Civil Disobedience, The Christmas Story, and Pro-Life Ministry

WEBVTT100:00:00.560 --> 00:00:05.759I am yours. I Am Yours, I am yours, s and me,200:00:06.160 --> 00:00:10.869Lord, I am yours. Welcometo the Gospel Center pro life podcast300:00:10.949 --> 00:00:14.990and this episode we're going to talkabout the Christmas story and civil disobedience and400:00:15.109 --> 00:00:19.070what that has to do pro lifeministry. Stay tuned for this episode.500:00:20.550 --> 00:00:35.810Lord, I felt show passish touchyour heart. Welcome to the Gospel Center600:00:35.890 --> 00:00:40.090pro life podcast. We're going totalk a little bit about the Christmas story700:00:40.329 --> 00:00:45.929in this episode and some conversations thatVicky and I had had about some things800:00:45.929 --> 00:00:48.969that go on in the Christmas storyand you know, after the birth of900:00:49.090 --> 00:00:52.920Jesus and to do with the wisemen, and we'll jump right into it1000:00:53.039 --> 00:00:56.640and Matthew Chapter two. Many ofyou know, of course, the story1100:00:57.240 --> 00:01:00.240of the birth of Jesus. Werethis is the day after Christmas. Will1200:01:00.280 --> 00:01:03.520recording this, and we celebrated thebirth of Jesus, and we know the1300:01:03.560 --> 00:01:08.310story about the wise men and MatthewConveis that story here in Matthew Chapter Two.1400:01:10.150 --> 00:01:11.909And then we know the wise manbefore they went to see Jesus,1500:01:11.989 --> 00:01:17.870they saw King Herod and King Herod, in a crafty sort of way,1600:01:17.989 --> 00:01:21.859told these guys. When you findthe child. Let me know so I1700:01:22.019 --> 00:01:23.980too can come and worship him.What he said. Of course, we1800:01:25.099 --> 00:01:29.620know what's behind his his motive.There's he wants to to try to wipe1900:01:29.659 --> 00:01:34.329out this this person who may endup taking his throne. Yeah, here2000:01:34.370 --> 00:01:36.930it's one of those guys that didn'twant to let go of his authority in2100:01:37.090 --> 00:01:44.090his and his position. And thenwe hear about this slaughter of the innocence.2200:01:44.329 --> 00:01:49.480Is that it's called after Jesus wasborn and the wise man. Actually2300:01:49.519 --> 00:01:52.439something I heard, by the way, just a little little rabbit trail,2400:01:52.439 --> 00:01:56.640which was pretty interesting. I hearda preacher talking about the wise men and2500:01:56.680 --> 00:02:00.200their gifts that they brought, andthere's a lot of explanation there what these2600:02:00.200 --> 00:02:02.750gifts meant. The gold was thesymbol of a king, you know,2700:02:02.829 --> 00:02:08.270so Jesus was obviously is a king. The incense, Frankinsense, was to2800:02:08.389 --> 00:02:14.669represent his divinity, right, heburned incense to the divinity, and so2900:02:14.830 --> 00:02:17.300that was what that was to represent. or priestly, some people say,3000:02:17.379 --> 00:02:23.020because his priestly nature. And thenthe Murr was for his death. You3100:02:23.060 --> 00:02:27.699know, they embalmed bodies or putMurr as a spice. But this preacher3200:02:27.740 --> 00:02:30.530said, yeah, those things canbe true, and those things are obviously3300:02:30.650 --> 00:02:34.569true aspects of who Jesus is.But he said, practically speaking, you3400:02:34.650 --> 00:02:38.530have to wonder why these wise menbrought these gifts to a baby. Right,3500:02:38.610 --> 00:02:42.449he's shivering in the cold. Hedoesn't need gold. He's a blanket,3600:02:43.009 --> 00:02:46.800he's a blanking, as when comediansaid a bowl of soup would have3700:02:46.840 --> 00:02:52.680done well, other than some frankinsense. But this preacher said these were costly3800:02:52.759 --> 00:02:54.639things. Obviously gold is Franktins wasvery colostly, and so it was.3900:02:54.680 --> 00:03:00.150Murr. What if, and Ithink it's true, this was ordained by4000:03:00.189 --> 00:03:06.189God in order to fund the tripto Egypt that Joseph and Mary and Jesus4100:03:06.270 --> 00:03:09.310had to take, and that's whatwe're talking about here, is how they4200:03:09.349 --> 00:03:15.099were under threat of being killed byKing Herod Jesus was, and so an4300:03:15.139 --> 00:03:19.860angel revealed to Joseph, Hey,this is going to happen, flee to4400:03:19.979 --> 00:03:23.740Egypt, and so they did.And you got to wonder how they