Jan. 13, 2022

Ministering to A Suicidal Mom

Ministering to A Suicidal Mom

We encounter women and men with a multitude of issue going into the abortion centers. Some situations are more extreme than others. In this episode, we talk about a recent experience that Vicky had with a post abortive women who was suicidal and some things she learned that will help equip you.

Transcript
WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.600 --> 00:00:05.759 I Am Yours, I am yours, I am yours. And Me, 2 00:00:06.120 --> 00:00:11.830 Lord, I am yours, I am yours. I'm welcome to the Gospel 3 00:00:11.830 --> 00:00:17.429 Center Pro Life Podcast, a podcast designed to equip, encourage and challenge you 4 00:00:17.550 --> 00:00:21.660 in pro life ministry and always were the focus on the Gospel. Stay tuned. 5 00:00:23.660 --> 00:00:35.890 I felt show passish touchs your home. Use Me. Look. Hey, 6 00:00:35.929 --> 00:00:40.530 there, everybody, welcome to the Gospel centered pro life podcast. I'm 7 00:00:40.570 --> 00:00:47.210 here with Daniel Parks. What's up? And and today's topic is another cheery 8 00:00:47.409 --> 00:00:53.960 topic. We're going to talk about suicide. So, like so many of 9 00:00:54.119 --> 00:01:00.280 our issues that we bring up, this one we thought about because of an 10 00:01:00.320 --> 00:01:04.430 actual situation that we faced, yeah, where there was a mom who contacted 11 00:01:04.549 --> 00:01:08.150 me. Actually, she was the mom of a baby that she had killed. 12 00:01:08.390 --> 00:01:12.909 Yeah, so she hit aboarded and she's she was suicidal, at least 13 00:01:12.950 --> 00:01:21.340 I would describe passively suicidal. And I realize, man, this is a 14 00:01:21.540 --> 00:01:25.859 little bit out of my comfort zone, a lot out of my comfort zone. 15 00:01:26.019 --> 00:01:30.500 We Are we're not trained suicide prevention counselors. So I thought it would 16 00:01:30.500 --> 00:01:37.810 be good for me personally, but for anyone involved in sidewalk ministry to have 17 00:01:38.049 --> 00:01:44.329 researched and know a little bit about what happens if you come in contact with 18 00:01:44.530 --> 00:01:49.120 someone who is either passively or actively suicidal. Yeah, they're out there. 19 00:01:49.200 --> 00:01:53.280 I know. I have definitely interacted with many women that I would I think, 20 00:01:53.519 --> 00:01:59.599 our suicidal, which is, you know, no big surprise, right. 21 00:01:59.879 --> 00:02:04.150 Sure, they're in desperate circumstances, there to kill their child. Yeah. 22 00:02:04.189 --> 00:02:07.229 Yeah, and of course the reality is that that lie that women don't 23 00:02:07.229 --> 00:02:13.909 regret abortions is dispelled in the fact that we deal with women who are suicidal. 24 00:02:13.949 --> 00:02:17.219 Yes, and are suicidal not because of what we told them, not 25 00:02:17.340 --> 00:02:22.419 because we told them that abortion was wrong, but because they know it's wrong 26 00:02:22.740 --> 00:02:27.340 and they're suicidal because, I mean, essentially, the devil is a destroyer. 27 00:02:27.379 --> 00:02:30.889 He wants to destroy their baby and destroy them. Yeah, and so 28 00:02:30.969 --> 00:02:35.449 it speaks to the destruction that abortion brings. Yeah, and the reason why 29 00:02:35.449 --> 00:02:38.409 we're talking about this topic, in the conversation that you have with this woman, 30 00:02:38.569 --> 00:02:40.889 speaks to the fact that we're not just for the baby, we're also 31 00:02:42.009 --> 00:02:45.599 for the mother and even if she had an abortion, were for her. 32 00:02:46.080 --> 00:02:49.560 Yeah, and really, more to your point, because we hear it all 33 00:02:49.639 --> 00:02:57.560 the time, the reason these women are feeling shame or guilt or suicide is 34 00:02:57.719 --> 00:03:02.909 because we've instilled it in them. This woman never met a sidewalk counselor yeah, 35 00:03:04.030 --> 00:03:07.349 there were none on the Sidebok, and in fact she called me saying 36 00:03:07.669 --> 00:03:10.750 where were you all? She she heard about our organization, she found my 37 00:03:10.830 --> 00:03:19.620 name through that and contacted me. So she had never heard a word of 38 00:03:20.099 --> 00:03:27.289 someone other than her own guilt and sorrow speaking to her heart. That was 39 00:03:27.409 --> 00:03:35.210 causing the shame and and the deep sorrow. So you're probably going to face 40 00:03:35.250 --> 00:03:37.930 it, if you're on the sidebalk. You're going to you're going to face 41 00:03:38.050 --> 00:03:39.409 this. Yeah, and so what do we do? Yeah, and you 42 00:03:39.490 --> 00:03:43.960 may even face it. You might encounter women at the abortion center coming out 43 00:03:44.000 --> 00:03:47.520 after they had the abortion, maybe directly after they had the abortion or they're 44 00:03:47.520 --> 00:03:52.680 there for a follow up appointment, and they share with you the depression that's 45 00:03:52.680 --> 00:03:55.189 set in, suicidal thoughts and all that stuff. Yeah, you may encounter 46 00:03:55.550 --> 00:04:00.349 from women who are coming into the abortion center to have an abortion, who 47 00:04:00.349 --> 00:04:04.789 had a previous abortion. And there's the suicidal tendencies, the self destructive tendencies, 48 00:04:04.830 --> 00:04:10.900 which manifest