Ministering In Our Mess

WEBVTT100:00:00.560 --> 00:00:05.759I Am Yours, I am yours, I am yours, s and me.200:00:06.120 --> 00:00:10.550Lord, I welcome to the GospelCenter pro life podcast and this episode300:00:10.589 --> 00:00:13.349we're going to talk about ministering inour mess, and if you're wondering what400:00:13.390 --> 00:00:16.750that means, then stay tuned forthis episode because we feel like it will500:00:16.750 --> 00:00:20.190be a blessing to people in anykind of ministry, especially Pro Life Ministry.600:00:23.699 --> 00:00:34.060I felt show tassish touch your welcometo the Gospel Center pro life podcast.700:00:35.340 --> 00:00:41.810We wanted to do an episode aboutministering in our mess and we realize,800:00:42.289 --> 00:00:45.609and hopefully this podcast is a blessingto pro life people. But I900:00:45.729 --> 00:00:50.079mean I realize, with this oneand then the last podcast that we did,1000:00:50.240 --> 00:00:54.560the two part podcast about empowering versusenabling, that this will be more1100:00:54.960 --> 00:00:59.719broad than just pro life ministry,but really any ministry, anybody that's involved1200:00:59.719 --> 00:01:02.920in ministry, I think, willbenefit off of these podcasts. Yes,1300:01:03.399 --> 00:01:07.670because we all deal with our mess, and this episode in particular we're talking1400:01:07.670 --> 00:01:11.709about ministering in our mess. NowI think in some sense at least,1500:01:11.829 --> 00:01:15.030you know, because of our experienceand just what we do, that it's1600:01:15.069 --> 00:01:21.340heightened in prolife ministry because we're dealingwith literally life and death situations. That1700:01:21.379 --> 00:01:23.980doesn't make our ministry more important,although I think it is more important because1800:01:25.019 --> 00:01:26.780it's what God has called me to. But it is to make us more1900:01:26.819 --> 00:01:32.140important. It just it's our experience. Right. We have mess that we2000:01:32.260 --> 00:01:36.290deal with, and this in particularcomes with your experience, Vicki, in2100:01:36.530 --> 00:01:40.010ministry, but we all have experiencing. I can, I'll share some of2200:01:40.609 --> 00:01:42.170the mess that I've had to ministerto. And what we mean by that2300:01:42.890 --> 00:01:47.049is there's junk going on in ourlives and our personal lives, our family2400:01:47.159 --> 00:01:51.159lives, church life, whatever dowas we all did with mess in our2500:01:51.200 --> 00:01:53.519lives. For sure, we're allcalled the ministry and we're going to have2600:01:53.519 --> 00:01:57.840to minister in that mass. Anddoes there come a point where we need2700:01:57.920 --> 00:02:00.079to stop doing ministry? You know, in particular, what we're talking about2800:02:00.079 --> 00:02:02.750a sidewalk counseling ministry. is tocome a point where you need to stop2900:02:02.870 --> 00:02:06.430going out to the sidewalk because ofthe things that are going on in your3000:02:06.469 --> 00:02:09.750life, or do you need topress on through that? And hopefully you3100:02:09.870 --> 00:02:14.509know there's some situations. I justsay right right away that there's some situations3200:02:14.590 --> 00:02:16.979where yet you do need to stepback from the sidewalk, you do need3300:02:17.020 --> 00:02:21.740to step back from ministering in thepregnancy center, you do need to step3400:02:21.780 --> 00:02:23.300back even, you know, pastorsneed to step back from the pulpit.3500:02:23.419 --> 00:02:29.219Sometimes I need to step back fromministrying that capacity, but I think maybe3600:02:29.300 --> 00:02:31.569not more often than not. Butwe need to be discerning and trying to3700:02:31.569 --> 00:02:36.090figure out window. I just needto press through this now. We're not3800:02:36.250 --> 00:02:38.330even necessarily going to be talking aboutsin issues. I think that can be3900:02:38.370 --> 00:02:43.409a whole separate thing. Where we'retalking about there's unrepentant sin in your life,4000:02:43.689 --> 00:02:46.800right then that's not ministering through yourmass, right, that's ministering in4100:02:46.919 --> 00:02:51.800the midst of sin. You needto repent and and probably why, I'd4200:02:51.800 --> 00:02:54.120say. Certainly do need to stepout of ministry. So we're not really4300:02:54.199 --> 00:03:00.389talking about that per se. Whatwe're talking about is family issues, health4400:03:00.550 --> 00:03:05.430issues, even, I don't know, mental issues that you're dealing with.4500:03:05.469 --> 00:03:08.349I don't know. You know,not mental illness, just emotional stuff and4600:03:08.469 --> 00:03:13.620all that right. So yeah,yeah, you know. And something that4700:03:14.419 --> 00:03:19.620just occurred to me while you werespeaking was sometimes that mess is the result4800:03:19.740 --> 00:03:23.659of spiritual warfare. Yeah, that'sthat's an important point, different and that's4900:03:23.699 --> 00:03:29.289why I say you know again fromour experience what we're dealing with now.5000:03:29.289 --> 00:03:35.449I'll tell folks the abortion issue andespecially add the abortion clinics. That's the5100:03:35.569 --> 00:03:38.530devil's pride and joy, right,the sacrifice of little baby boys, a5200:03:38.569 --> 00:03:43.800little baby girls, like the devil'salways been after the destruction of the image5300:03:43.840 --> 00:03:49.400of God, and that's where ittakes place, place most predominantly, I5400:03:49.479 --> 00:03:52.599guess you'd say. And if you'regoing to go out there, we tell5500:03:52.599 --> 00:03:53.439our volunteers, if you're going tocome out here and commit to this,5600:03:53.639 --> 00:03:57.110it's things a devil's pride and joyand he's not going to leave you alone.5700:03:57.110 --> 00:03:59.949There's going to be some spiritual warfarein your life that you have not5800:04:00.110 --> 00:04:02.909experienced before if you're involved in that, and this particular ministry doesn't mean it5900:04:02.949 --> 00:04:06.590doesn't happen in other ministries. Itdoes. You know, people talk about6000:04:06.710 --> 00:04:11.300when they go to be missionaries inother countries and there's a lot of just6100:04:11.460 --> 00:04:15.099demonic activity in those countries and thingsthat they're the spiritual warfare is heightened.6200:04:15.099 --> 00:04:18.339That certainly true. But that isan important point, is that we're maybe6300:04:18.420 --> 00:04:23.779talking more than anything about spiritual towarfare, the things that happened right based6400:04:23.860 --> 00:04:26.930on the fact that you've committed yourselfto the Lord to really be in the6500:04:27.009 --> 00:04:30.769battle. Because, let's face it, most Christians, though, were we6600:04:30.490 --> 00:04:33.170get in the spiritual battle. Whenyou become a Christian, you're in the6700:04:33.250 --> 00:04:38.370battle, but most Christians are notengaged in the spiritual battle. Most Christians6800:04:38.370 --> 00:04:41.639are, you know, sitting onthe pews, sidelines. When you jump6900:04:41.720 --> 00:04:45.959into the battle, this is whenthe mass is really going to