:30:33.119 --> 00:30:37.150 be sanctified in the ways Romans Twenty eight says. We're being conformed to the 481 00:30:37.190 --> 00:30:41.230 image of Christ. The body of Christ has a lot of things need to 482 00:30:41.309 --> 00:30:44.269 be healed of. Yeah, and so when God shine that light on me, 483 00:30:44.309 --> 00:30:48.029 and he's been shining this light of healing, I've just been exposing it 484 00:30:48.069 --> 00:30:52.140 from the pulpit. Okay, when I meet with brothers, it's not hey 485 00:30:52.220 --> 00:30:56.539 man, did you get the right context for every scripture? Say Hey man, 486 00:30:56.619 --> 00:31:00.059 how is what is God trying to do here? What do you sense 487 00:31:00.099 --> 00:31:02.859 in the spirit moving is? Is there is an are your life that's not 488 00:31:02.940 --> 00:31:04.490 been submitted to Lordship of Christ? Is there an area of your life that 489 00:31:04.529 --> 00:31:08.210 the Holy Spirit is is revealing that needs to be needs to be healed, 490 00:31:08.210 --> 00:31:11.369 or is there something in your life that you need to be delivered from? 491 00:31:11.410 --> 00:31:14.730 Yeah, so just new language and I'm still learning. Man. So I 492 00:31:15.089 --> 00:31:18.400 mean later in our brothers like you and other brothers to help me through this. 493 00:31:18.559 --> 00:31:22.920 But specific stories, man, I mean, you know, there's so 494 00:31:23.000 --> 00:31:30.519 many and I'm not sure like confidentiality. I mean I'm one of those real 495 00:31:30.599 --> 00:31:33.150 transparent guys, don't give any names, like, but that like I don't 496 00:31:33.150 --> 00:31:38.430 even know how to not be transparent. Yeah, but yeah, yeah, 497 00:31:38.430 --> 00:31:47.900 another brother. Just talking to about I'm trying to love and forgive. I 498 00:31:47.940 --> 00:31:49.539 guess I'd be okay if my mom heard this, but I've I've had an 499 00:31:49.579 --> 00:31:52.660 a strange relationship with my mother. Yeah, and it's one that I'm, 500 00:31:53.180 --> 00:31:56.980 you know, actively praying and and seeking. How do we how do we 501 00:31:57.059 --> 00:32:00.529 reconcile? I don't think she knows the Lord yet and there's there's some areas 502 00:32:00.569 --> 00:32:04.849 of betterment her heart. But what I realized one day was that, man, 503 00:32:04.890 --> 00:32:07.730 I've been really bitter towards her. Yeah, you know, I can 504 00:32:07.730 --> 00:32:10.369 label, mislabel it really all kinds of other things and Oh, I've tried 505 00:32:10.490 --> 00:32:14.130 and I've kicked your dust off and move it and all that, but it's 506 00:32:14.170 --> 00:32:15.119 like, at the end of the day, it's like there's a part of 507 00:32:15.200 --> 00:32:19.480 my heart that it needs to be healed and needs to love her. I'm 508 00:32:19.519 --> 00:32:23.599 yeah, unconditionally. And so this is not necessarily on the issue of abortion, 509 00:32:24.559 --> 00:32:28.440 but I was just sharing that with another brother and he confessed to me. 510 00:32:28.519 --> 00:32:32.230 Man, he had a stepmom. They got introduced from at five years 511 00:32:32.230 --> 00:32:37.910 old and and about eight years old he started hating her, yeah, and 512 00:32:37.430 --> 00:32:42.950 his brothers in his s now, and just through that conversation of seeking the 513 00:32:43.069 --> 00:32:45.500 deeper areas of our heart, I think you know, he reached out to 514 00:32:45.539 --> 00:32:50.660 her and he sought to make amends and just to love her unconditionally. Yeah, 515 00:32:50.740 --> 00:32:52.819 with no agenda. And so that's one story. I mean, I've 516 00:32:52.819 --> 00:32:55.299 got countless stories my own home, but I just want to protect my over 517 00:32:55.380 --> 00:32:58.890 yet and no, wife's like you always talked about us from the pulpit. 