themselves in suicidal faults and actions, but also manifest themselves in 49 00:04:11.500 --> 00:04:15.459 there they're killing another child. Yeah, it's that cycle of sin and death 50 00:04:15.540 --> 00:04:19.819 and destruction. It's that sense in which all hope is lost. There's no 51 00:04:20.019 --> 00:04:23.779 hope for me, may as well have another abord prison, may as well 52 00:04:23.819 --> 00:04:28.009 take my own life. And, spoiler alert, the only way to break 53 00:04:28.050 --> 00:04:31.610 that cycle is not through some twelve state program not some hotline or something like 54 00:04:31.769 --> 00:04:35.250 that, but it's through the power of the Gospel. Yeah, and you 55 00:04:35.370 --> 00:04:39.199 know that. You raise a very, very important point and I will I 56 00:04:39.519 --> 00:04:43.839 will tell you that when I first encountered her, did go through my head. 57 00:04:44.959 --> 00:04:48.000 This is not my training. Yeah, and I need to connect her 58 00:04:48.040 --> 00:04:53.709 with a suicide prevention hotline. So keep that in your heart. So I'm 59 00:04:53.750 --> 00:04:58.509 thinking that I had mentioned, I think, to my sister that I was 60 00:04:58.629 --> 00:05:02.149 counseling this woman and that was the first thing she asked. This is not 61 00:05:02.389 --> 00:05:08.420 something you should be dealing with. You should be contacting a suicide prevention hotline. 62 00:05:09.180 --> 00:05:14.540 So I did connect her with a suicide prevention hotline, but I will 63 00:05:14.699 --> 00:05:18.660 tell you for exactly what you just said, Daniel, I had reservations doing 64 00:05:18.740 --> 00:05:28.370 so. A suicide prevention hotline is not necessarily Gospel oriented. They're not Christians 65 00:05:28.569 --> 00:05:32.769 necessarily it's not even necessarily in any way God based, church based. It 66 00:05:32.930 --> 00:05:41.480 is a secular hotline and that always gives me concern because the counseling, I 67 00:05:41.800 --> 00:05:46.279 know, you know everyone who is following this podcast because they love and know 68 00:05:46.439 --> 00:05:50.509 the truth, that only the Gospel Saves, only the Gospel pull and that 69 00:05:50.670 --> 00:05:57.870 cycle of sin and desperation. Why would we be referring them then to a 70 00:05:58.110 --> 00:06:02.870 secular world view? So I had that tension. Yeah, I know I'm 71 00:06:02.870 --> 00:06:08.899 not really trained and but I also know that I do know how to share 72 00:06:08.899 --> 00:06:11.860 the Gospel. Yeah, so I'll tell you what I did and what I 73 00:06:11.980 --> 00:06:15.500 found out and then we can kind of go from there. What I did 74 00:06:15.620 --> 00:06:20.649 initially was I shared the Gospel. I asked a lot of questions so that 75 00:06:20.689 --> 00:06:28.290 I could find out enough to know where to go with the Gospel discussion. 76 00:06:28.329 --> 00:06:32.560 I found out she was she had had the abortion several months ago and she 77 00:06:32.839 --> 00:06:39.920 was suicidal, passively suicidal, just wanted to die. Okay, so let's 78 00:06:39.920 --> 00:06:43.920 let's define some things real quick. I started out using those terms passively and 79 00:06:44.079 --> 00:06:46.629 actively. Yeah, we can all pretty much figure out what that means, 80 00:06:46.750 --> 00:06:50.430 but let's define it just in case folks are wondering. Okay, so passive 81 00:06:50.550 --> 00:06:57.750 suicidal thoughts are suicidal ideation or voice seeing a desire to die. Yeah, 82 00:06:57.829 --> 00:07:00.779 but not a plan, an active plan to bring it about. Yeah, 83 00:07:01.220 --> 00:07:05.740 so, and that she was at. That's called passive. When they're when 84 00:07:05.740 --> 00:07:10.860 they're not really they don't have a plan. They they maybe don't even really 85 00:07:10.980 --> 00:07:15.769 want to take action. But there is they still have a desire to die. 86 00:07:15.290 --> 00:07:18.050 And really, the way she was voiceeing it, it did get a 87 00:07:18.089 --> 00:07:21.529 little bit worse over the course of me talking with her. It started with 88 00:07:23.370 --> 00:07:28.569 there was no reason to live, to it evolved to I hope someone kills 89 00:07:28.649 --> 00:07:31.720 me. Yeah, so she did want to die, but she would was 90 00:07:31.839 --> 00:07:36.600 not necessarily going to take her own life. Active would be they have devised 91 00:07:36.639 --> 00:07:41.279 a plan. This by far the more dangerous, although the passive con turn 92 00:07:41.399 --> 00:07:46.069 into active, but active, the suicidal they have a plan, they maybe 93 00:07:46.189 --> 00:07:51.870 even have the weapons and they are going to take action or they are threatening 94 00:07:51.990 --> 00:07:57.110 to take action. That's an actively suicidal person and that's a much more dangerous, 95 00:07:57.110 --> 00:08:05.620 high risk scenario. Yeah, neither good, but but so so. 96 00:08:05.899 --> 00:08:11.100 With her, I did share the Gospel, I did go I did directly 97 00:08:11.180 --> 00:08:16.930 address sin and the consequence of sin. Hopefully in a loving, compassionate manner. 98 00:08:16.930 --> 00:08:20.850 I'm sure I never did. Yeah, that's yeah, how you do 99 00:08:20.970 --> 00:08:26.529 it? Yeah, and and she it. There was a lot of discussion. 