be kicked7000:04:46.000 --> 00:04:48.319up and you know a thousand notches. You know it. I had I7100:04:48.439 --> 00:04:54.470had one volunteer recently tell me,but do people think you're nutty when you7200:04:54.589 --> 00:04:59.470talk about spiritual warfare? And Isaid probably, but it's still real.7300:04:59.550 --> 00:05:02.870Yeah, and I never knew that. Honestly, I never knew that till7400:05:02.910 --> 00:05:08.540I was on the sidewalk in frontof an abortion center. And I believe7500:05:09.339 --> 00:05:15.100was effective. And the devil doesnot like, yes, being affected when7600:05:15.100 --> 00:05:18.139you advanced, when you're being usedby the Lord to advance his kingdom,7700:05:18.699 --> 00:05:21.730the devil's not just going to sitby and let you do that without some7800:05:21.930 --> 00:05:28.129opposition. So so kind of somethingto think about in the background of this7900:05:28.290 --> 00:05:35.720whole discussion today is do we thenback off because we're under bitter attack?8000:05:36.160 --> 00:05:42.959And I would say no, right, no, but there are some attacks8100:05:43.560 --> 00:05:50.670that are so brutal, and Idid experience that, that it is almost8200:05:50.750 --> 00:05:59.269impossible not to back off. Yeah, because it's so dangerous. This is8300:05:59.470 --> 00:06:03.699this is one of those points whereI need to remind folks that we're in8400:06:03.779 --> 00:06:06.180a spiritual battle. For sure,no matter what we're doing, if we're8500:06:06.180 --> 00:06:11.860advancing God's kingdom, we're in aspiritual battle and we can't, we can't8600:06:11.980 --> 00:06:14.819fight alone. That's why it's importantfor us to be a part of a8700:06:14.899 --> 00:06:16.579local church. If you don't havethe support, the prayer, support,8800:06:16.699 --> 00:06:21.089the encouragement from your local church,it's really hard to get through it if8900:06:21.129 --> 00:06:26.810you don't have other believers around you. That's one of the real blessings for9000:06:26.970 --> 00:06:29.250being a part of cities for life. Me On the sidewalks we have a9100:06:29.290 --> 00:06:32.680group of people who are just someof the most godly and encouraging people you'll9200:06:32.680 --> 00:06:36.480ever meet and we encourage each otherout there. So we need each other.9300:06:36.680 --> 00:06:40.160It's can't, can't fight this thingalone, and some of the things9400:06:40.199 --> 00:06:45.319that I've seen in pro life orabolitionists or whatever people want to call themselves,9500:06:45.360 --> 00:06:46.870minister, and out an abortion clinic. I've seen people burn out.9600:06:46.910 --> 00:06:51.509I've seen people crash and burn becausethere are loners out there by themselves and9700:06:51.670 --> 00:06:56.029they're trying to do this thing alongwith no support, with no encouragement from9800:06:56.029 --> 00:06:59.629their local church, no accountability,and it just does not go well.9900:07:00.029 --> 00:07:03.259Right. Yeah, and the massof their lives ends up overtaking them and10000:07:03.620 --> 00:07:09.060they become very ineffective. I've seenthat more than more than once, right10100:07:09.220 --> 00:07:12.740place, so I can speak veryknowledgeably. Yeah, I want you to10200:07:12.779 --> 00:07:15.699get into your store because I thinkthis will help. This will help people.10300:07:15.810 --> 00:07:18.370Yeah, about I don't know,four years ago, four to five10400:07:18.410 --> 00:07:23.009years ago, was when it startedand I was I'd been on the sidewalk10500:07:23.050 --> 00:07:28.649probably about a year. I hadexperienced spiritual warfare, but not to the10600:07:28.850 --> 00:07:33.800extent of what happened. All inthe space of about three months and in10700:07:34.279 --> 00:07:41.720that time period in my life,really everything that I held dear fell apart.10800:07:42.759 --> 00:07:47.110There were severe family issues. Myfamily just really imploded. Yeah,10900:07:47.149 --> 00:07:56.430in many areas, savings wiped outmy both my parents were put in and11000:07:56.750 --> 00:08:01.579they lost their health and had togo into assisted living and I pretty much11100:08:01.819 --> 00:08:07.019singlehandedly moved them. I was theone that went and and helped to gather11200:08:07.139 --> 00:08:11.180all their things, went to thenursing homes and and help them select a11300:08:11.180 --> 00:08:18.449nursing home and enormously emotionally difficult.Yeah, both my dogs, my beloved11400:08:18.649 --> 00:08:26.410dogs, died of cancer and thenI was diagnosed with breast cancer, and11500:08:26.610 --> 00:08:33.799that all happened literally within a threemonth period, right. So it was11600:08:33.879 --> 00:08:37.159a mess going on. Oh,it was such a mess and in every11700:08:37.399 --> 00:08:43.909area and I really had no idea, yea, how I was going to11800:08:43.149 --> 00:08:48.549survive. Yeah, there was justso much sorrow, yeah, and despair.11900:08:50.230 --> 00:08:56.860So I had a choice. Icould have stopped coming out to the12000:08:56.139 --> 00:09:03.100sidewalk, but I didn't because Ikept saying in my head I hate what's12100:09:03.139 --> 00:09:07.220happening in my life, and Iactually hated some people in my life at12200:09:07.259 --> 00:09:13.289the time, but I hated Satanmore. Yeah, and I was not12300:09:13.929 --> 00:09:18.490going to give him the victory.Yeah, I was determined not to give12400:09:18.490 --> 00:09:22.690him the victory and I would driveto the sidewalk for on my ministry day.12500:09:22.730 --> 00:09:26.480At that time, I was comingout just once a week, crying12600:09:26.559 --> 00:09:31.720my eyes out, thinking about allthese things, everything that I was facing12700:09:31.799 --> 00:09:37.080and thinking, how on earth canI minister to anyone with all that I'm12800:09:37.200 --> 00:09:45.950struggling with? And I would getthere and God would just take over,12900:09:46.269 --> 00:09:48.909yeah, and take care of me. And I think part of it was13000:09:48.110 --> 00:09:54.580that I was surrounded by godly peoplewho none, a very few new,13100:09:54.059 --> 00:09:58.820if any. Buddy, I don'tthink I shared with anyone out here much13200:09:58.820 --> 00:10:05.419of what I was going through,but but I was in the midst of13300:10:05.500 --> 00:10:11.129people who were filled with this holyspirit and loved God and and and came13400:10:13.809 --> 00:10:18.929right surrounded me with that, withthat love and knowledge of God. So13500:10:18.090 --> 00:10:22.799there was that, which I thinkwas critical. But there was also that13600:10:22.240 --> 00:10:26.039in the midst of all that stuffthat I was struggling with, God was13700:10:26.200 --> 00:10:31.399using me. There was no doubtthere would be women, saved, women13800:10:31.440 --> 00:10:33.960that would come to the Lord,women that would come and talk to me,13900:10:35.120 --> 00:10:39.950women that would choose life, andI knew God was using me as14000:10:39.070 --> 00:10:46.350a an instrument to bring that aboutand it brought me so much joy,14100:10:46.629 --> 00:10:52.139really the only joy, yeah,that I