518 00:32:58.930 --> 00:33:04.250 I tried only like use great stories. Yeah, and then I've got tons 519 00:33:04.250 --> 00:33:07.450 of personal stories, but but yeah, man, it's just well God does 520 00:33:07.529 --> 00:33:09.730 to you, he'll do through you, and so it's hard for it's hard 521 00:33:09.769 --> 00:33:15.519 for you to go and talk about healing if you haven't been healed. Yeah, 522 00:33:15.599 --> 00:33:19.640 it's hard for you to forgive others if, if you excuse me, 523 00:33:19.960 --> 00:33:22.880 it's hard for you to talk about forgiving others if you haven't personally forget. 524 00:33:22.920 --> 00:33:27.390 Yeah, yeah, yeah, I know there's a first John. First John's 525 00:33:27.390 --> 00:33:30.069 like one of my favorite books of the Bible. Tough one, it's tough. 526 00:33:30.150 --> 00:33:31.829 But well, that's weird. That's one of your favorites, it's one 527 00:33:31.869 --> 00:33:35.869 of my favor so what are your so holy? Yeah, exactly. That's 528 00:33:35.950 --> 00:33:38.349 right. But the first part of that actually memorize this first couple of verses 529 00:33:38.390 --> 00:33:40.940 and it talks about walking in the LICES is. This is the message which 530 00:33:40.980 --> 00:33:44.859 we had heard from him, talking about Jesus, and we declare to you 531 00:33:44.940 --> 00:33:47.819 that God is light and in him is no darkness at all. If we 532 00:33:47.940 --> 00:33:52.019 say we have fellowship with him and walk in darkness, we lie and do 533 00:33:52.140 --> 00:33:54.420 not practice the truth. But if we walk in the light, as he 534 00:33:54.539 --> 00:33:58.009 is in the light, we have fellowship with one another. In the blood 535 00:33:58.009 --> 00:34:00.450 of Jesus, Christis son, cleanses us from all sin. And the Lord, 536 00:34:00.609 --> 00:34:02.849 you know, really showed me because I was just praying, because he 537 00:34:02.930 --> 00:34:06.529 actually goes on to say that those that have the seat of God in them 538 00:34:06.569 --> 00:34:10.559 they do not sin. But he also says that when you send so obviously 539 00:34:10.599 --> 00:34:15.079 he's not saying that we never sin. Yeah, and so I was sort 540 00:34:15.079 --> 00:34:16.079 of meditating on that. Walking in the light. What does that mean? 541 00:34:16.199 --> 00:34:20.079 Walking His light? Is God talking about sinless perfection, like we need to 542 00:34:20.119 --> 00:34:22.159 walk in sinless perfection? It's like, no, he's not talking about that. 543 00:34:23.039 --> 00:34:27.989 Talking to walking in the light is actually holding your failings, in your 544 00:34:28.030 --> 00:34:30.510 sin before God and saying Yes, God, this was wrong and confessing it, 545 00:34:31.269 --> 00:34:35.869 bringing it into the light. It's not sinless perfection. It's being honest 546 00:34:36.309 --> 00:34:38.219 with where you've gone, where you what you've done and bringing it to the 547 00:34:38.300 --> 00:34:43.219 light. And even says in that scripture is it's curious there that says that 548 00:34:43.420 --> 00:34:45.380 if we walk in the light, we have fellowship with one another. Yeah, 549 00:34:45.619 --> 00:34:49.619 so our fellowship often times, and you've probably experienced this, to you 550 00:34:49.739 --> 00:34:52.380 that when somebody's holding on to a sin, yeah, when they're holding on 551 00:34:52.500 --> 00:34:54.969 to something in their past or they're holding on maybe justifying an attitude that they 552 00:34:55.050 --> 00:34:59.610 have, unforgiveness or whatever. Yeah, it actually even B breaks fellowship with 553 00:34:59.849 --> 00:35:02.130 other brothers. MMM, because