100 00:08:26.529 --> 00:08:30.199 It was like three hours our first discussion and then in many, many 101 00:08:30.360 --> 00:08:33.639 hours over the course of the next few days. She ultimately, I would 102 00:08:33.679 --> 00:08:39.399 say, was still feeling desperation and despair, but she knew there was no 103 00:08:39.600 --> 00:08:43.269 way out of out of it outside of coming to the Lord, and she 104 00:08:43.389 --> 00:08:50.309 did submit her life to the Lord. Yeah, so, but I also 105 00:08:50.990 --> 00:08:58.259 did recommend that she contacts suicide prevention hot line and I gave her the the 106 00:08:58.419 --> 00:09:05.539 hot line number. Yeah, I didn't know that they're even were Christian suicide 107 00:09:05.580 --> 00:09:11.690 hot line numbers. There are, but they they don't have a national manned 108 00:09:11.049 --> 00:09:16.809 hot line phone number. You can sometimes email it's it's just it's not it's 109 00:09:16.850 --> 00:09:20.889 not nearly as easy and neat to find as it is the suicide hotline. 110 00:09:20.409 --> 00:09:26.480 I didn't think she even contacted them. It wasn't a later as she had 111 00:09:26.519 --> 00:09:30.120 come to the Lord. She'd said she was sounding better, but then she 112 00:09:30.240 --> 00:09:35.559 was cycling back and that was when I started researching. What what are some 113 00:09:35.720 --> 00:09:43.350 specific strategies to to deal with a suicidal person and I also found out that 114 00:09:43.470 --> 00:09:50.909 she had actually contacted the suicide prevention hotline and she told me it didn't help. 115 00:09:52.149 --> 00:09:58.379 Yeah, now I will say this that there's obviously some pretty good people. 116 00:09:58.419 --> 00:10:03.460 Well, maybe not obviously, but I have some fair amount of confidence 117 00:10:03.539 --> 00:10:07.210 that there are some good people that operate those lines and that I'm sure have 118 00:10:07.330 --> 00:10:11.250 good intentions. There's probably some solid believers there, yeah, that love Jesus 119 00:10:11.250 --> 00:10:13.570 and they want to help people. So I don't want to paint that whole 120 00:10:13.610 --> 00:10:18.490 suicide prevention hotline thing in a bad light. I'm sure it's helped people and 121 00:10:18.529 --> 00:10:24.039 all of that, definitely, but the reality is that there's parameters that they 122 00:10:24.080 --> 00:10:26.080 have to stay in. They probably, I don't know, maybe you can, 123 00:10:26.279 --> 00:10:31.720 maybe, you know, probably not are able to mention Jesus, probably 124 00:10:31.879 --> 00:10:35.830 not really able to share the gospel. And you know, if we believe 125 00:10:35.950 --> 00:10:39.509 what the word of God says, that the Gospel is the hope of God 126 00:10:41.750 --> 00:10:46.669 to salvation, the power of God to salvation, Yeah, then the Gospel 127 00:10:46.710 --> 00:10:50.620 can't be neglected in these conversations. Just principles of this world, ideas from 128 00:10:50.659 --> 00:10:54.059 this world, philosophies of man, are not going to set people free. 129 00:10:54.460 --> 00:10:58.059 Right. I want to read a scripture here which I think probably can encourage 130 00:10:58.100 --> 00:11:01.620 all of you guys, and I will say too that, yes, there 131 00:11:01.620 --> 00:11:05.049 are situations that we get into and conversations that we get into that we ourselves 132 00:11:05.090 --> 00:11:09.649 cannot handle, that we're not equipped to handle, and that we need to 133 00:11:09.730 --> 00:11:13.610 bring maybe other voices into the conversation, maybe pastors or counselors, Christian counselors. 134 00:11:13.850 --> 00:11:18.879 They can speak more clearly into these situations. So there are times we 135 00:11:18.919 --> 00:11:22.240 need to leverage our connections in the body of Christ and get other people to 136 00:11:22.279 --> 00:11:24.919 speak into these conversations. Yeah, obviously with the woman's permission, because we 137 00:11:26.000 --> 00:11:30.080 only preach confidence, that sort of thing, our confidentiality. But there's a 138 00:11:30.159 --> 00:11:33.669 scripture that I think is really powerful as it pertains to this and as it 139 00:11:33.750 --> 00:11:37.590 pertains to our confidence and really as we look at ourselves. Or I'm not 140 00:11:37.669 --> 00:11:41.110 equipped to do that. I'm not a counselor I'm not trained counselor I'm not 141 00:11:41.149 --> 00:11:46.789 a psychologist or psychiatrist, and so we would think I can't speak to these 142 00:11:46.830 --> 00:11:50.340 situations and so I need to hand it off to the professionals at the prevention 143 00:11:50.820 --> 00:11:54.620 hotline or whatever. Yeah, but in actuality the Bible says this. And 144 00:11:54.700 --> 00:12:00.340 Second Timothy, chapter three, it says all scripture is given by inspiration of 145 00:12:00.419 --> 00:12:03.610 God and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for Correction, for Instruction 146 00:12:03.690 --> 00:12:11.129 and righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for 147 00:12:11.289 --> 00:12:18.399 every good work. So the Bible says that scripture of itself, that scripture, 148 00:12:18.639 --> 00:12:22.159 is sufficient and that they that have the word of God, that says 149 00:12:22.200 --> 00:12:26.080 that the man of God. It's because Timothy is being discipled by Paul and 150 00:12:26.159 --> 00:12:30.549 he's speaking specifically to Timothy as a man, but I think you could also 151 00:12:30.549 --> 00:12:33.830 apply to women who are ministering the Gospel. I don't think it's just exclusive 152 00:12:33.909 --> 00:12:37.870 to men. If you women, if you men, if you have the 153 00:12:37.950 --> 00:12:43.620 word of God, the word of God can thoroughly equip you for every good 154 00:12:43.700 --> 00:12:50.220 work and suicide and see a sidal tendencies and thoughts are included in every good 155 00:12:50.299 --> 00:12:54.059 work. So what I'm saying is be in the word of God and God 156 00:12:54.179 --> 00:13:00.250 can equip you to answer these issues, to be a resource for these women, 157 00:13:00.370 --> 00:13:03.450 to speak to these women. That does not mean that you have to 158 00:13:03.570 --> 00:13:07.490 be the only one speaking into the situation. Bring others into the conversation. 159 00:13:07.610 --> 00:13:11.970 As a appropriate. Again, bring your pastor in. Bring maybe there's a 160 00:13:11.970 --> 00:13:16.639 Christian counseling center in your church, bring that into the conversation. Don't feel 161 00:13:16.639 --> 00:13:18.279 like you have to take ownership of the whole situation. Bring others in. 162 00:13:18.559 --> 00:13:22.840 Yeah, but also know that, yes, you are and you can be. 163 00:13:22.320 --> 00:13:24.799 You are equipped, if you have the word of God and you can 164 00:13:24.960 --> 00:13:28.909 be confident in the word of God, to do a work in that way. 165 00:13:28.909 --> 00:13:31.470 Yeah. Amen, and there were over the course of the discussion there 166 00:13:31.509 --> 00:13:35.269 would be I I did some things right. I'm going to go over the 167 00:13:35.429 --> 00:13:39.669 five key steps that I think are valuable from what I learned to my research 168 00:13:39.750 --> 00:13:45.379 of dealing with suicidal people. But but there were times in the discussion when 169 00:13:45.419 --> 00:13:50.779 I would throughout these several days, I was sending her scripture or stories in 170 00:13:50.860 --> 00:13:54.179 the Bible and there were many times when she would write back. It was 171 00:13:54.340 --> 00:13:58.210 most of it was by text and she would say that really helped. So 172 00:13:58.330 --> 00:14:03.570 it was it was oftentimes scripture. There was something that I said in scripture 173 00:14:03.769 --> 00:14:09.000 that that would help her through that next turtle. Right, and it's an 174 00:14:09.039 --> 00:14:13.039 ongoing process. But I do want to get into so I did a lot 175 00:14:13.120 --> 00:14:18.000 of research into what kinds of things can, we should we do when we're 176 00:14:18.120 --> 00:14:22.159 interacting with them. Besides, I agree and I feel one of the most 177 00:14:22.159 --> 00:14:26.789 important things is share it is the most important thing is to share the gospel. 178 00:14:26.830 --> 00:14:31.309 Yeah, but there are some key steps that I guess the experts really 179 00:14:31.350 --> 00:14:35.110 agree on, these key steps. Yeah, and so just and we won't 180 00:14:35.149 --> 00:14:39.500 take too long, we wrote an article and there are a lot of websites 181 00:14:39.539 --> 00:14:43.899 that are included on that article so that people can look for themselves and research 182 00:14:43.980 --> 00:14:50.059 for themselves some of the specifics. But some of them were very counterintuitive to 183 00:14:50.139 --> 00:14:54.450 me. The first one, which I never came right out and said, 184 00:14:54.929 --> 00:14:58.970 are you thinking of killing yourself? Have you? Do you actually have a 185 00:14:58.129 --> 00:15:03.970 plan? And apparently you're supposed to do that. Okay, it. The 186 00:15:03.169 --> 00:15:09.600 research shows, according to the articles I read, that if they start saying 187 00:15:09.720 --> 00:15:15.120 it, stating it, with a witness to someone else, to eate, 188 00:15:15.279 --> 00:15:20.710 someone who is invested in them and listening, it actually reduces the suicidal tendency. 189 00:15:22.269 --> 00:15:24.149 Now, I would not have known that. And you know what, 190 00:15:24.350 --> 00:15:28.029 there's in line with that scripture I read in Second Timothy, there's a scripture 191 00:15:28.070 --> 00:15:31.750 that comes to mind. Okay, it speaks directly to that. Tell me 192 00:15:31.789 --> 00:15:35.710 I think, okay, and it's first John and chapter one. Okay, 193 00:15:35.779 --> 00:15:39.820 we're John Talks about walking in the light. If we walk in the light, 194 00:15:39.019 --> 00:15:41.059 is he's in the light. We have fellowship with one another in the 195 00:15:41.059 --> 00:15:45.340 blood of Jesus Christ, is Soun, cleansed us from all sin. Also 196 00:15:45.460 --> 00:15:50.049 Efhesians, is I, fees and Effesians eleven have no fellowship within frouful works 197 00:15:50.049 --> 00:15:52.809 of darkness, but rather expose them. And so it speaks of exposing. 198 00:15:52.850 --> 00:15:58.570 It speaks of bringing things to the light, not dancing around the issue, 199 00:15:58.610 --> 00:16:02.169 be getting right to it. And so I think if the experts say that, 200 00:16:02.809 --> 00:16:04.960 well, they're just agree with with the Bible. With okay. So 201 00:16:06.240 --> 00:16:10.440 I had not thought of that scripture at all. That is that's perfect. 