experienced was experiencing at that time14200:10:52.299 --> 00:10:56.139in my life. Yeah, andpurpose. Yeah, well, one of14300:10:56.139 --> 00:11:01.259the realities that we see scripturally speaking, because this is not just we're not14400:11:01.460 --> 00:11:05.090just talking experential the Bible. Whatthe Bible teaches them, what the Bible14500:11:05.169 --> 00:11:07.570says is most important to us,not just our experience. And we talked14600:11:07.570 --> 00:11:11.090about spiritual warfare. People can getkind of weirded out by that. Are14700:11:11.090 --> 00:11:15.009you talking about some cookie stuff,you know, when you're seeing angels and14800:11:15.129 --> 00:11:20.000demons and all that, and Imean biblically the kind of stuff can happen.14900:11:20.200 --> 00:11:22.519Angels Do show up and demons donew show up, but we're not15000:11:22.639 --> 00:11:26.440really talking about that. What we'retalking about is is some of the attacks15100:11:26.480 --> 00:11:31.799that just come physically. We're talkingabout attacks that come on your mind,15200:11:31.360 --> 00:11:35.750things that like, why am Ithinking this way? Why am I you15300:11:35.830 --> 00:11:37.909know, in just in general,just your life being under a tag.15400:11:37.950 --> 00:11:41.509It seems like you're you're getting hitfrom every angle. And so we're talking15500:11:41.509 --> 00:11:46.309about spiritual warfare. We really talkingabout how it hits home practically in a15600:11:46.350 --> 00:11:50.460lot of ways and and how itcan you at least. Have you tempted15700:11:50.500 --> 00:11:54.620to back away from ministry in atime where you really just need to press15800:11:54.700 --> 00:11:56.820in now? Yeah, again,there are times when, you know,15900:11:56.940 --> 00:12:01.450I'll tell our volunteers that your firstministry, because a lot of our volunteers16000:12:01.649 --> 00:12:05.289or women, a lot of themhomeschool moms and that kind of thing,16100:12:07.210 --> 00:12:09.850and I tell them your first ministriesto your family. So here's a gage16200:12:11.250 --> 00:12:15.210for me. If you need toback away from ministry, is you being16300:12:15.250 --> 00:12:18.879out here on the sidewalk taking awayfrom your first and Primary Ministry, which16400:12:18.879 --> 00:12:22.039is to your family? If it'staken away from that doesn't mean that there's16500:12:22.039 --> 00:12:24.840not going to be some times,and we talked about this a little bit16600:12:24.960 --> 00:12:28.399in there in our last couple ofpodcast there's going to be some times where16700:12:28.399 --> 00:12:31.470you just have to press in andyou have to you know, whatever you16800:12:31.549 --> 00:12:35.429know, Miss, you know,soccer games or something like that out.16900:12:35.429 --> 00:12:37.870It shouldn't be a regular pattern.So I'm not encouraging any of that,17000:12:37.909 --> 00:12:39.509but I'm just saying there's gonna besome times some sacrifices you have to make.17100:12:39.870 --> 00:12:43.419But if you're neglecting your first ministry, if you're neglecting your family and17200:12:43.580 --> 00:12:48.659whatever ministry involved in, then youdefinitely need to rethink that thing. Right.17300:12:50.379 --> 00:12:54.299But there is a hard and I'mlisten, we're not on this podcast17400:12:54.379 --> 00:12:58.179to give you the answer of whenyou need to back away from ministry and17500:12:58.259 --> 00:13:00.529when you need to press in.I'm not. I don't think we're going17600:13:00.570 --> 00:13:03.169to give you the exact answer theyonly answer we're going to say is you17700:13:03.210 --> 00:13:07.129need to seek the Lord and youneed to seek godly counsel from other people.17800:13:07.210 --> 00:13:09.490It's always good, again, tobe a part of a local church.17900:13:09.529 --> 00:13:11.330We can talk with your pastor youcan talk with other elders in the18000:13:11.370 --> 00:13:16.440church. Of course, if you'rea woman and you know if your man,18100:13:16.600 --> 00:13:18.799talk to your wife, talk toyour husband, get counseled from them,18200:13:18.919 --> 00:13:20.279get counseled from other brothers and sisters. Hey, do I need to18300:13:20.320 --> 00:13:24.399press in or do I need toback away from ministry? But there are18400:13:24.440 --> 00:13:26.830some principles and there's there's a scripturethat you brought out. Really think it's18500:13:26.830 --> 00:13:31.870important for us to have a themescripture. Yes, at least a couple18600:13:31.870 --> 00:13:35.149of scriptures that were thinking about whenwe're thinking about this whole thing, ministering18700:13:35.190 --> 00:13:39.669through our mess. So what isthat scripture? Second Corinthians twelve. Second18800:13:39.750 --> 00:13:43.940Corinthians twelve nine. Okay, andhe has said to me, my grace18900:13:43.059 --> 00:13:48.820is sufficient for you, for poweris perfected in weakness. Most gladly,19000:13:48.940 --> 00:13:54.740therefore, I will rather boast aboutmy weaknesses so that the power of Christ19100:13:54.139 --> 00:14:01.129may dwell in me. So thatscripture really spoke to me in in one19200:14:01.769 --> 00:14:09.690way, saying, yes, youmay bring your mess to ministry and still19300:14:09.360 --> 00:14:13.799be effective in ministry. Yeah,and I think that's kind of the main19400:14:15.600 --> 00:14:20.919point of when I was thinking throughthis, that you can be a mess19500:14:20.360 --> 00:14:28.070and still be effective and not tobe afraid or feel like a hypocrite that19600:14:28.389 --> 00:14:33.149I'm so broken, how could Iposs simply help fix someone else? Yeah,19700:14:33.629 --> 00:14:39.980while I was going through my reallyextreme struggles, there were some principles19800:14:39.379 --> 00:14:46.860that I learned that sustained me andI think might be valuable to others.19900:14:46.259 --> 00:14:54.970So I I thought of five thatthat I felt were lessons I had learned20000:14:54.049 --> 00:15:01.490as as I went went through whatI was going through. So the first20100:15:01.529 --> 00:15:07.200one is hate and anger should neverbe our motivation. Okay, for minutes,20200:15:07.399 --> 00:15:11.440because there can be some things goingon in your life, personal issues,20300:15:11.639 --> 00:15:18.039people that are doing things to youthat are not good and taking advantage20400:15:18.039 --> 00:15:22.029of you in certain ways, whatever. I don't know. I'm not going20500:15:22.070 --> 00:15:24.110to name out a bunch of contime. I mean it could be a husband20600:15:24.110 --> 00:15:28.470and wife relationship, it could beother relationship. Church relationships, even where20700:15:28.470 --> 00:15:31.070people are taking advantage of people notdoing what they should be doing from their20800:15:31.149 --> 00:15:37.059perspective. And of course it's personallyoffensive. It makes you angry and and20900:15:37.860 --> 00:15:41.980you can be anger angered and justkind of vent that anger you at the21000:15:43.019 --> 00:15:48.059abortion clinic or whatever ministry that you'reinvolved in. And we tell people and21100:15:48.259 --> 00:15:52.370we put it out