there's a sort of a mistrust thing that goes 554 00:35:02.170 --> 00:35:06.050 on. Like the reason why people don't bring stuff to the light is because 555 00:35:06.050 --> 00:35:08.239 they don't trust other people to not do the same thing that was done to 556 00:35:08.360 --> 00:35:12.840 them. And it can break fellowship, it can mess things up and even 557 00:35:12.880 --> 00:35:15.159 though a church, you know. Yeah, so just speaking on that a 558 00:35:15.199 --> 00:35:16.320 little bit, and that's good. I'm at to get you can preach our 559 00:35:16.320 --> 00:35:21.989 church on that some time, but you can't do that apart from relationships. 560 00:35:22.030 --> 00:35:23.989 Yeah, and so that's why we started our church. I'm not trying to 561 00:35:23.989 --> 00:35:27.269 plug our church, but that's probably yeah, man, that's why we start 562 00:35:27.269 --> 00:35:30.389 urgents. Yeah, because there's converted church, converted church in CCOM all right, 563 00:35:31.309 --> 00:35:36.099 but down the on the note. Yeah, I mean. Yeah. 564 00:35:36.219 --> 00:35:38.179 So, yeah, men, think about what I need to tell about the 565 00:35:38.219 --> 00:35:42.420 church. No, man, that's why we started the church the way we 566 00:35:42.500 --> 00:35:45.539 did, and we do these, we call him great commission groups, because 567 00:35:45.539 --> 00:35:47.179 the great commissions to make disciples. It's not just an evangelist that called. 568 00:35:47.300 --> 00:35:51.650 Yeah, we're disciples, right. So we want to make good disciples, 569 00:35:51.690 --> 00:35:53.130 because we're all discipling somebody, whether we know it or not. Yeah, 570 00:35:53.570 --> 00:35:58.409 and so we want to be these kinds of disciples who can walk in the 571 00:35:58.449 --> 00:36:00.409 light and can share those things. But you can't do that part from relationship, 572 00:36:00.409 --> 00:36:06.440 right. Yeah, absolutely. If if you're fellowship with other Christians is 573 00:36:07.639 --> 00:36:10.360 segmented to one hour on a Sunday, like that's just not adequate. Yeah, 574 00:36:10.679 --> 00:36:15.079 like, that's not if I only knew you for one hour and Sunday 575 00:36:15.079 --> 00:36:16.440 and you came to me and start talking about your sin, like I don't 576 00:36:16.440 --> 00:36:21.670 really have the capacity to minister to you. Yeah, and or even really 577 00:36:21.670 --> 00:36:22.949 a capacity to care. It's like, yeah, that's kind of what I 578 00:36:23.070 --> 00:36:25.269 meant. Yes, yeah, yeah, it's just like, man, I 579 00:36:25.309 --> 00:36:28.349 don't know you and hey, man, I'll be praying. I'll pray for 580 00:36:28.429 --> 00:36:31.860 you. Brother, I might earnestly pray for you, but yeah, man. 581 00:36:31.900 --> 00:36:35.820 So that's why I love about cities for life. It's what I love 582 00:36:35.860 --> 00:36:42.059 about love life is they're not just transactionally preaching a message on the street corner, 583 00:36:42.980 --> 00:36:45.619 like if that's all it was. And that would be good in its 584 00:36:45.619 --> 00:36:50.489 sense, because you're going to, you know, a place of death and 585 00:36:50.650 --> 00:36:57.769 calling out to save and bring life. But you guys are invested relationally. 586 00:36:58.050 --> 00:37:00.090 We got pictures on the wall. We know some of these mothers. Yeah, 587 00:37:00.599 --> 00:37:06.159 is mothers have come up to our church and begin some relationship, and 588 00:37:07.679 --> 00:37:12.480 that's where in communities, where the light shines on the things. You know, 589 00:37:12.559 --> 00:37:15.590 we all always look at Matthew Eighteen when Jesus talk about church discipline. 