202 00:16:11.879 --> 00:16:15.159 That is what the experts say. Have have them to find out as directly. 203 00:16:15.600 --> 00:16:19.669 Do you have a plan? Yeah, it's is is this beyond just 204 00:16:19.950 --> 00:16:22.750 thinking about it? Right? I did. Later, after reading this, 205 00:16:22.990 --> 00:16:30.429 I did ask her and she she said that she she believed that suicide would 206 00:16:30.429 --> 00:16:34.179 put her soul in jeopardy and she didn't want that to happen, but she 207 00:16:34.340 --> 00:16:42.460 did not believe that that if someone else took her life, wishing for someone 208 00:16:42.500 --> 00:16:45.860 else to take her life she did not feel was putting her soul in jeopardy. 209 00:16:47.139 --> 00:16:51.330 So at that point we were able to have a discussion about that from 210 00:16:51.370 --> 00:16:55.250 a biblical perspective. But so that's number one. Go ahead and talk about 211 00:16:55.250 --> 00:16:57.610 it, bring it to light. I love that scripture. Secondly, is 212 00:16:57.809 --> 00:17:02.360 just being there, and that was something that it's just a part of my 213 00:17:02.480 --> 00:17:06.319 nature when I know that someone is in pain. I think that's why I 214 00:17:06.480 --> 00:17:08.559 do what I do out on the sidewalk. I want to be there. 215 00:17:08.799 --> 00:17:11.880 That's when I'm the best friend, is actually when someone is in pain. 216 00:17:11.920 --> 00:17:15.150 I'm a bad weather friend. I'm a better bad weather friend than a good 217 00:17:15.150 --> 00:17:18.390 weather friend, which is kind of the opposite of most people. So I 218 00:17:18.670 --> 00:17:22.470 was there for her because I knew this was a woman who was in pain 219 00:17:22.589 --> 00:17:26.430 and I was staying in touch with her. And that's the second key step, 220 00:17:26.150 --> 00:17:30.980 that you be present physically, by phones in some way be there for 221 00:17:32.099 --> 00:17:37.339 that person. Being showing support is very key. That suicidal people feel disconnected 222 00:17:37.859 --> 00:17:42.619 from everyone. Yeah, and so that connection point is is really important. 223 00:17:44.180 --> 00:17:45.849 Yeah, I mean, I have a scripture for that. Oh, let's 224 00:17:45.849 --> 00:17:49.730 hear it. Okay, I may not quote it exactly. Okay, it's 225 00:17:49.769 --> 00:17:56.450 a proverb eighteen one. Okay, man that isolates himself rages against sound judgment 226 00:17:56.490 --> 00:18:02.359 and seeks his own so this, this kind of isolation dynamic you see with 227 00:18:02.440 --> 00:18:06.480 a lot of people that are suicide, sidle or depressed. Yeah, isolate 228 00:18:06.559 --> 00:18:10.160 themselves, and so we kind of we don't force our way into the situation, 229 00:18:10.400 --> 00:18:12.910 but we want to be present. Yeah, bear one another's burdens, 230 00:18:14.069 --> 00:18:17.230 and so if you fulfill the law of Christ as, another scripture that comes 231 00:18:17.269 --> 00:18:19.430 to mind is that we're supposed to be there, even if it seems like 232 00:18:19.509 --> 00:18:22.990 they don't want us there, to be as present as possible. Of course, 233 00:18:22.190 --> 00:18:26.069 with you, you weren't physically present in this situation, but you were 234 00:18:26.109 --> 00:18:29.700 present. They're sending her text message let her know that you care. Yeah, 235 00:18:29.819 --> 00:18:33.299 that's important that. That helps bear the burden with someone right, know 236 00:18:33.460 --> 00:18:37.059 that you're there, right, and you know, it was relatively easy because 237 00:18:37.180 --> 00:18:38.900 she actually lives very far away. There was no way I could be there 238 00:18:38.980 --> 00:18:45.049 with her, so I would send tax just continually sending scripture, quite frequently 239 00:18:45.089 --> 00:18:48.210 at first, less so now. And I when I read this, I 240 00:18:48.289 --> 00:18:52.130 thought about our mentorship program through love life, having someone who is literally walking 241 00:18:52.210 --> 00:18:57.400 alongside that woman for a minimum of a year so that she really knows she 242 00:18:59.160 --> 00:19:03.400 is not alone in this. The third key point is to keep them safe, 243 00:19:03.039 --> 00:19:06.799 and the only way you can do that, first of all, you'd 244 00:19:06.839 --> 00:19:10.710 have to be there or you would have to have connections with someone who is 245 00:19:10.869 --> 00:19:15.069 there. Yeah, with this woman, I didn't have that. But you 246 00:19:15.109 --> 00:19:18.029 can't keep them safe if you don't know if they have a plan, do 247 00:19:18.150 --> 00:19:21.109 they have weapons, and all that kind of stuff. And so what this 248 00:19:21.230 --> 00:19:25.099 article recommended is you find that out. If you're not physically there, ask 249 00:19:25.140 --> 00:19:27.819 a lot of questions. Find out do they have weapons, if they have 250 00:19:29.019 --> 00:19:33.220 weapons in the home, that is actually correlates with a higher likelihood that they 251 00:19:33.259 --> 00:19:38.049 will carry out the suicide. Yeah, so, so again, be direct, 252 00:19:38.369 --> 00:19:41.730 don't bring it to light. Find out do they and if they do, 253 00:19:42.009 --> 00:19:47.329 if they have a plan and if they have weapons, you are supposed 254 00:19:47.369 --> 00:19:51.930 to contact the authorities. Yeah, and that would be a breach of trust 255 00:19:52.170 --> 00:19:55.920 perhaps, but at that point, if that that this is serious, if 256 00:19:55.960 --> 00:20:00.799 they have weapons a plan and you can't be there to physically intervene, someone 257 00:20:00.920 --> 00:20:04.559 needs to be there to physically intervene. Yeah, I have a scripture for 258 00:20:04.680 --> 00:20:11.069 that. Oh Gosh, you are right on it today. Let's going to 259 00:20:11.109 --> 00:20:14.190 be one that really applause. Well, I think it can apply this situation. 