there. I'llrefer you, guys, to to our21200:15:52.409 --> 00:15:54.889sidewalks for life site and I talkedabout this article I'd wrote at the very21300:15:54.889 --> 00:15:58.250beginning. We started putting out ballpost for that website. And it's the21400:15:58.289 --> 00:16:03.850philosophy of ministry. What is ourphilosophy of Ministry as Gospel sent itsild World21500:16:03.889 --> 00:16:07.200Counselors? And one of those thingsis that our motivation cannot be hatred for21600:16:07.279 --> 00:16:12.080abortion. We can't be motivated byhatred for abortion, by hatred for parenthood,21700:16:12.200 --> 00:16:17.600certainly by hatred for people. Andand in the same way this that21800:16:17.840 --> 00:16:21.750that point, applause here. Hatredcannot be a motivation for ministry. It's21900:16:21.870 --> 00:16:26.950wicked as abortion is, it cannotbe our motivation for ministry. Right.22000:16:26.629 --> 00:16:30.830It's not. It's bad to hateabortion. It's not. You should hate22100:16:30.830 --> 00:16:33.899abortion. It's a very evil thing, but it cannot be your primary motivation.22200:16:33.980 --> 00:16:38.379Right, and an understanding. Iknow when I was going through there22300:16:38.500 --> 00:16:41.779was a great deal of anger.As I was going through my mass,22400:16:44.419 --> 00:16:51.210I really analyzed where that anger wascoming from and for me there were two22500:16:51.250 --> 00:17:00.330main areas fear and hurt. Okay. So knowing that actually God used that22600:17:00.129 --> 00:17:07.640revelation of using my own anger andunderstanding where that was coming from to better22700:17:07.680 --> 00:17:14.160understand the people that I was ministeringto do too, and feeling greater empathy22800:17:15.359 --> 00:17:21.230towards and for them because of whatI knew. I was what was the22900:17:21.309 --> 00:17:29.829source of my anger, and itbecame I was not as defensive or harmed23000:17:30.420 --> 00:17:33.339by their anger, the anger ofthe peep, because at at least,23100:17:33.380 --> 00:17:37.259I don't know if that's true ofall ministries, but certainly in our ministry,23200:17:37.380 --> 00:17:41.220the people we minister to are oftenvery angry. Yeah, at us.23300:17:41.220 --> 00:17:47.329Yeah, we get a lot ofangry tirades directed toward us. Yeah,23400:17:47.970 --> 00:17:49.970well, from time to time,from time that time. Yeah,23500:17:51.970 --> 00:17:56.450so I recognize that, just asas I had at times during what I23600:17:56.569 --> 00:18:03.640was going through, fueled my angerin destructive ways. Yeah, that's what23700:18:03.279 --> 00:18:08.440those women are often doing. Yeah, out at the abortion center the abortion23800:18:08.519 --> 00:18:14.430minded women and it gave me awhole new to really important things, gave23900:18:14.470 --> 00:18:21.829me a whole new insight into ministeringto them, but also changed me.24000:18:22.269 --> 00:18:26.349Yeah, it changed me. Inthe mess that I was going through,24100:18:26.630 --> 00:18:33.339God was healing me and giving menew strategies. You had to more effectively24200:18:33.500 --> 00:18:41.099deal with things that I was doingto cause some of that mess. That's24300:18:41.180 --> 00:18:45.369it. The Lord uses mess thatwe bring upon ourselves and other people bring24400:18:45.410 --> 00:18:49.769upon us to sanctify us. Andultimately, I think you'll talk a little24500:18:49.769 --> 00:18:53.329bit more about this as we're goingthrough, from your personal experience, but24600:18:53.410 --> 00:18:59.640just biblically in general. Who's ourexample, right? Jesus example, and24700:18:59.720 --> 00:19:02.960look, get the mess that hehad to minister through. Yes, he24800:19:03.079 --> 00:19:04.599came into his own and his owndid not receive him. So he came24900:19:04.680 --> 00:19:10.000to the Jewish people and he's theMessiah. It comes on the scene to25000:19:10.509 --> 00:19:12.829heal their wounds and to, youknow, to lead them to truth,25100:19:12.869 --> 00:19:17.390and they outright reject him and he'sdealing with, you know, brick law25200:19:17.470 --> 00:19:22.190after brick wall in Ministry and UltimatelyHe's crucified right, just completely rejected.25300:19:22.390 --> 00:19:26.220All he does is good for peopleand they want to accuse him of being,25400:19:26.500 --> 00:19:30.259you know, he's casting demons outof people. There's saying you're doing25500:19:30.259 --> 00:19:33.500it by the power of demons.Wow, he can't win for losing with25600:19:33.500 --> 00:19:37.140these people, right. And he'sare ultimate example of ministering through the mass.25700:19:37.569 --> 00:19:41.970And yet, you know, wesee in Christ that he's always going25800:19:42.170 --> 00:19:45.849to the father, he's always clingingto the father, he's always, you25900:19:45.930 --> 00:19:48.690know, confiding, I guess youcould say, in the father and and26000:19:49.130 --> 00:19:53.759and that's his source for life,so to speak. Now he's, of26100:19:53.839 --> 00:19:59.839course, the divine son of God, but he's showing us in his humanity,26200:19:59.920 --> 00:20:03.960because he lays that that divinity ina sense aside, and in his26300:20:03.039 --> 00:20:07.670humanity showing us what it is tobe in fellowship with a father and the26400:20:07.789 --> 00:20:11.829minister out of that. And that'san important point exactly. And that's where26500:20:11.829 --> 00:20:15.670where he found his strength and that'swhere we find our strength and instead of26600:20:15.789 --> 00:20:21.150focusing on how weak we are,how reviled we are, whatever, yea,26700:20:21.190 --> 00:20:22.940because seen on God. You know, the Apostle Paul, you know,26800:20:23.059 --> 00:20:27.299you read that scripture from the SecondCorinthians right, another scripture in Second26900:20:27.339 --> 00:20:30.220Corinthians, very early on Second Corinthians, chapter to this is one of my27000:20:30.259 --> 00:20:34.849favorite scriptures when it talks about sufficiencyand being sufficient in ourselves. The danger27100:20:36.250 --> 00:20:38.890is when we think we've got ittogether, that we don't have mess going27200:20:38.970 --> 00:20:42.569on, we've got it figured outand we can minister in our own sufficiency,27300:20:44.009 --> 00:20:47.009that would be that would be aterrible trap to fall into. Yeah,27400:20:47.089 --> 00:20:48.529so, if nothing else, maybethis podcast will help you from from27500:20:48.690 --> 00:20:52.319falling into that Chap, because whenyou think you've got it figured out and27600:20:52.400 --> 00:20:55.119you can do this in your ownstrength, you're in the worst place you27700:20:55.160 --> 00:20:57.519could possibly be in. But thisis sack Corinthians, to Second Corinthians,27800:20:57.640 --> 00:21:02.400to and verse fourteen, and saysnow thinks me to God, who always27900:21:02.440 --> 00:21:06.349leads us in triumph in Christ.Our triumph is in Christ, not in28000:21:06.589 --> 00:21:11.829in and of ourselves, and throughand through us, diffuses the fragrance of28100:21:11.950 --> 00:21:15.589his knowledge in every place, forwe are to God, the fragrance