590 00:37:15.670 --> 00:37:20.389 We look at that, that last portion. We're going to put them before 591 00:37:20.389 --> 00:37:22.269 the church, we're going to send them out. Basically, we're going to 592 00:37:22.269 --> 00:37:24.230 kick them out. Yeah, and Church discipline, if it's done rightly, 593 00:37:25.070 --> 00:37:28.829 the first step is going to your brother one on one. Yeah, and 594 00:37:28.949 --> 00:37:32.340 so that's a relational thing. And so going back to this whole conversation is 595 00:37:32.380 --> 00:37:37.139 that if you're going to be a post aboard of father seek to Minister to 596 00:37:37.219 --> 00:37:39.099 post the board of fathers or be a post of board of father who seeking 597 00:37:39.179 --> 00:37:43.500 to be ministered to, you got to be plugged into a local church. 598 00:37:43.659 --> 00:37:46.210 Yeah, and not just one where you're showing up on Sunday, you're sitting 599 00:37:46.250 --> 00:37:50.329 the back row, you don't know anybody and you've kind of checked the box 600 00:37:50.409 --> 00:37:53.090 like you'll you'll be healed or delivered that way. Holy Spirit can work in 601 00:37:53.170 --> 00:37:57.409 spite of that. But the way Holy Spirit works is through scripture, through 602 00:37:57.449 --> 00:38:00.280 prayer and through community. Yeah, and and what better place to be around 603 00:38:00.280 --> 00:38:06.960 other broken people that can love you and encourage you and equip you? Pastor's 604 00:38:06.960 --> 00:38:09.639 jobs to equip the work of the ministry. So so this is the way 605 00:38:09.719 --> 00:38:15.190 God's taught me about healing now equipping the body right. So I'm limited in 606 00:38:15.429 --> 00:38:19.469 the amount of men I can reach or women with the post aboard of healing. 607 00:38:19.670 --> 00:38:22.349 Yeah, but as I equip our church for this, we've got a 608 00:38:22.389 --> 00:38:24.750 hundred men and women who are gathering regularly throughout the week, not just on 609 00:38:24.829 --> 00:38:30.300 Sunday but in their communities, and they're going out and children our churches, 610 00:38:30.820 --> 00:38:35.420 hundred people strong praise God. Seventy five of things or children. Man, 611 00:38:35.539 --> 00:38:37.579 it feels like it's about fifty. Fifty five, I mean. And so 612 00:38:37.739 --> 00:38:42.170 our kids are now. I mean I probably saw ten of them volunteer and 613 00:38:42.250 --> 00:38:45.050 Love Life Week. Forty. Yeah, I our kids are the next generation 614 00:38:45.210 --> 00:38:47.570 who are standing in the gap now for the children, but also standing in 615 00:38:47.610 --> 00:38:52.929 the gap for people who might make that decision. I have kids at a 616 00:38:52.969 --> 00:38:58.039 Christian school in the city and the principle told me that, man, probably 617 00:38:58.079 --> 00:39:01.559 a quarter of those kids are Christians. And so they're there and I brought 618 00:39:01.639 --> 00:39:07.480 love life to to the school and their school participated as part of their mission 619 00:39:07.480 --> 00:39:13.550 week the past two years and man, it caused the stir amongst the parents. 620 00:39:13.590 --> 00:39:15.949 Why are you sending our kids out there? Yeah, and even my 621 00:39:15.989 --> 00:39:20.869 own kids had to become apologists for why life is got as God's thing. 622 00:39:20.989 --> 00:39:23.860 It's we love life because because God does. Yeah, and so my kids 623 00:39:23.900 --> 00:39:27.940 now are speaking up and my even my own, one of my sons, 624 00:39:28.019 --> 00:39:31.420 was ministering to one of our relatives who saw some of our postings, like 625 00:39:31.460 --> 00:39:35.099 why would yall go out there and some my fifteen year old son is now 626 00:39:35.500 --> 00:39:38.929 studying the scriptures and he's he wants to become more sharpened and equipped so that 627 00:39:39.050 --> 00:39:44.090 he can speak on behalf. Yeah, God through this issue of abortion. 