he's4500:03:23.740 --> 00:03:24.780a carpenter, didn't have a lotof money. He had just had to4600:03:24.819 --> 00:03:30.969go to back to his hometown,who to Bethlehem, and that was pretty4700:03:30.009 --> 00:03:32.330costly. I'm sure of a trip. So how is he going to fund4800:03:32.370 --> 00:03:36.050this? Well, the wise men. So that's a little little free befo4900:03:36.129 --> 00:03:38.409you, guys, as you listening. That's not what this podcast is about.5000:03:38.490 --> 00:03:40.719That's an interesting thing to think about. God provides, yeah, God5100:03:40.800 --> 00:03:45.520does provide. In that situation,he did. But why did Jesus and5200:03:45.680 --> 00:03:49.240his family have to flee to Egypt? Hmm? Yeah, it was because5300:03:49.280 --> 00:03:53.240of Herod. And Herod here inMatthew, Chapter Two, Verse Sixteen,5400:03:54.039 --> 00:03:57.909and it says when Herod saw thathe was deceived by the wise men,5500:03:58.349 --> 00:04:02.550he was exceedingly angry and sent forthand to put to death all the male5600:04:02.629 --> 00:04:08.590children who are in Bethlehem and allits districts from two years old, according5700:04:08.629 --> 00:04:11.139to the time which had been determinedby the wise man. So he said,5800:04:11.620 --> 00:04:15.259all these children because again, thisthis person was possibly going to depose5900:04:15.300 --> 00:04:18.339him of His throne, because thiswas supposed to be a king, and6000:04:19.420 --> 00:04:21.699rather than really want to worship theking, you wanted to kill the king.6100:04:21.779 --> 00:04:26.889Yeah, hum. And so we'retalking about actually our subject, strangely6200:04:26.930 --> 00:04:30.889enough, is civil disobedience. Yeah, because this story brings to mind and6300:04:31.290 --> 00:04:34.370if you look at in a lotof pro lifers throughout the years have I've6400:04:34.410 --> 00:04:38.680even heard flip, who we hadon some podcast to go and who we6500:04:38.839 --> 00:04:42.600interact with on a regular basis,talking about the the Deavil, on the6600:04:42.720 --> 00:04:46.560demonic nature of the attack on children, on the attack, of course,6700:04:46.639 --> 00:04:49.680of the attack on the unborn,and this situation. It was two years6800:04:49.759 --> 00:04:59.029and younger compared to this rage ofHerod and back in Egypt, back in6900:04:59.230 --> 00:05:06.069exodus chapter one, the rage ofPharaoh against the children of Israel and their7000:05:06.180 --> 00:05:10.579babies who are ultimately thrown into thenol. We'll talk a will go to7100:05:10.660 --> 00:05:13.699that scripture in just a second.Yeah, although it is strange, as7200:05:13.740 --> 00:05:18.100I've mentioned earlier, that Jesus escapesto Egypt from Herod and then, of7300:05:18.180 --> 00:05:21.250course, what happened in the dayswhen the children of Israel, we're in7400:05:21.370 --> 00:05:26.050Egypt, as they were to escapefrom Egypt and they were to be rescued7500:05:26.089 --> 00:05:31.490from the the king of Egypt there. But this is this is the King7600:05:31.970 --> 00:05:38.879Herod who is given a civil order, who's given a decree, and I7700:05:38.920 --> 00:05:41.759guess there's some debate over the levelof power that he had. Could he7800:05:41.839 --> 00:05:44.759do this, because he was underRoman rule and he was sort of just7900:05:44.920 --> 00:05:48.800a figurehead really, but he obviouslyhad some power to be able to direct8000:05:49.629 --> 00:05:55.550whatever was his palace guard or whateverto go and slaughter two years and younger.8100:05:55.550 --> 00:05:59.230I mean this, this obviously was, you know, a traumatic event.8200:05:59.430 --> 00:06:02.310You know, it's references back herein verse eighteen seventeen. This was8300:06:02.389 --> 00:06:05.699to fulfill what was spoken by theProphet Jeremiah, saying a voice was heard8400:06:05.740 --> 00:06:10.980in Rama, lamentation, weeping,great mourning Rachel, weeping for her children,8500:06:11.019 --> 00:06:14.379refusing to be comfort because they wereno more. So he's repressing back8600:06:14.420 --> 00:06:17.019to this scripture that was prophesied aboutthis event and they were. You know,8700:06:17.139 --> 00:06:20.889this is one of those prophecies thathad application then and has application.8800:06:21.689 --> 00:06:26.170You know, had application in Jeremi'sDay and has application in Jesus