260 00:20:14.309 --> 00:20:18.950 But we apply to the unborn the proverbs twenty four, verse eleven. 261 00:20:18.990 --> 00:20:22.539 Yeah, rescue those who are staggering toward the slaughter. Of course, this 262 00:20:22.579 --> 00:20:26.779 is self slaughters, self murders. Yeah, what suicide is? Hold back 263 00:20:26.859 --> 00:20:30.940 those who are stumbling toward death. Right, in a lot of ways, 264 00:20:30.980 --> 00:20:36.009 a woman who's suicidal, a man who suicidal, is staggering, stumbling toward 265 00:20:36.170 --> 00:20:40.130 death. Yeah, and so we're supposed to hold them back, keep them 266 00:20:40.170 --> 00:20:44.049 safe. Yeah, if that means calling the police, if we know they, 267 00:20:44.250 --> 00:20:48.089 like you said, got a plan in plays and they've got the implements 268 00:20:48.170 --> 00:20:51.680 of their death right, it's like, yeah, we gotta interview for their 269 00:20:51.720 --> 00:20:55.119 Sake, because we care about these that's right. We don't want them to 270 00:20:55.160 --> 00:20:57.640 end up in Helle, we don't want them to die, we don't want 271 00:20:57.799 --> 00:21:03.279 the destruction that the devil wants, and so really what we're doing is counteracting 272 00:21:03.319 --> 00:21:07.430 the works of the enemy. Yeah, they're like exactly. Number four is 273 00:21:07.589 --> 00:21:11.869 to help them connect. That's very similar to being there, but in terms 274 00:21:11.910 --> 00:21:17.349 of connecting with a safety net, not just you being there, but because 275 00:21:17.430 --> 00:21:22.660 a suicidal person is, as I can attest, is incredibly draining. There 276 00:21:22.700 --> 00:21:25.339 were times when I would see a text from her where I just felt like 277 00:21:25.460 --> 00:21:27.619 crawling in a hole. Yeah, because it was so ongoing and it's so 278 00:21:27.859 --> 00:21:33.970 heavy. So having connection points for them outside of just you. Yeah, 279 00:21:34.369 --> 00:21:37.089 a safety net. It in in love life. It might be a mentor, 280 00:21:38.089 --> 00:21:42.009 it might be a counselor and a counseling or a counseling group, a 281 00:21:42.170 --> 00:21:48.440 group of friends, whatever, connect the suicide prevention group. So helping them 282 00:21:48.799 --> 00:21:52.720 to connect church pastors, a church. Just think about what can be a 283 00:21:52.839 --> 00:21:56.920 safety net. And asked questions to figure out what might be the best safety 284 00:21:56.960 --> 00:22:00.279 net for the for that particular woman. Do you have a scripture for that? 285 00:22:00.640 --> 00:22:03.910 Well, not one. I mean the ones that I shared earlier kind 286 00:22:03.950 --> 00:22:07.589 of do speak to that, but yeah, not a one prescripture in one 287 00:22:07.230 --> 00:22:11.630 particular scripture in mind. Okay, okay, but maybe I'll come up with 288 00:22:11.670 --> 00:22:14.029 one. Oh, you probably will. Okay. So the last, the 289 00:22:14.109 --> 00:22:18.380 last one of the five key points follow up. Follow up. Don't just 290 00:22:19.299 --> 00:22:26.859 be there for day one and then forget about them. So follow up regularly 291 00:22:26.900 --> 00:22:30.569 after you've connect to even if you've connected them, with trained emergency hot lines 292 00:22:30.569 --> 00:22:36.730 are professionals, continue to stay in touch and studies actually show that there is 293 00:22:36.769 --> 00:22:41.529 a death. I'm sorry, there is a reduction in deaths by suicide when 294 00:22:41.690 --> 00:22:45.720 follow up is involved. So be sure to follow up. So another point 295 00:22:45.799 --> 00:22:51.319 that I want to raise. You raised earlier, but with with this woman 296 00:22:51.359 --> 00:22:56.000 in particular, I was really feeling she kept cycling back. She would be 297 00:22:56.200 --> 00:22:59.549 good for a day or two and then she'd psycle back and at that point 298 00:22:59.589 --> 00:23:04.470 I felt like the I knew she had contacted suicide hotline, I knew she 299 00:23:04.589 --> 00:23:08.430 had supposedly come to the Lord, I knew I was sharing scripture and I 300 00:23:08.549 --> 00:23:12.059 really was kind of at a dead end. Yeah, I had also shared 301 00:23:12.259 --> 00:23:18.660 post aboard of groups with her and and an online post aboard of group, 302 00:23:19.500 --> 00:23:23.779 and she was not taking advantage of those at all. So I ended up 303 00:23:23.819 --> 00:23:27.849 calling Stephanie Ryanhardt, Stephanie Reinhardt, as a name everyone should know. She 304 00:23:29.089 --> 00:23:33.009 is with Love Life Dot Org. She heads up the post aboard of program 305 00:23:33.170 --> 00:23:41.369 with Love Life and so she is very knowledgeable about the specifics of dealing with 306 00:23:41.599 --> 00:23:45.319 a healing program with a post aboard of woman. Yeah, I first of 307 00:23:45.359 --> 00:23:51.039 all asked the woman I was counseling. Can I share the information with Stephanie 308 00:23:52.200 --> 00:23:53.440 and would you be willing to talk with her? She said yes, so 309 00:23:53.480 --> 00:24:00.269 I called Stephanie. I gave her the back background and Stephanie called her immediately 310 00:24:00.670 --> 00:24:07.910 and the immediate aftermath of her talk with Stephanie was that she felt better. 