628 00:39:44.170 --> 00:39:47.969 So it's very it's very apologetic issue. Yeah, it's life and death issue, 629 00:39:49.610 --> 00:39:52.809 but it's a glory of God issue. Yeah, I mean God loves 630 00:39:52.849 --> 00:39:54.119 life. So why I create us? We're create as image. Yeah, 631 00:39:54.280 --> 00:39:57.519 you know what I mean. So, yeah, I know. One of 632 00:39:57.559 --> 00:40:02.320 the is a post I read from John Piper some months ago that he put 633 00:40:02.360 --> 00:40:07.909 out. You basically, like some prolaborate person, had said, you know, 634 00:40:07.070 --> 00:40:12.869 if if all these babies are going to heaven and you know, hey, 635 00:40:13.989 --> 00:40:15.190 why is it a bad thing? Why is abortion of bad things just 636 00:40:15.230 --> 00:40:19.949 sending them straight to heaven? John Piper's response was, with the Devil's content 637 00:40:20.110 --> 00:40:22.699 to send, you know, a thousand babies to heaven as long as he 638 00:40:22.820 --> 00:40:27.940 can put a thousand women in Bondage to the sin of abortion. And it's 639 00:40:27.980 --> 00:40:30.059 like it's true, because it does bring bondage to women. And again the 640 00:40:30.099 --> 00:40:34.260 focus a lot of times it's on women, but it's also men in bondage, 641 00:40:34.820 --> 00:40:39.969 and the bondage is in still even some believers in the churches. Yeah, 642 00:40:40.090 --> 00:40:44.730 you know that. We are associated with probably my church, probably something 643 00:40:44.849 --> 00:40:47.170 even your church, that are hanging onto that sand or in that bondage, 644 00:40:47.170 --> 00:40:52.000 even though they're set free by the blood of Jesus and when God from pronounces 645 00:40:52.039 --> 00:40:57.519 them justified, justified by grace through faith, yet there's still a bondage in 646 00:40:57.559 --> 00:41:00.119 their mind and like a holding back from all that the Lord could, could, 647 00:41:00.320 --> 00:41:05.630 could use them to do, because they're not they're not allowing the Lord 648 00:41:05.710 --> 00:41:08.989 to release them in the sense from that Sind. Man, have you experienced 649 00:41:09.070 --> 00:41:14.630 that in your congregation, some people getting set free from not maybe even not 650 00:41:14.789 --> 00:41:20.940 just passed abortions but other other things and seeing the Lord's sort of propel people 651 00:41:21.619 --> 00:41:28.699 in that way? Yeah, man, I mean that's essentially that's the process 652 00:41:28.780 --> 00:41:35.090 of sanctification. Yeah, is God setting you free from your past. Yeah, 653 00:41:35.289 --> 00:41:37.090 it's hard for me to get specific examples, because in our in our 654 00:41:37.289 --> 00:41:39.369 in my lot of work, it happens every day. Yes, sure, 655 00:41:40.050 --> 00:41:45.250 whether I mean some people are, they're in bondage to their their doctrine. 656 00:41:45.250 --> 00:41:49.079 Yeah, you know, I'm a part of this camp and I can't fellowship 657 00:41:49.079 --> 00:41:51.880 with anybody else. I was like, man, man, God wants to 658 00:41:51.920 --> 00:41:53.440 free them from that. There's a unified body Christ. Going up to New 659 00:41:53.440 --> 00:41:55.960 York was powerful for me. I went. I went up to New York 660 00:41:57.000 --> 00:42:00.800 with love life. Okay, yeah, and this was their first year in 661 00:42:00.280 --> 00:42:02.869 New York City and they asked me to come up and share some of my 662 00:42:02.989 --> 00:42:07.909 story and I was quick to say yes and and got up there and we 663 00:42:07.989 --> 