Day.8900:06:26.209 --> 00:06:30.410Yeah, so this is obviously atraumatic event. This is people having their9000:06:30.410 --> 00:06:33.560children ripped out of their arms,taken and slaughtered. Yeah, I mean9100:06:33.560 --> 00:06:39.160you imagine, if you're a palaceguard, do you obey this this decree?9200:06:39.319 --> 00:06:43.959Do you obey this Governing Authority?Yeah, and that's what we're talking9300:06:43.959 --> 00:06:47.910about. Talking about some in someaspects what we deal with as sidewalk counselors,9400:06:47.949 --> 00:06:53.029because we and Charlotte have dealt witha lot of decrees, a lot9500:06:53.069 --> 00:06:58.870of ordinances of man that we've hadto, you know, respectfully disobey and9600:06:59.470 --> 00:07:02.300do what we're called to do,what we know that what is is within9700:07:02.379 --> 00:07:05.500our rights to do, and we'lltalk about some of that as we as9800:07:05.540 --> 00:07:10.100we go on. Yeah, butbiblically, how do we think about that9900:07:10.259 --> 00:07:13.300sort of thing and how do wecompare that to what we see in the10000:07:13.379 --> 00:07:18.009Bible? Right? So let's jumpback then to exodus and and I believe10100:07:18.089 --> 00:07:21.889we'll get a little deeper into this. So exit is chapter one, okay,10200:07:23.569 --> 00:07:26.490and if you're are with going goingthere already, yeah, let's go10300:07:26.649 --> 00:07:33.000there. And and this is wheneverthe Egyptian king, Pharaoh, began to10400:07:33.040 --> 00:07:40.040see that the children of Israel wereincreasing in number and he commanded the Hebrew10500:07:40.120 --> 00:07:44.079midrap wives, so the midwives,to those who helped these these Hebrew women10600:07:44.240 --> 00:07:47.589to deliver their children, to killthe children when they were born if they10700:07:47.589 --> 00:07:50.670were male. There, which is, you know, another parallel. It10800:07:50.910 --> 00:07:55.230was, yeah, the young boys, yeah, the big boys were kill10900:07:55.269 --> 00:07:58.189Hilp yea. Yeah, because hedidn't want he was afraid that these people11000:07:58.230 --> 00:08:01.819are going to rise up and rebelagainst him. They were outnumbering the Egyptians,11100:08:01.339 --> 00:08:05.220and he was wondering how much longercan we keep them under our thumb11200:08:05.860 --> 00:08:09.220without them rebeling? And and sowe need to nip this thing in the11300:08:09.259 --> 00:08:13.649bud, so to speak. Yeah, yeah, so what's that scripture that11400:08:13.689 --> 00:08:18.970you have there in in exodus one? Yeah, okay, so exodus one,11500:08:18.050 --> 00:08:22.649verse fifteen is where it begins.Yeah, did you? Are you11600:08:22.769 --> 00:08:24.529going to read it? Yeah,I'll read it. Okay. This is11700:08:24.569 --> 00:08:28.639the king of Egypt spoke to theHebrew midwives, of whom the name of11800:08:28.800 --> 00:08:31.799one was you'll have to pronounce thatname, Chefar off Fra. Yeah,11900:08:31.840 --> 00:08:37.120Huh, I love these biblical frontand Pooh Pooh as are great names.12000:08:37.559 --> 00:08:41.830I've never heard someone named their childthat, but they were obviously wonderful people.12100:08:41.110 --> 00:08:48.590Then it was like it was Mary, yeah, it says, okay,12200:08:48.629 --> 00:08:50.909yes, for sixteen, and hesaid, when you do the duties12300:08:50.950 --> 00:08:54.429of a midwife for the Hebrew womenand see them on the birth stools,12400:08:54.470 --> 00:08:58.419if it is a son, thenyou shall kill him, and if it12500:08:58.580 --> 00:09:03.019is a daughter, she shall live. Verse Seventeen. Here comes your civil12600:09:03.100 --> 00:09:07.580disobedience. And this was the decreefrom the highest level of government that you12700:09:07.740 --> 00:09:13.289could get right in probably the entireregion, maybe even in the entire world12800:09:13.289 --> 00:09:16.850at this point. I mean Egyptwas a very powerful probably the most powerful12900:09:16.850 --> 00:09:18.450nation of that time, but atleast in Egypt, this was the most13000:09:18.490 --> 00:09:24.440powerful voice, most powerful entity thatyou could get a decree from. And13100:09:24.519 --> 00:09:28.000here he goes and here he decreesthis thing. and verse seventeen. But13200:09:28.080 --> 00:09:31.399the midwives feared God, that's akey right there, and did not do13300:09:31.600 --> 00:09:37.360as the king of Egypt