of28200:21:15.670 --> 00:21:18.980Christ among those who are being savedand among those who are perishing. To28300:21:19.099 --> 00:21:22.819the one we are the Roma,the aroma of death leading to death,28400:21:23.299 --> 00:21:27.059and to the other, the aromaof life leading to life. Who is28500:21:27.140 --> 00:21:32.140sufficient for these things? And sohe's talking about the Ministry of the Gospel.28600:21:32.180 --> 00:21:33.289He's talking about going in. Imean, look at the life of28700:21:33.329 --> 00:21:38.170the Apostle Paul. He's going intoareas where people are trying to kill him.28800:21:38.210 --> 00:21:42.690There are people who are refusing hismessage and casting him out of the28900:21:42.769 --> 00:21:47.440city and threatening to kill him,and mobs are raising up against him,29000:21:47.680 --> 00:21:51.119and then there are people who arereceiving the message of the Gospel and there29100:21:51.160 --> 00:21:53.640are all kinds of miracles taking placethrough this brother. So he's seeing,29200:21:53.759 --> 00:21:59.039like both extremes and he's recognizing inthis he says, to one we are29300:21:59.079 --> 00:22:00.549the fragrance of death leading to death, like they hate us, they want29400:22:00.549 --> 00:22:03.390us to get away from we arestinching their nostrils, and to the other29500:22:03.470 --> 00:22:07.630where fragrance of life leading to life. He says, who's sufficient for these29600:22:07.670 --> 00:22:11.549things, like who can deal withboth of these extremes? Who can deal29700:22:11.630 --> 00:22:15.460with the tension of ministry? Whocan deal with the mess in personally,29800:22:15.500 --> 00:22:21.099in our lives, and the messthat ministry itself brings? Who's sufficient for29900:22:21.180 --> 00:22:26.220these things? As a rhetorical question, nobody is. That's why our sufficiency,30000:22:26.380 --> 00:22:29.740I think, he goes later onto say in Second Corinthians or another30100:22:29.779 --> 00:22:33.609place, he says that our sufficiencyis in Christ, and so it's clinging30200:22:33.809 --> 00:22:38.890to Christ as our sufficiency as we'redealing with the mess. But continue with30300:22:40.049 --> 00:22:44.250what you write and will just piggybackingoff of that idea just just briefly.30400:22:44.920 --> 00:22:49.160If turning, turning to Christ inthe midst of our mess is critical,30500:22:49.319 --> 00:22:56.240because I have seen some people becomebitter and angry at God in the midst30600:22:56.240 --> 00:22:59.750of their mess, blame it allon him, say why is this happening30700:22:59.910 --> 00:23:04.509to me, and I think thatjust feeds again into the sense of you30800:23:04.630 --> 00:23:10.509know, I deserve better. Yeah, and no, we don't. We30900:23:10.910 --> 00:23:15.180all deserve hell yeah, but whenwe are weak and when we completely submit31000:23:15.339 --> 00:23:21.579and lose our pride. I hadno pride that it was me doing anything31100:23:21.700 --> 00:23:26.299on that sidewalk because I was bringingnothing to that sidewalk. Yeah, but31200:23:26.660 --> 00:23:33.130Christ really filled me. Yeah,and empowered me to a point where really31300:23:33.250 --> 00:23:37.410even I was surprised, like howis this happening? Out of here,31400:23:37.529 --> 00:23:41.049all the tripture. I believe it'sthe Apostle Paul Soo, who says that31500:23:41.250 --> 00:23:45.359we have this treasure in earthen vessels. So all we are as these earthen31600:23:45.400 --> 00:23:48.119vessels and we think of earthen vessel, you know, and that day and31700:23:48.160 --> 00:23:51.880age we're talking just a common vessel. We're just there's nothing special about us,31800:23:51.880 --> 00:23:56.190an earthen vessels, not like abrass or gold or silver vessel.31900:23:56.390 --> 00:23:59.829It's just a common vessel. That'swhat that's what he's saying. That's what's32000:23:59.829 --> 00:24:03.589implied there. We have this treasure. So imagine putting an awesome treasure,32100:24:03.630 --> 00:24:07.750a bunch of gold, in ajust old clay pot. That's that's kind32200:24:07.789 --> 00:24:10.900of the picture there. We havethis treasure which is God's spirit, gots32300:24:10.940 --> 00:24:14.700truth, God's word, that's putin these common vessels. There's nothing special32400:24:14.700 --> 00:24:19.059about us. It's God's truth.That really that really is. It makes32500:24:19.140 --> 00:24:23.059the difference and you have to understand. I think if we have this mentality32600:24:23.099 --> 00:24:27.450that there's something special about us,that God somehow needs us, then we're32700:24:27.450 --> 00:24:30.529going to crash and burn pretty easy. Yeah, that's really good. and32800:24:30.650 --> 00:24:34.250seeing the mess and being honest aboutthe mess it's going on in our lives32900:24:34.410 --> 00:24:40.319helps us to see our sufficiency inChrist and helps us to see our weness.33000:24:40.759 --> 00:24:44.839And his strength is that that SecondCorinthians fourteen passes. His strength is33100:24:44.920 --> 00:24:48.400made perfect in weakness. So whenwe're weak and we ain't got it figured33200:24:48.440 --> 00:24:52.839out and we can do this ourselves. The fruit that is being born,33300:24:52.109 --> 00:24:59.349all glory goes to God and andyou know will say God did it through33400:24:59.470 --> 00:25:03.230me, he used me like heused a donkey, but that's that's simply33500:25:03.349 --> 00:25:06.750it. I was just a vesselthat he used, and he'll use you33600:25:06.990 --> 00:25:12.819too, you know exactly. Sothe second point that I wrote down as33700:25:12.859 --> 00:25:17.660I was thinking through the principles wasthat it's similar to the first one,33800:25:17.859 --> 00:25:22.769that hate and anger, anger willnever sustain us in ministry. Yeah,33900:25:22.890 --> 00:25:26.569we will burn out very quickly.And you know, great versus James,34000:25:26.609 --> 00:25:30.329James One hundred and twenty, forthe anger of Man Does Not Produce the34100:25:30.369 --> 00:25:36.839righteousness of God. So in myown story, I was, like I34200:25:37.000 --> 00:25:41.000had said earlier, I was filledwith anger and hurt and pain, but34300:25:41.079 --> 00:25:47.759I come to the sidewalk and startministering and what replaced all of that was34400:25:47.920 --> 00:25:53.150just utter joy. Yeah, thejoy was that God was using me and34500:25:53.349 --> 00:25:59.390that I knew he was using mebecause I knew I couldn't do it and34600:25:59.430 --> 00:26:06.099I knew that it was this thisthis unbelievable spirit that was working through this34700:26:06.259 --> 00:26:12.859very broken in vessel. That issuch a powerful thing to have and and34800:26:14.140 --> 00:26:19.210to experience. So it was joythat kept me coming back and that joy34900:26:19.410 --> 00:26:27.690persist there is there's really the oneof the happiest places that I am is35000:26:27.930 --> 00:26:33.200on the sidewalk crazy, and notbecause we and not because of all the35100:26:33.599 --> 00:26:38.240horror that is happening in that building, but because the glory of God is35200:26:38.400 --> 00:26:45.599exhibited