00:42:13.429 worshiped with some assemblies of God churches M and I don't even know if I've 664 00:42:13.429 --> 00:42:16.659 ever visited. Like when I got saved, I was like in the Baptist 665 00:42:16.699 --> 00:42:21.099 World in Charlotte, baptist, probably the majority of yeah, I'm sure people 666 00:42:21.099 --> 00:42:24.260 so laying the Badya just get, just get good Bible teaching churches. That's 667 00:42:24.300 --> 00:42:28.019 what I needed and, praise God, I'm I'm not ashamed of that at 668 00:42:28.019 --> 00:42:30.690 all. Yeah, I love my Baptist brethren. I am baptist, but 669 00:42:30.409 --> 00:42:34.170 but that's not the banner that I'm like Hey, I'm a baptist. Yeah 670 00:42:34.170 --> 00:42:37.849 Right. So going up to New York and see in the assemblies of God 671 00:42:37.889 --> 00:42:43.530 folks in the way they worshiped, like the Lord started setting me free. 672 00:42:43.610 --> 00:42:46.320 Yeah right, you don't know what you don't know. Yeah, I don't 673 00:42:46.320 --> 00:42:50.880 want to go to rabbit trailed on the Kanye West thing, but his his 674 00:42:51.039 --> 00:42:57.360 Sunday service choir and seeing the expression of a black choir. I mean it 675 00:42:57.480 --> 00:43:00.429 moved me to tears and I'd never experienced that. And so I think, 676 00:43:00.630 --> 00:43:04.429 you know, what God wants to do is he unifies us through the scripture. 677 00:43:04.510 --> 00:43:07.230 He says, as we fellowship with light, fellowship in the light, 678 00:43:07.909 --> 00:43:12.510 we have fellowship with one another. The darkness wants to hide us and divide 679 00:43:12.510 --> 00:43:15.500 us. Yeah, and partition us. And so that's another thing I just 680 00:43:15.659 --> 00:43:21.980 love about, I guess abolition, or however you want to describe what do 681 00:43:22.019 --> 00:43:24.940 you call this movement? I mean, I had denify myself as pro life. 682 00:43:25.059 --> 00:43:28.730 Okay, as people know what you're saying, but there's some we actually 683 00:43:28.730 --> 00:43:31.489 did some podcasts about pro life and abolition. Know that. But you know, 684 00:43:31.570 --> 00:43:35.570 one of the things this, this is powerful and actually so I think 685 00:43:35.809 --> 00:43:37.929 is podcast before last we put out, you know, flip flip. been 686 00:43:37.969 --> 00:43:42.800 them and I was talking to him a little bit about the the whole incrementalism 687 00:43:42.960 --> 00:43:45.920 and mediatism sort of debate. Actually listening to some of that. Okay, 688 00:43:45.920 --> 00:43:46.679 yeah, just a little bit. So. But one of the things he 689 00:43:46.800 --> 00:43:50.320 said to me, and he said this as we were preparing for the podcast, 690 00:43:50.400 --> 00:43:52.320 he said, you know what, because I asked me about abolition and 691 00:43:52.360 --> 00:43:54.159 what do you think about this and Prolife, when you think about the tag 692 00:43:54.280 --> 00:43:58.389 pro life, because I just say I'm pro life, because everybody knows what 693 00:43:58.469 --> 00:44:00.349 you're talking about. So I mean, I'm contend to be called anti abortion. 694 00:44:00.389 --> 00:44:04.190 Right people are killing babies. I'm anti that. It's like a anti 695 00:44:04.269 --> 00:44:07.869 slavery and all you know. So, but anyway, he said, you 696 00:44:07.909 --> 00:44:08.829 know what, we don't come out here. We were standing in front the 697 00:44:08.829 --> 00:44:13.659 abortion clinning when he said this. So we don't come out here as abolitionist 698 00:44:13.940 --> 00:44:16.900 or as prolife or as we don't come out here as a mediatist or incrementalist. 