commanded,but save the male children alive. So13400:09:37.480 --> 00:09:39.950the King of Egypt called for themidwives and said to them, why have13500:09:39.029 --> 00:09:43.389you done this thing? And Savethe male children alive, and the midwife13600:09:43.429 --> 00:09:46.470said to Pharaoh, because the Hebrewwomen are not like the Egyptian women,13700:09:46.590 --> 00:09:50.549for they are lively and give birthbefore the midwives come to them. Therefore,13800:09:50.629 --> 00:09:56.259God dealt well with the midwives andthe people multiplied and grew very mightily.13900:09:56.019 --> 00:10:01.419This was because the the midwives fearedGod and he provided households for them.14000:10:01.460 --> 00:10:03.820Then it goes on in verse twentytwo. So Pharaoh commanded that all14100:10:03.860 --> 00:10:09.690his people say the commanded all thesepeople saying every son who was born you14200:10:09.730 --> 00:10:11.450shall cast into the river and everydaughter you shall save a live. And14300:10:11.490 --> 00:10:16.169then we have the story of Mosesand how Moses mother hid him. There's14400:10:16.169 --> 00:10:20.330another civil disobedience and and she hidhim until she could hide him. Two14500:10:20.330 --> 00:10:22.440more put him in the bulrushes.Ultimately she was, or he was,14600:10:22.759 --> 00:10:30.200adopted by Farrow's daughter and and protectedrightlessly. Right, right. Yeah.14700:10:30.519 --> 00:10:35.440So, so it's a great storyto illustrate the point, yeah, of14800:10:35.950 --> 00:10:39.909an unjust law and and people's responseto it. And then what? What14900:10:41.190 --> 00:10:43.870were the consequences? And so when, when we were talking about this and15000:10:45.070 --> 00:10:48.909trying to decide how to approach thistopic, I did a little bit of15100:10:48.950 --> 00:10:54.820research and I found what I thoughtwere really good three guiding principles. This15200:10:54.100 --> 00:11:03.460was from First Baptist Dallas, yeah, Org website. So three guiding principles15300:11:03.820 --> 00:11:09.970of civil disobedience, okay, fee, and three guiding principal biblically. Biblically,15400:11:09.009 --> 00:11:13.450yes, yes, this is thisis from a Biblical perspective, from15500:11:13.610 --> 00:11:18.250Gospel Focus per perspective. So andI thought they were good and and I15600:11:18.330 --> 00:11:20.559think we can apply them to anyof these stories that we read about civil15700:11:20.639 --> 00:11:24.799disider in the frangely, as wewere thinking about this subject and talking about15800:11:24.799 --> 00:11:28.600this subject, as I'm going throughthem, thinking about, you know,15900:11:28.919 --> 00:11:33.429examples of civil disobedience in the scripture. You know, some come to mind16000:11:33.470 --> 00:11:37.149immediately and then some I didn't reallythink about. Right. I didn't think16100:11:37.149 --> 00:11:39.590about Daniel, the story of Daniel, until you mentioned and I should have16200:11:39.710 --> 00:11:43.909because that's a common story in thestory of Shadrach Meshech in a bandage.16300:11:43.070 --> 00:11:46.620Yeah, so this is, Ithink, of very important topic that we16400:11:46.700 --> 00:11:50.620talked about as it has to dowith prolife ministry, because we're not just16500:11:50.659 --> 00:11:54.899talking about sidewalk counseling. We're talkingabout in other realms of prolife ministry.16600:11:54.980 --> 00:11:58.980Mean we're living in an ever increasingworld that is is pro death, pro16700:12:00.139 --> 00:12:03.370abortion, and not just like proabortion in some sort of a passive way,16800:12:03.570 --> 00:12:07.330like, you know, pro choice, so to speak, where you16900:12:07.409 --> 00:12:09.649can choose to be pro life ifyou want. But I'm going to be17000:12:09.690 --> 00:12:15.529pretty know these people are actively,like trying to silence prolifers actively. You17100:12:15.610 --> 00:12:18.279know, I mentioned to you aboutin California laws that they had passed in17200:12:18.320 --> 00:12:26.799California basically saying that commanding that prolifepregnancy centers have to refer for abortions or17300:12:26.799 --> 00:12:31.309at least point people in the directionright of people that provide abortions. Yeah,17400:12:31.389 --> 00:12:37.830just like not just this is conspelledspeech, like you're not just forced17500:12:37.870 --> 00:12:43.110to to