by every volunteer that is there, filled with the spirit and allowing themselves35300:26:45.680 --> 00:26:49.470to be used by him. Itis beautiful, yeah, to behold.35400:26:49.509 --> 00:26:53.470Yeah, so do you have anythingto add? Add to them? That's35500:26:53.589 --> 00:26:56.670that's good point. Like said,it ties into that first point, right.35600:26:56.910 --> 00:27:02.259And so the third point is ourmodel for ministry should be Jesus,35700:27:02.420 --> 00:27:06.779and I we mentioned that. Theyis our model for ministry. You know,35800:27:06.900 --> 00:27:10.299the like. You had said somethingabout the bracelets that people used to35900:27:10.339 --> 00:27:14.059wear. What would just what wouldJesus do? What would Jesus do?36000:27:14.339 --> 00:27:17.490What would Jesus do? WWJAD,it was all over the place. I36100:27:17.650 --> 00:27:22.450forget what what decade that happened,but tshirts on bracelets became kind of trite.36200:27:22.769 --> 00:27:25.289Yeah, it's true. Yeah,it is true. I think even36300:27:25.329 --> 00:27:29.809more biblically we can look at whatdid Jesus do? Like your have biblical36400:27:29.890 --> 00:27:32.759example. We don't have to askourselves what would Jesus do? We can36500:27:32.799 --> 00:27:34.319look in the scription and say whatdid Jesus do? What did he do36600:27:34.519 --> 00:27:38.160when he experienced opposition? What didhe do when he was ridiculed? What36700:27:38.279 --> 00:27:41.720did he do when family members,I mean he had points where his brothers36800:27:42.079 --> 00:27:45.950mocked him like you know, ifyou if you listen, if you're the36900:27:45.990 --> 00:27:48.150son of God and you do thesemiracles will, why aren't you out there37000:27:48.190 --> 00:27:51.230in the public doing them? Youknow? And so he certainly dealt with37100:27:51.349 --> 00:27:55.349a lot of the mess of lifeand ministered through it, again clinging to37200:27:55.430 --> 00:27:57.779the father, and I think that'sthat's the most important point, as it37300:27:57.859 --> 00:28:02.900has to do with this point.Is Our model of ministry is Jesus.37400:28:03.740 --> 00:28:08.500What did Jesus do? Is Healways sought the father's will. He always37500:28:10.619 --> 00:28:14.690clean. You could find Jesus outpraying right is discible to find him praying.37600:28:15.569 --> 00:28:19.089He's seeking God, he's clinging tothe Lord and that's not always easy37700:28:19.170 --> 00:28:22.529to do when you're dealing with themess. You know, I had a37800:28:22.890 --> 00:28:27.559time in my life my wife thiswas back on our twins, my wife37900:28:27.599 --> 00:28:30.759was pregnant with our twins. Thereeight years old now, right. But38000:28:30.839 --> 00:28:33.960I was coming out. I hadbeen coming out for a couple of years38100:28:34.000 --> 00:28:37.559at that point and we've been comingout as a family to the sidewalks to38200:28:37.640 --> 00:28:41.160minister at the abortion clinic. Thatwas just when I was coming out on38300:28:41.319 --> 00:28:45.150Saturday's. A did another job atthat time and and thankfully the Lord Graciously38400:28:45.190 --> 00:28:48.910Open the door for me to dothis and on a more full time basis,38500:28:48.950 --> 00:28:49.950but at that time I was not. I was doing other things anyway.38600:28:49.950 --> 00:28:53.829The point is my wife within thehospital for about three months with the38700:28:53.910 --> 00:28:57.539twins hooked up to all these thingsand all these you know, censors and38800:28:57.579 --> 00:29:00.740all that, because they thought thatthe twins weren't going to make it.38900:29:00.819 --> 00:29:04.740And that was a difficult mess.Let me just tell you. My wife39000:29:04.859 --> 00:29:07.259is, you know, forty fiveminutes away and, yeah, I have39100:29:07.380 --> 00:29:11.329for the children at home. We'retrying to home school and trying to work39200:29:11.450 --> 00:29:15.650and then still trying to do ministryon the sidewalk and and there were Saturdays39300:29:15.930 --> 00:29:18.289where, you know, I wascommitted, I really was. I was39400:29:18.369 --> 00:29:19.650like God, I'm going to gothere in as much as I can.39500:29:19.849 --> 00:29:22.690That was all by the grace ofGod's not because I'm special and great and39600:29:22.849 --> 00:29:26.480whatever, and I don't believe thatat all. It's all by the grace39700:29:26.559 --> 00:29:29.240of God. I'm like, asmuch as I can, I'm going to39800:29:29.279 --> 00:29:30.920go. Then there are times Icouldn't go. I had to go visit39900:29:30.960 --> 00:29:34.640my wife in the hospital, Ihad to your deal with the children,40000:29:34.680 --> 00:29:40.710but I would make it more oftenthan not right and I would. I'm40100:29:40.710 --> 00:29:44.750much dread going because I'm dealing withall this mess and as I'm going I'm40200:29:44.990 --> 00:29:47.710like, man, I need begoing here. What I got so much40300:29:47.750 --> 00:29:51.670junk going on my life. Andwhen I would get there, though,40400:29:52.109 --> 00:29:55.859it would be like the heaven opens, that happens, open up exact and40500:29:55.940 --> 00:29:59.220I feel, and I think here'sthe point, is I feel the pleasure40600:29:59.740 --> 00:30:02.940of my father, like he seesI've pressed through this mess. I didn't40700:30:02.940 --> 00:30:06.339let the devil win and I pressedthrough. And it might be I came40800:30:06.380 --> 00:30:08.089out and stayed for an hour,I stayed for two hours or whatever,40900:30:08.769 --> 00:30:11.609but it's like it's not about me, it's not about me feeling good,41000:30:11.650 --> 00:30:15.609it's about the Lord. But aschildren of God, there is a sense41100:30:15.690 --> 00:30:21.519in which the pleasure of the fatherin our lives is important and you see41200:30:21.519 --> 00:30:23.400that in the life of Jesus.You know, the father speaks from heaven.41300:30:23.440 --> 00:30:26.960This is my beloved son and whomI'm well pleased. It's like affirm41400:30:27.000 --> 00:30:30.599ah that we get from the father. It's like your kids, you know,41500:30:30.720 --> 00:30:33.279and they've they've done something good rightand they get that affirmation. They41600:30:33.359 --> 00:30:38.190feel good and that good feeling ofdoing the father's will will continue to motivate41700:30:38.269 --> 00:30:41.549us. Sure. Well, youknow, we all want to hear well41800:30:41.670 --> 00:30:45.589done, good and faithful servant.I think that's Biblical, then that is41900:30:45.750 --> 00:30:49.140that is where we want to endup. Yeah, yeah, absolutely,42000:30:49.619 --> 00:30:55.019but that point of clinging to thefather in the midst of that season of42100:30:55.059 --> 00:30:57.500my life, and I've had otherseasons where I bualt with other stuff going42200:30:57.539 --> 00:31:00.660on, like major league. Weall did with stuff on a daytoday basis.42300:31:00.740 --> 00:31:07.329But like I'm talking like majorly dealingwith stuff and learning to cling to42400:31:07.369 --> 00:31:11.049the father, learning to not neglectprayer, to be in prayer and as42500:31:11.089 --> 00:31:15.210much as I can, and