699 00:44:17.099 --> 00:44:21.460 Come out here as Christians. We are here because we are followers of 700 00:44:21.579 --> 00:44:24.289 Jesus, Yep, and so that being that, that was a powerful statement 701 00:44:24.329 --> 00:44:28.409 to me. And and so he talked a little bit, a little bit 702 00:44:28.449 --> 00:44:31.409 in depth about that in that podcast, but it's just that is the mentality. 703 00:44:31.409 --> 00:44:34.610 I think this is about geese. So again, so this so. 704 00:44:34.889 --> 00:44:37.369 So. The reality of this issue is I look at this heart on your 705 00:44:37.409 --> 00:44:42.239 shirt as his baby, right, is that? And I understand why there's 706 00:44:42.239 --> 00:44:45.400 denominations. There's some stuff that's like, but they're just some disagreements. And 707 00:44:45.440 --> 00:44:49.239 Yeah, but this issue we all agree on. Yeah, right, this 708 00:44:49.360 --> 00:44:51.960 is a gospel issue, this is a Bible issue, this is a glory 709 00:44:52.000 --> 00:44:54.190 of God issue, this is a Imago day issue. Yeah, and if 710 00:44:54.230 --> 00:45:00.230 you don't, if you if you think this is okay, I got a 711 00:45:00.309 --> 00:45:04.150 question, if you have the Holy Spirit and have a firm understanding of scripture, 712 00:45:04.309 --> 00:45:07.340 if you think it's okay to convert the babies, and maybe some people 713 00:45:07.420 --> 00:45:09.260 just in mature and we can help them walk through that. But the beauty 714 00:45:09.300 --> 00:45:15.219 of this issue and this this problem is that it's uniting the church. Yeah, 715 00:45:15.900 --> 00:45:19.460 and so I praise God for the faithfulness of cities, for life and 716 00:45:19.980 --> 00:45:22.690 the Benhams and people who have just faithfully the hill drifts, I mean the 717 00:45:22.730 --> 00:45:27.210 Wilson's is the ten I get named his on and on. People just faithful. 718 00:45:28.010 --> 00:45:31.170 You know, you and Vicki. Yeah, twenty degrees outside, freezing, 719 00:45:31.650 --> 00:45:35.449 and you're still out there right, and you probably were like, man, 720 00:45:36.000 --> 00:45:37.719 when's the church going to show up? Yeah, and then the past 721 00:45:37.760 --> 00:45:40.280 couple of years the church has shown up. Yeah, and so the things 722 00:45:40.320 --> 00:45:45.480 spreading. But but it's beautiful, as I as I minister next to different 723 00:45:45.519 --> 00:45:51.190 denominations and skin colors and age groups and whatever the background is. Yeah, 724 00:45:51.710 --> 00:45:52.829 so, man, yeah, just next time you're in New York, just 725 00:45:52.949 --> 00:45:57.550 suggestion. If anybody he's listening to good at Time Square church, you bet 726 00:45:57.550 --> 00:46:00.670 it there. Powerful. Well, we were speaking at a church on Sunday. 727 00:46:00.710 --> 00:46:01.989 Okay, you have the option. You go back. Go, because 728 00:46:01.989 --> 00:46:07.019 I mean you talking about different people from different background and you're looking at Africans, 729 00:46:07.099 --> 00:46:09.780 people from vision places in Asia. Like the choir itself is just an 730 00:46:09.820 --> 00:46:14.539 array of the entire world, because, you know, New York's a Melton 731 00:46:14.579 --> 00:46:16.539 Cot anyway. Yeah, and it's just like when I last time I was 732 00:46:16.619 --> 00:46:20.610 there, which is some years ago, with the choir just worshiping God and 733 00:46:20.650 --> 00:46:23.570 seeing everybody from every tribe and tongue and nation worshiping together. Just I think 734 00:46:23.570 --> 00:46:27.809 they're the ones, they're the ones that kind of champion the movement. And 735 00:46:27.969 --> 00:46:30.170 Yeah, I said, yeah, yeah, I'm mistaken. Yeah, well, 736 00:46:30.250 --> 00:46:34.000 brother, I think if you're if you're good to go, unless you 737 00:46:34.039 --> 00:46:36.599 have my off to say you copies about done. So we're going to wrap 738 00:46:36.639 --> 00:46:37.840 this thing up. Man, I appreciate you coming and Chare and brother. 