just be okay with analternative, respective, we're forced to promote17600:12:43.740 --> 00:12:48.500abortion right, which is which isinsane. Yeah, and doctors and nurses,17700:12:48.620 --> 00:12:54.860we had talked about earlier, beingforced to perform abortions or they'll lose17800:12:54.899 --> 00:12:58.730their jobs. Yeah, another example. Yeah. Well, like in universities17900:12:58.769 --> 00:13:01.250and things, people who are trainingto be MD's have to, you know,18000:13:03.210 --> 00:13:05.690told that they have to perform abortions, or at least be part of18100:13:05.809 --> 00:13:09.529a of an abortion, in orderto get their MD yeah. Yeah,18200:13:09.809 --> 00:13:13.720so it's not something that that youcan just say well, you know,18300:13:15.159 --> 00:13:18.440maybe that's okay for you, butnot for me. They're they're being actively,18400:13:18.480 --> 00:13:22.600yeah, told to go against God'sClear Commandments. Yeah, and and18500:13:22.720 --> 00:13:28.070their own counctions. Yeah. Yeah. So, so I'll go into those18600:13:28.070 --> 00:13:31.389three guiding principles. Yeah, andthen then we can go from there.18700:13:31.470 --> 00:13:37.149So the first one, when you'rethinking about civil disobedience, does it?18800:13:37.750 --> 00:13:46.340Does the situation rise to the thedegree that I need to disobey? Yeah,18900:13:46.659 --> 00:13:50.379Higher Authority, not God, notthe highest authority. Right now,19000:13:50.379 --> 00:13:56.929we're talking about a governmental authority.So the first one is your disobedience based19100:13:56.970 --> 00:14:05.129on clear biblical mandate. Okay.And and so do you know does does19200:14:05.289 --> 00:14:16.919what you are rising up against violatesomething that God has clearly told you do19300:14:16.080 --> 00:14:20.720not violate? Yeah. So,you know, an obvious example in the19400:14:20.799 --> 00:14:26.070pro life movement is thou shall notmurder. Yeah. Yeah. And what19500:14:26.269 --> 00:14:30.470is support example right here in thispassage to yeah, so these Hebrew Midwi19600:14:30.549 --> 00:14:35.230was it says that their motivation was. They weren't just motivated it is Abe19700:14:35.309 --> 00:14:37.029Farah because they didn't like him,because he had a funny hat, right,19800:14:39.179 --> 00:14:41.620or whatever, because he was anEgyptian, whatever. Know, it19900:14:41.700 --> 00:14:46.700says they feared God. Yes,that was that was their chief thing.20000:14:46.860 --> 00:14:50.940Here in the scripture. That saysthat it was motivating them to disobey this20100:14:50.059 --> 00:14:54.929this this edict, yes, decree, and to fear God. You must20200:14:54.049 --> 00:14:58.730know God and you must know whathe says. And why I think that's20300:14:58.730 --> 00:15:03.169important is because I can't tell youthe number of times that I have again20400:15:03.330 --> 00:15:07.480our work in front of this abortioncenter, where I will say, do20500:15:07.600 --> 00:15:11.200you know what the Bible says aboutthe unborn? Yeah, and the sacred20600:15:11.240 --> 00:15:16.039nature of that unborn life and somany of them will say, no,20700:15:16.799 --> 00:15:20.200I don't know. So how canyou fear and obey God if you don't20800:15:20.200 --> 00:15:24.669even know what he says? Soit's implicit in that. Yeah, these20900:15:24.950 --> 00:15:28.269midwives they feared God, so theyknew God. Yeah, and they knew21000:15:28.309 --> 00:15:33.309his word, at least his commandthou shalt not murder. Now that command21100:15:33.350 --> 00:15:37.460had not yet been given. It'sgiven later on in the in Exitus,21200:15:37.500 --> 00:15:41.179Chapter Twenty, where God writes theTen can ten commandments on tablets of stone21300:15:41.220 --> 00:15:45.299with his own finger. Right,but this command is a universal thing.21400:15:45.460 --> 00:15:50.970Like we know killing innocent people iswrong. We know that universally. And21500:15:50.210 --> 00:15:56.850these Hebrew midwives, they knew that, they feared God and and they disobeyed21600:15:56.970 --> 00:16:00.610because of that. That first principle. Does it right? Violate a clear21700:16:00.049 --> 00:16:03.919command of the Lord? Is whatyou're being told to do by a Governing21800:16:03.960 --> 00:16:07.279Authority? Violated Clear Command of theLord? Right, and and that that21900:16:07.399 --> 00:16:12.759guiding