beingin the word in as much as we42600:31:15.329 --> 00:31:18.240can. We can't neglect those things. New Man can't live on bread alone,42700:31:18.240 --> 00:31:22.279but every word that proceeds from themouth of God. We need to42800:31:22.359 --> 00:31:26.319be in God's Word and had Inot been by His grace in prayer and42900:31:26.440 --> 00:31:30.279fellowship with him, I don't thinkI could have made it through that season.43000:31:30.359 --> 00:31:33.470And you know, as a familywe came out on the other,43100:31:33.509 --> 00:31:37.269the other side of that season,and it just so such a blessing to43200:31:37.390 --> 00:31:40.789look back and see God brought usthrough that. And and people ask me,43300:31:40.789 --> 00:31:42.230how did you get through that season? It was it was hard.43400:31:42.309 --> 00:31:45.630Right, yeah, it was hard, but looking back I don't remember it43500:31:45.789 --> 00:31:48.259being that hard. Down the midstof it it was hard, but looking43600:31:48.339 --> 00:31:52.140back I just see the grace ofGod through it. Right, I'm sure43700:31:52.140 --> 00:31:56.940you've probably have experienced that, butI found through my most difficult seasons is43800:31:57.099 --> 00:32:01.329when I felt God was the closest. Yeah, I've had other people say43900:32:01.329 --> 00:32:05.970they felt that he had slammed adoor in their face. That was not44000:32:06.170 --> 00:32:09.529my experience. I could just prayfor hours. I was consumed with God44100:32:09.690 --> 00:32:15.490because really he was all I hadleft. That's kind of how I felt.44200:32:15.609 --> 00:32:19.680I had nothing else. But I'veheard your story and your wife,44300:32:19.799 --> 00:32:24.240Courtney, share that experience with momsthat we minister to. What what you44400:32:24.359 --> 00:32:30.950all went through with the twins andit's been very powerful in helping. Yeah,44500:32:30.990 --> 00:32:35.069the people that you minister to.And there is just no doubt that44600:32:35.230 --> 00:32:39.230God uses the messes in our lifeto then go on and help others.44700:32:39.349 --> 00:32:45.700And there is a verse that Ican't quite remember word for word, but44800:32:46.180 --> 00:32:52.299that that God does use the strugglesin our life so that when we survive44900:32:52.900 --> 00:32:57.900get through them, we can thengo on and minister to others. Yeah.45000:32:58.380 --> 00:33:02.849So the fourth point that, oh, I did want to say that45100:33:04.569 --> 00:33:08.009in the ministry, our ministry shouldbe modeled on Jesus. You made it45200:33:08.170 --> 00:33:10.690the, I think, the mostimportant point, that we should be like45300:33:10.849 --> 00:33:15.079Jesus and in the continual turning tothe father. But I was thinking about45400:33:15.119 --> 00:33:22.799that. How would I have characterizedJesus during the time here on our just45500:33:22.880 --> 00:33:29.829in general, describe him, andthe first word that would come to my45600:33:29.990 --> 00:33:34.029mind would be love. Yeah,he was filled with love, he was45700:33:34.109 --> 00:33:38.230filled with truth, for sure,but I don't picture him as angry.45800:33:38.710 --> 00:33:43.859Okay, there were periods of anger, righteous anger, when he overturned the45900:33:43.900 --> 00:33:49.299tables or when he would be angrywith his particularly the the Pharisees, but46000:33:49.539 --> 00:33:54.420that wasn't how I would characterize him. The the overwhelming picture of Jesus was46100:33:54.660 --> 00:34:00.930of calm. He was the onethat calmed the storm, not the one46200:34:01.009 --> 00:34:06.450that stirred up the storm. Yeah, and I think that that's really important,46300:34:06.490 --> 00:34:09.719at least for me, keeping thatpicture as I'm standing in a in46400:34:09.840 --> 00:34:17.880a ministry that has a lot ofantagonism being directed towards those of us who46500:34:17.920 --> 00:34:23.119are ministering. Yeah, we areto reflect Jesus. Jesus was calm and46600:34:23.349 --> 00:34:30.190confident and filled with truth and ableto help the others. Yeah, absolutely.46700:34:31.230 --> 00:34:37.190So. A fourth point is thatthe messes in our life are no46800:34:37.429 --> 00:34:40.260surprised to God. Yeah, andthey I think we have to be very46900:34:40.420 --> 00:34:46.500careful if we say they excuse usfrom ministry. Yeah, because really all47000:34:46.579 --> 00:34:51.579of us are in some sort ofa mess all the time. At least47100:34:51.739 --> 00:34:55.289I am. Maybe I'm unusual,but if I use the man just in47200:34:55.369 --> 00:35:00.369general, human beings are are flawedand broken and we are surrounded by other47300:35:00.409 --> 00:35:05.650human beings that are flawed and brokenright our families and in our circles and47400:35:06.369 --> 00:35:09.760work and all of that. Sono, everybody has messes there down for47500:35:09.880 --> 00:35:15.199sure. So if we're called ministryand we're waiting until we're done with the47600:35:15.280 --> 00:35:17.840mess. Yeah, we'll be waitingforever. Yeah, we've never be in47700:35:17.960 --> 00:35:22.469fattervagnistry. You've left yourself in amess by not stepping out in faith and47800:35:22.789 --> 00:35:27.030believing that's right. The Lord canmove in the midst of that. Yeah.47900:35:27.070 --> 00:35:32.429Yeah. So our the the fifthpoint, which was the final point48000:35:32.510 --> 00:35:36.820that I came up with just outof my own experiences. This is in48100:35:37.019 --> 00:35:40.420no ways a definitive complete list,but it were just some of the main48200:35:40.579 --> 00:35:46.539principles that I came up with.Our motivation of all our behavior and ministry48300:35:46.980 --> 00:35:52.489should be to glorify God. Yeah, and a great verse with that,48400:35:52.530 --> 00:35:57.329as First Corinthians thirty one. So, whether you eat or drink or whatever48500:35:57.570 --> 00:36:01.050you do, do all to theglory of God. Yeah. Yeah,48600:36:01.489 --> 00:36:07.360and that again, it does intoto love. Yeah, it does into48700:36:07.400 --> 00:36:13.000a proper understanding of love, aproper perspective of love and a pop a48800:36:13.079 --> 00:36:15.119proper direction of love. What Imean by that is, you know,48900:36:15.159 --> 00:36:19.030Jesus, this gives the too greatcommandments. Love the Lord, your God,49000:36:19.110 --> 00:36:20.989with all your heart, mind,Sol and strength, and love your49100:36:21.030 --> 00:36:24.030neighbor as yourself. So it's notjust that love should be our promo,49200:36:24.230 --> 00:36:29.550primary motivation for ministry, because ifit's just love for human beings and love49300:36:29.630 --> 00:36:31.750for people, you love for unbornchildren, love for women, love for49400:36:31.860 --> 00:36:36.539people who are poverished or whatever.If that's our primary motivation, it's the49500:36:36.619 --> 00:36:39.780cart before the horse. Our firstmotivations should be a love for God,49600:36:39.940 --> 00:36:45.500and because we love him, thenwe love our neighbor and we can probably49700:36:45.539 --> 00:36:49.489show love toward our neighbor and wecan probably love our