311 00:24:07.990 --> 00:24:12.579 Okay, and I asked for because she's she sent me a verse. The 312 00:24:12.740 --> 00:24:18.539 next day this woman sent me a verse saying this really resonates with me and 313 00:24:18.619 --> 00:24:22.900 it was so perfect. It was such a great verse and I said this 314 00:24:22.099 --> 00:24:26.690 is amazing, I love this verse you. This is showing like a whole 315 00:24:26.769 --> 00:24:33.170 different kind of outlook. Are you to have you reached a turning point? 316 00:24:33.329 --> 00:24:36.329 Are you at a turning point, because this feels like and she said, 317 00:24:36.329 --> 00:24:40.440 you know, I think I might be. And what she said after sharing 318 00:24:40.480 --> 00:24:45.440 that verse was that Stephanie had shared what she called, I forget what they 319 00:24:45.480 --> 00:24:49.680 were called, but it was, oh, declarations. She death. Stephanie 320 00:24:49.759 --> 00:24:55.230 Calls Them Declarations and she shares this as part of her healing Post Board of 321 00:24:55.269 --> 00:25:00.549 program the declarations are all verses who I am in Christ and what it's doing 322 00:25:00.710 --> 00:25:06.589 is shifting that focus on the problems, on the struggles on the grief, 323 00:25:06.750 --> 00:25:11.220 on the sadness, on the suicidal thoughts, shifting them back to Jesus. 324 00:25:11.740 --> 00:25:18.259 But who we are in Jesus and and this woman found those very useful. 325 00:25:19.140 --> 00:25:22.890 What some of them are like? How? Just say the first one, 326 00:25:22.930 --> 00:25:26.250 because anyone can go to our article. They're very there's many of them. 327 00:25:26.769 --> 00:25:33.730 But what what a suicidal woman is saying is I renounce the law. Wait, 328 00:25:33.809 --> 00:25:37.759 wait, she's saying she's rejected, she's on love, she's dirty, 329 00:25:37.839 --> 00:25:41.599 she's shameful, that she can never be accepted. All of that I had 330 00:25:41.720 --> 00:25:48.200 heard from this woman. Yeah, but what God says for is yet to 331 00:25:48.319 --> 00:25:51.869 to all who did receive him, to those who believed in his name, 332 00:25:51.910 --> 00:25:56.630 he gave the right to become children of God. So I am a child 333 00:25:56.789 --> 00:25:59.950 of God, and repeating that declaration, I am a child of God, 334 00:26:00.349 --> 00:26:03.190 and then the a verse that's linked with it, and there's many of them. 335 00:26:03.230 --> 00:26:07.099 Yeah, those were very, very helpful. Yeah, for this woman, 336 00:26:07.099 --> 00:26:11.579 of course, that really speaks to the word of God being like let's 337 00:26:11.740 --> 00:26:15.740 let's believe the report of the of the Lord, in contrast our feelings. 338 00:26:15.819 --> 00:26:18.650 Right. Yeah, and if she's a believer in Jesus, and you said 339 00:26:18.650 --> 00:26:22.970 You share the Gospel where and she surrender her life to Jesus, then she 340 00:26:23.089 --> 00:26:26.369 has this declaration to make that she's a child of God, that she belongs 341 00:26:26.490 --> 00:26:30.250 to the king of kings and the Lord of Lords and she's his child and 342 00:26:30.329 --> 00:26:34.000 according to this scripture, in contrast to her feelings, right, I think 343 00:26:34.000 --> 00:26:41.400 that's good. Yeah, now what happened later, a day, I think 344 00:26:41.440 --> 00:26:45.480 it was a day or two later, was I could tell from the text 345 00:26:45.559 --> 00:26:49.230 I was getting that she was cycling back. Okay, so just remember not 346 00:26:49.430 --> 00:26:53.750 to be discouraged by that. But remember those five key points. One of 347 00:26:53.789 --> 00:27:00.269 them was stay in touch, get a connection point and a safety net for 348 00:27:00.509 --> 00:27:04.259 her. Yeah, so we're working on that. Stephanie has connected her with 349 00:27:04.460 --> 00:27:10.900 a post aboordive group and I am staying in touch every single day. I 350 00:27:11.019 --> 00:27:15.259 send her scripture first thing in the morning. She agreed to join my email 351 00:27:15.380 --> 00:27:18.890 group. That is blind copied. So every single morning I know that she's 352 00:27:18.970 --> 00:27:22.529 getting that. But then I always send at least one or two other texts 353 00:27:22.569 --> 00:27:26.210 throughout the day, just maybe a scripture that hips hits me or just saying 354 00:27:26.210 --> 00:27:33.799 hey, how are you? Yeah, so that is really critical, I 355 00:27:33.960 --> 00:27:37.000 think, for us to remind everyone don't give up, even though it seems 356 00:27:37.119 --> 00:27:42.720 really depressing. Don't give up. Be there for any mom or woman, 357 00:27:42.759 --> 00:27:48.670 or anyone really who is in this kind of a desperate situation, because the 358 00:27:48.829 --> 00:27:56.029 fact that you are