principle is based on acts fivetwenty nine, which is Peter in the22000:16:14.120 --> 00:16:19.470apostles answered. We must obey Godrather than men. Yeah, so whatever22100:16:19.830 --> 00:16:25.870that. That should be the firstthing that we think when we're budding heads22200:16:25.950 --> 00:16:33.860with a law. Does this lawin some way force me to disobey God?22300:16:33.139 --> 00:16:37.659Yeah, and if so, that'sa law that you may need to22400:16:40.019 --> 00:16:47.330be disobedient. Yea Arts. Yeah, okay. So the second guiding principle22500:16:47.450 --> 00:16:52.490of civil disobedience. If you gayengage in civil disobedience, do so demonstrating22600:16:52.850 --> 00:16:59.769respect for authority. Okay. Andso, if you think of Daniel is22700:16:59.850 --> 00:17:06.119a great example. Yeah, throughoutthe book of Daniel, whenever Daniel engages22800:17:06.799 --> 00:17:11.000with the king who was remembered,this king, Nebuchadnezzar, was not a22900:17:11.720 --> 00:17:15.519God follower, right, no,no, at least not an initially.23000:17:15.950 --> 00:17:22.109And so, but he deals withhim with so much respect when he's commanded23100:17:22.750 --> 00:17:26.069in. I you know, Idon't actually have the reference from Gett.23200:17:26.150 --> 00:17:30.380A man died to eat the vegetables. Okay, yeah, that's the version.23300:17:30.380 --> 00:17:33.980Couple chapters. Yeah, that's firstcouple of chapters of Daniel. Whenever23400:17:33.980 --> 00:17:40.259they're brought from Jerusalem and they're broughtin the Nebuchadner, Nebuchadnezzar's house, right.23500:17:40.539 --> 00:17:45.690Yeah, that's the first chapter.And Daniel Basically says, and there's23600:17:45.730 --> 00:17:49.329some some reasons why, I think, when Daniel, when the guy who23700:17:49.329 --> 00:17:53.210ever sees the these young boys thatwants to make them strong and tough and23800:17:53.329 --> 00:17:56.930whatever, right is going to feedthem meat. And he says No.23900:17:56.809 --> 00:18:00.319Some people say, and I thinkI agree, that this was meat sacrifice24000:18:00.319 --> 00:18:04.599to idols. It was going againstGod's law. Right it was? Maybe24100:18:04.720 --> 00:18:11.079pork probably was right. Yeah,and either way, Daniel was saying we24200:18:11.160 --> 00:18:15.430can't eat this meat. It woulddefile defile us, and so let's eat24300:18:15.430 --> 00:18:18.829vegetables. And then that sense,Daniel was sort of slie about this thing.24400:18:18.950 --> 00:18:22.789So it wasn't like direct civil disobedience. It wasn't we going to do24500:18:22.950 --> 00:18:26.470that. It was just like,well, let's eat vegetables for ten days24600:18:26.029 --> 00:18:30.740and if things go well, thenmaybe this is a good idea for everybody.24700:18:30.059 --> 00:18:36.059Yeahs pits it. He's approaching itgently and with respect. As his24800:18:36.380 --> 00:18:40.859first resort, his first resort isnot you know, I will not do24900:18:41.059 --> 00:18:45.809this and you know, pulls,pulls out a knife for anything like that.25000:18:45.369 --> 00:18:51.849He tries to basically offer a solutionwhere he doesn't compromise in any way25100:18:52.529 --> 00:19:02.359his beliefs. But but he's stillpresent very respectfully, a counter to whatever25200:19:02.480 --> 00:19:06.119this edict is. Yeah, yeah, and so he does it and does25300:19:06.160 --> 00:19:08.720it like you said, very respectfully. And then going on just a couple25400:19:08.759 --> 00:19:12.670of chapters past that, in DanielChapter three, we have the story of25500:19:12.950 --> 00:19:18.230Shadrach Meshech and Abendego. Yeah,and you know, they even though they25600:19:18.309 --> 00:19:22.869were pretty straightforward about this. Itseems that they were. They were pretty25700:19:22.869 --> 00:19:27.380respectful, and it says here,says Verse Sixteen of Chapter Three. This25800:19:27.539 --> 00:19:33.059is after Nebuchanezzar had established this whatninety foot idol that people were supposed to25900:19:33.099 --> 00:19:36.500when music play, they were supposedto bow down and and worship this thing.26000:19:36.660 --> 00:19:40.089Several Times today, whenever the trumpetsounded or whatever, they were just26100:19:40.250 --> 00:19:42.609a bow down to the sidal andthen, of course they refused to because26200:19:42.730 --> 00:19:48.730this violates a clear command of God. This