neighbor like we should49800:36:49.489 --> 00:36:53.250if we first are connected to Godthrough love for him. Yeah, because49900:36:53.250 --> 00:36:58.329if we're motivated by just love forpeople, especially if you're involved in the50000:36:58.369 --> 00:37:01.079ministry that we're in, we're dealingwith and we certainly love the women,50100:37:01.239 --> 00:37:05.599no doubt about it. But ifour primary motivation is love for women,50200:37:05.639 --> 00:37:07.719these poor innocent women that are inthese difficult situations, are going to be50300:37:07.800 --> 00:37:10.840burned real quick because you're going tofind that they don't love you back.50400:37:10.920 --> 00:37:14.400They're not some of them, sometype. You know what, it's almost50500:37:14.440 --> 00:37:19.150as bad as as being motivated byhate being being motivated by love. In50600:37:19.389 --> 00:37:22.510any rest. That in yes,in terms that you're going to be disappointed50700:37:22.590 --> 00:37:28.630in either way. Yeah, youknow, because you're you were going exactly50800:37:28.750 --> 00:37:32.659where. My thoughts for going asyou were speaking, that they don't always50900:37:32.820 --> 00:37:37.380treat us back with love, andit is it would be very easy,51000:37:37.460 --> 00:37:43.099and I have seen many volunteers burnout because they're so disappointed. I gave51100:37:43.179 --> 00:37:45.650my all, I was so good, I was so kind, I was51200:37:45.730 --> 00:37:49.769so loving, and they still rejectedme. Yeah, well, yeah,51300:37:49.769 --> 00:37:52.690and that's why it has to beloved for God and a desire to see51400:37:52.730 --> 00:37:57.530God glorified through our ministry, becauseif it's not a desire to see God's51500:37:57.650 --> 00:38:01.639glory, if it's only a desireto help poor, innocent people or whatever,51600:38:02.280 --> 00:38:07.320then again we're going to be disappointed. And you know, it's an51700:38:07.360 --> 00:38:12.869unbiblical motivation. It's all about God'sglory and it kind of ties into this51800:38:13.030 --> 00:38:17.429idea that even though there are victoriesand we see victories on a regular basis,51900:38:19.309 --> 00:38:22.710that we can't take ownership of thosevictories just as much as we can't52000:38:22.710 --> 00:38:28.019take ownership of the defeats. I'msure we've probably shared that in a podcast52100:38:28.139 --> 00:38:31.380before, something we tell our folks. We can't take ownership of the victories,52200:38:31.420 --> 00:38:35.139and we don't. We Give Gloryto God and we're just these earthen52300:38:35.179 --> 00:38:37.860vessels that God has chosen to useand he'll use any earthen vessel that that52400:38:37.980 --> 00:38:42.650he wants to use. But wealso can't take ownership of the defeat.52500:38:42.769 --> 00:38:45.130And if it's love for God andI'm motivated by love for him, then52600:38:45.329 --> 00:38:50.409really the outward results, as easyis for me to say and hard as52700:38:50.610 --> 00:38:53.489it is for us to really walkin, don't matter. That's come out52800:38:53.489 --> 00:38:57.360here because of God. I'm outhere to glorify God. So, whether52900:38:57.400 --> 00:39:00.840babies are saved or not, I'mgoing to be here because it's not about53000:39:00.880 --> 00:39:02.840whether babies are saved or not.It's not about whether I feel good about53100:39:02.840 --> 00:39:06.960myself or not. It's about God'sglory. He's called me to be here,53200:39:07.119 --> 00:39:08.400so I'm going to do it,whether there's an outward result or not.53300:39:08.719 --> 00:39:12.590Now again, that's you for meto say, and it's really hard53400:39:12.630 --> 00:39:15.309to do when you're involved in ministryand you might not see. I mean53500:39:15.349 --> 00:39:19.309there's days where we're out there andwe see twenty, thirty, forty babies53600:39:19.349 --> 00:39:22.829going to that abortion clinic that arebeing killed by their mothers and fought by53700:39:22.869 --> 00:39:25.019their mothers through the abortionist and thefathers are there and doing nothing about it.53800:39:25.300 --> 00:39:29.460Yeah, and it can be verydiscouraging when you don't see anybody choose53900:39:29.539 --> 00:39:32.300life. Yeah, we have toremind ourselves constantly this is not about me,54000:39:32.739 --> 00:39:36.739it's not even about them. Itis about God and I'm out here54100:39:37.260 --> 00:39:40.449to bring glory to His name andobedience to him. That's right, that's54200:39:40.489 --> 00:39:45.969right. I love this verse fromNiam Neamia, Ndred and ten and do54300:39:45.130 --> 00:39:50.610not be grieved for the joy ofthe Lord. It's your strength. Yeah,54400:39:50.889 --> 00:39:52.719yeah, the love of the Lordand the joy of the Lord.54500:39:52.760 --> 00:39:57.880Yes, what empowers us. Amen. Well, we hope you guys were54600:39:57.880 --> 00:40:01.639encouraged by this podcast. We werecertainly encouraged by going through these points and54700:40:01.960 --> 00:40:06.599reading these scriptures and talking about thesethings. We hope to be able to54800:40:06.639 --> 00:40:10.469put this up on our sidewalks forlife site as a blog post to help54900:40:10.510 --> 00:40:15.550encourage people involved. Again, guests, please share these podcasts with other people55000:40:16.030 --> 00:40:20.269and and share with us some ofyour feedback that you have and it was55100:40:20.309 --> 00:40:22.019it a good podcast. Would youlike to hear more stuff like this?55200:40:22.659 --> 00:40:25.820Are there other suggestions that you havefor subjects we can cover? We'd love55300:40:25.860 --> 00:40:30.300to hear those things and and we'dlove to hear just how you guys are55400:40:30.500 --> 00:40:35.730being blessed or maybe not blessed bythe podcast criticisms that you have. We55500:40:35.849 --> 00:40:38.769certainly could do better and we knowthat, but we do hope that you55600:40:38.849 --> 00:40:44.250are blessed by we hope you visitour website, that sidewalks for lifecom,55700:40:44.730 --> 00:40:47.849sidewalks on number four lifecom, andthen locally Charlotte dot cities for Life Dot55800:40:47.889 --> 00:40:52.840Org, and again that you sharethe content that we put on these websites55900:40:52.920 --> 00:40:55.639with other people. We pray God'sblessing of you as you seek to serve56000:40:55.679 --> 00:40:59.159him, whatever ministry he calls youto. Just seek to do it for56100:40:59.280 --> 00:41:01.960his glory and understand the sufficiency isnot in you, it's not in your56200:41:02.000 --> 00:41:07.110wisdom and your ability, but yoursufficiency comes from Christ and you cling to56300:41:07.150 --> 00:41:10.349him. He is the vine andwe are the branches. If we abide56400:41:10.349 --> 00:41:14.230in him, will bear much fruit. So God bless you as you continue56500:41:14.269 --> 00:41:16.710to bear fruit, as you abidein him, and and we'll talk to56600:41:16.789 --> 00:41:30.099you soon. Give me our lovefor love, give me our loft for56700:41:30.340 --> 00:41:42.449gratitude. I know it will costme my life. Nothing's too precious.56800:41:42.769 --> 00:41:44.130And some that you