739 00:46:37.920 --> 00:46:42.960 Appreciate your heart, man, and I'll maybe have you back on sometime in 740 00:46:43.079 --> 00:46:45.679 the future. We'll talk some more about some whatever the Lord brings to us. 741 00:46:45.760 --> 00:46:50.309 God to mind. But I appreciate all those who listen, who joined 742 00:46:50.349 --> 00:46:53.190 us and just you know, check out pastor Bryan's church if you're in the 743 00:46:53.230 --> 00:46:58.269 Charlotte area and you're looking for a church home. These guys are disciplers there. 744 00:46:58.389 --> 00:47:01.579 They're not just there for the Sunday morning surface. They're there long haul, 745 00:47:01.699 --> 00:47:07.059 connecting people and Evangelistic Church. They're want to see people come to God's 746 00:47:07.099 --> 00:47:09.659 kingdom, which is awesome to disciple those people. So check it out. 747 00:47:09.900 --> 00:47:15.619 Convergence in see is it versions church inccom okay, we meet in the Plasan 748 00:47:15.699 --> 00:47:19.969 Midwood area on Sunday, but we have a six, probably potentially seven, 749 00:47:20.530 --> 00:47:24.010 missional communities that meet throughout the city to have a missional directive wherever they are. 750 00:47:24.090 --> 00:47:27.969 So, yeah, we're not just the church gathered but scattered. Okay, 751 00:47:28.289 --> 00:47:30.639 and I sound horrible with this man. Can You? Can you edit 752 00:47:30.679 --> 00:47:32.920 my voice somehow? I can't. I can't make it sound better. That's 753 00:47:32.960 --> 00:47:37.480 your people know. I normally I can hear myself. Do I sound funny 754 00:47:37.480 --> 00:47:38.920 to you now? Sounds okay, cool. Yeah, well, so he 755 00:47:39.159 --> 00:47:42.320 who? You know? He preaches a lot of Sundays and he doesn't sound 756 00:47:42.320 --> 00:47:45.909 funny. He sounds sounds fantastic. You know, the Lord uses him. 757 00:47:45.869 --> 00:47:49.230 But yeah, yeah, so check those guys out, check us out. 758 00:47:49.269 --> 00:47:52.150 You can connect with me at D Park's cities for lifecom. That's my email 759 00:47:52.190 --> 00:47:55.829 address, Charlotte dot cities for Life Dot Org is our website, and then 760 00:47:55.909 --> 00:48:00.059 our sidewalks for life site that we always mentioned, sidewalks, and number four 761 00:48:00.300 --> 00:48:04.500 Lifecom, which is a Gospel centered sidewalk counseling website, just to encourage you 762 00:48:04.500 --> 00:48:07.579 guys and put out articles on regular basis. And maybe we'll have pastor Brian 763 00:48:07.619 --> 00:48:12.059 and I'll show you something on that. Yeah, I think it was yesterday 764 00:48:12.619 --> 00:48:15.969 a friend of mine who's an organ. Okay, he shared a sidewalks for 765 00:48:15.010 --> 00:48:20.130 life video. Okay, because I saw what's Corey's money us? Why? 766 00:48:20.170 --> 00:48:22.170 Yes, Sarah, Sarah. Saw Her on the I was like, I 767 00:48:22.289 --> 00:48:23.969 know her. Yeah, he's from Oregon. So people across the guys, 768 00:48:23.969 --> 00:48:27.480 yes, or base guys. So yeah, you guys can be blessed to 769 00:48:27.639 --> 00:48:30.360 just get that website and let us know what you think about the podcast. 770 00:48:30.400 --> 00:48:32.679 If you had suggestions, maybe episodes, we can do subjects, we can 771 00:48:32.719 --> 00:48:36.519 cover it. I'd love to hear them, but until next time, God 772 00:48:36.559 --> 00:49:00.139 bless, use, use, give me, give me, cost me my 773 00:49:00.420 --> 00:49:06.219 life, but these two precious