violates clearly what we've been told26300:19:48.170 --> 00:19:51.970in God's word. You know,they have the first command us not worship26400:19:52.009 --> 00:19:52.960an idol. I'm the Lord,your God. You have no other gods26500:19:53.000 --> 00:19:56.200before me. Second commands you shouldnot make for yourself an idol. We26600:19:56.319 --> 00:20:00.279can't do this. God has commandedus not to. It would go against26700:20:00.519 --> 00:20:03.559what God's commanded, it would goagainst our conscious and Verse Sixteen and Chapter26800:20:03.680 --> 00:20:08.109Three says Shadrach Meshech and Abednego answeredand said to the king, Old Nebuchadnezzar,26900:20:08.470 --> 00:20:11.309we have no need to answer youin this matter. If there is27000:20:11.549 --> 00:20:15.109just if that is the case,our God whom we serve, say this27100:20:15.230 --> 00:20:18.309is Nebuchadnezzar, had threatened them.If you don't bow down, then you're27200:20:18.309 --> 00:20:22.220going to be you going to bekilled, thrown into a unto the furnace.27300:20:23.019 --> 00:20:26.180Our God, whom we serve,is able to deliver us from the27400:20:26.220 --> 00:20:29.500burning, fiery furnace and he willdeliver us from your hand, Ole King.27500:20:29.940 --> 00:20:32.059But if not, let it beknown, Oh king, that we27600:20:32.140 --> 00:20:34.619will not serve your gods, norwill we worship the golden image of which27700:20:34.619 --> 00:20:38.569you have said, of what youhave set up. So they're saying God27800:20:38.650 --> 00:20:41.650can deliver us, but even ifhe doesn't, we're still not going to27900:20:41.730 --> 00:20:47.410worship your idol. And they're notcalling him names, they're they're not making28000:20:47.450 --> 00:20:51.200any threats, they're just saying thisis a standard we will not violate.28100:20:51.240 --> 00:20:55.640Yeah, and and they do itwith respect. Even look at the our28200:20:55.799 --> 00:21:00.799last passage that we were talking aboutwith the Hebrew midwives that you know,28300:21:00.920 --> 00:21:04.990they're being ordered to murder babies.Yeah, and honestly, it seems like28400:21:06.069 --> 00:21:11.430they would be very justified in saying, you filthy creep, what are you28500:21:11.710 --> 00:21:15.109asking us to do? Have youno conscience? But they don't. They28600:21:15.150 --> 00:21:22.779answered gently and kindly and and withrespect. Yeah, yeah, that's not28700:21:22.859 --> 00:21:26.180easy. Let me, it isnot easy be especially when you look at28800:21:29.220 --> 00:21:33.369what you're facing, particularly with abortion. You're facing the murder, what we28900:21:33.569 --> 00:21:38.730believe is the murder of absolutely haveso many innocent little babies, and I29000:21:38.890 --> 00:21:48.599think our fleshly impulse is to tostrike out at these vile people. Ya29100:21:48.799 --> 00:21:52.119doing this, what we what?This this vile act. And Yeah,29200:21:52.480 --> 00:21:56.599I think even more, you know, more applicable is and you're dealing with29300:21:56.880 --> 00:22:00.470governing authorities that, yeah, makeup laws and that try to apply laws.29400:22:00.509 --> 00:22:03.309I mean, yeah, we didwith some of that. You we've29500:22:03.349 --> 00:22:07.670had anything from signs that we useto show the truth about abortion and show29600:22:07.710 --> 00:22:11.990the truth about a mom choosing life. We've had those signs taken out of29700:22:12.029 --> 00:22:18.059our volunteers hands before. I'm actuallydealing with now a federal lawsuit against the29800:22:18.099 --> 00:22:21.940city of Charlotte. Yeah, sowe have some experience in this realm where29900:22:21.940 --> 00:22:26.980we've had, you know, laws, sound ordinances and and pigting ordinances and30000:22:26.059 --> 00:22:30.089these different things that we've never reallyhad to worry about before because we know30100:22:30.170 --> 00:22:33.690we're not lawbreakers and we write withthe law is. But they've been twisted30200:22:33.849 --> 00:22:37.450in applied in certain ways where it'slike man, in order for us to30300:22:37.529 --> 00:22:41.410do what God's called us to do, we have to disobey, like we're30400:22:41.490 --> 00:22:47.079called you someone wants literature, togive them literature. Yeah, that's part30500:22:47.119 --> 00:22:49.039of you know, our motive ministryis part of our calling. Yeah,30600:22:49.160 --> 