fighting for them is is really important. Yeah, yeah, 359 00:27:56.029 --> 00:27:57.980 absolutely. Yeah. Yeah, don't shy away from the word of God, 360 00:27:59.140 --> 00:28:02.220 don't shy word right away from the truth of the Gospel, don't shy 361 00:28:02.220 --> 00:28:07.259 away from the reality of sin. Yeah, and don't shy away from praying 362 00:28:07.980 --> 00:28:12.170 to the Lord and put in this situation in his hands, because ultimately he's 363 00:28:12.210 --> 00:28:15.250 the one that's got to bring his comfort to them. Yeah, draw them 364 00:28:15.329 --> 00:28:18.089 near to himself. Yeah, and again, it's the power of the Gospel 365 00:28:18.210 --> 00:28:21.769 is going to break that cycle of sin that they're caught up in, that 366 00:28:21.849 --> 00:28:25.529 cycle of depression that they're caught up in. But I think again, the 367 00:28:25.609 --> 00:28:30.400 most powerful is the Gospel. But then beyond that is your presence, you 368 00:28:30.640 --> 00:28:34.079 following up on a regular basis. I will say one thing to be super 369 00:28:34.240 --> 00:28:40.680 aware of and to not do, because it can be a deal breaker, 370 00:28:41.589 --> 00:28:45.269 is to breach trust. Yeah, and confidentiality. Yeah, like you did. 371 00:28:45.630 --> 00:28:49.710 You asked first if you could share with Stephanie, right, and connector 372 00:28:49.750 --> 00:28:53.069 with Stephanie, you got to ask first, right, if you're going to 373 00:28:53.150 --> 00:28:56.779 share, maybe you want people to be praying for the situation. You certainly 374 00:28:56.819 --> 00:29:00.380 would. Yeah, don't share any specifics, right, don't want to breach 375 00:29:00.460 --> 00:29:04.539 confidential reality because that will break down the conversation. I meily right find out, 376 00:29:06.299 --> 00:29:08.619 and it can. It can actually add to some of that depression. 377 00:29:08.700 --> 00:29:14.210 It's suicidal thoughts. This idea that that buddies for me, the fact that 378 00:29:14.730 --> 00:29:18.009 she knows that she's got you, Vicky, in her corner. Yeah, 379 00:29:18.170 --> 00:29:22.690 and now, with your permission, you invited her to connect with Stephanie s 380 00:29:22.690 --> 00:29:25.200 right, Stephanie in her corner. Right, the more people they get in 381 00:29:25.240 --> 00:29:27.440 their corner that they know are present and that are for them, yeah, 382 00:29:29.640 --> 00:29:33.400 the less likely are to go through with any suicidal right. And and I 383 00:29:33.519 --> 00:29:37.829 do want to add one other thought, is you may not be successful in 384 00:29:37.950 --> 00:29:42.750 terms of saving this life. You may not be, and you cannot take 385 00:29:42.869 --> 00:29:48.190 that on yourself. That is not your fault. Should this woman end up 386 00:29:48.230 --> 00:29:52.630 committing suicide, I pray she does and I don't think she will. But 387 00:29:52.380 --> 00:29:56.940 in the same thing, we urge counselors. You can't take the depth of 388 00:29:56.180 --> 00:30:00.460 the aborted babies on your plate either. It's not your fault. We are 389 00:30:00.500 --> 00:30:04.700 not responsible for the results, but we are responsible for being faithful, in 390 00:30:04.819 --> 00:30:10.410 obeying God and in doing what we can and leave the results to God. 391 00:30:10.529 --> 00:30:14.569 Yeah, yeah, Amen, yeah, that's good. Hopefully, guys, 392 00:30:14.650 --> 00:30:18.289 this was a blessing. This was encouraging to you. Guys. Some things 393 00:30:18.329 --> 00:30:21.559 to dig into a little more. We have an article that you can check 394 00:30:21.599 --> 00:30:26.960 out on the sidewalks for life website in equipping articles. So this article will 395 00:30:26.960 --> 00:30:30.759 be out around the same time that this podcast comes out. Also, when 396 00:30:30.759 --> 00:30:33.079 a key you guys into a resource that we created a couple of weeks ago. 397 00:30:33.759 --> 00:30:37.990 It's basically just a web page with all of our all of our gospel 398 00:30:38.029 --> 00:30:41.869 center pro life epid episodes on it and a search feature where you can search 399 00:30:41.950 --> 00:30:48.430 keywords, maybe like suicide, and it'll actually look at any of our episodes 400 00:30:48.509 --> 00:30:51.140 that mention that word. It'll look through the titles, but also through the 401 00:30:51.220 --> 00:30:56.819 body of it, because it puts it out in a transcript. And so 402 00:30:56.180 --> 00:31:03.539 use that feature, use that website, Gospel Centered prolifecom, and share this 403 00:31:03.660 --> 00:31:06.650 episode with other people, share the podcast if you think it will be a 404 00:31:06.690 --> 00:31:10.210 blessing to others. Share it with them shared on social media. Reach out 405 00:31:10.250 --> 00:31:11.609 to us. You can reach me, Daniel at Love Life Dot Org. 406 00:31:11.690 --> 00:31:15.369 You reach her, Vicky at Love Life Dot Org. If you have questions 407 00:31:15.410 --> 00:31:18.759 or comments subjects us like for us to cover. We'd love to hear from 408 00:31:18.799 --> 00:31:26.880 you. And until next time, God bless capless Y'all our love for love. 409 00:31:30.599 --> 00:31:40.069 Give me our love for gratitude. I know it will cost me my 410 00:31:40.390 --> 00:31:47.779 life. Nothing's too precious, and some that you