00:22:53.799and now we've been written saltations forgiven out literature to somebody who stops in30700:22:53.839 --> 00:22:56.720the driveway and asked for it.Yeah, I mean, in a sense30800:22:57.000 --> 00:23:03.910we are being told do not speakfor up at this last ditch moment,30900:23:03.109 --> 00:23:11.029do not speak and offer what youknow can save lives and your point people31000:23:11.589 --> 00:23:17.059to God. But God commands usin proverbs thirty one, eight to ten.31100:23:17.940 --> 00:23:22.579Speak for those who cannot speak foryourself. So that is an unjust31200:23:22.660 --> 00:23:30.009law that directly violates God's commandment tous to speak and and the methods by31300:23:30.089 --> 00:23:38.250which we speak to these women isour information, literally speaking, which they,31400:23:38.730 --> 00:23:45.720the authorities, have tried to shutdown through the sound ordinance, and31500:23:45.960 --> 00:23:49.839and Our signs, speaking with visualimages. Yes, so you know,31600:23:51.079 --> 00:23:53.000one of the things that I've saidis we're talking about what we're dealing with31700:23:53.160 --> 00:23:56.549personally, and I know what othersyou know. I mentioned California and the31800:23:56.589 --> 00:24:00.390law that had been passed on.Thankfully that's been struck down, from what31900:24:00.549 --> 00:24:04.589understand, where these pro life pregnancycenters not only have to disclose they don't32000:24:04.589 --> 00:24:07.470do abortions, but they have topoint people in the direction of abortions if32100:24:07.470 --> 00:24:11.220they want abortions, which is ridiculousright, but you know, they had32200:24:11.259 --> 00:24:15.220to push back against that and youhave to make the decision because they were32300:24:15.380 --> 00:24:18.740facing if they were if they werenot going to obey that, they were32400:24:18.779 --> 00:24:23.529facing five hundred per incident, initiallywhen it was five hundred for the first32500:24:23.529 --> 00:24:29.089incident in a thousand dollars for everyan incident after that. It's like,32600:24:29.569 --> 00:24:33.130can I obey this? Can Iin good conscience obey not just not talking32700:24:33.170 --> 00:24:38.359about pro life stuff, but actuallybeing compelled to encourage people at least a32800:24:38.440 --> 00:24:41.640point people in the direction of abortions? Like, man, there's no way32900:24:42.000 --> 00:24:45.160right that I can honor God isso I think that's one of the things33000:24:45.319 --> 00:24:49.079is, can I honor God andobey this. And if I'm told I33100:24:49.319 --> 00:24:53.869can't speak against abortion, I haveto in order to honor the Lord.33200:24:53.910 --> 00:24:57.990I know, the slaughter of theinnocence is happening in our city, like33300:24:59.150 --> 00:25:02.710in Matthew Chapter too. Yeah,I have to speak at against. Yeah.33400:25:02.710 --> 00:25:06.109Yeah, and you know, sortof out of this passage, Shadrach,33500:25:06.150 --> 00:25:10.579Meshech and Abednego, is there notjust dealing with some I don't know,33600:25:11.220 --> 00:25:15.180some sort of benign thing, edictor whatever, but this is like33700:25:15.220 --> 00:25:21.299a malicious and malignant thing where they'retold they have to worship this ninety foot33800:25:21.380 --> 00:25:26.450idol in the public square and theyrespectfully. Like I said, it's hard33900:25:26.529 --> 00:25:27.890because, you know, even talkingabout this, I'm getting fired up,34000:25:27.930 --> 00:25:32.170my blood starting a ball because Iman, we have a command from God,34100:25:32.650 --> 00:25:36.279we have this thing called the constitutionin the United States to protect these34200:25:36.279 --> 00:25:38.039rights, and yet we're still havingto deal with this. Yeah, these34300:25:38.319 --> 00:25:41.799guys, though, they didn't havea constitution. They had God's word,34400:25:41.880 --> 00:25:45.119but they didn't have, you know, different courts and things like that they34500:25:45.160 --> 00:25:49.150could appeal to. They couldn't filea federal lawsuit against Nebuchadnezzar. Yeah,34600:25:49.910 --> 00:25:56.670they had to face some pretty toughcircumstances and they were willing to do it,34700:25:56.750 --> 00:25:59.789and I think that's right to andso that goes to the third one34800:26:00.390 --> 00:26:06.339of the guiding principles of civil disobedience, and it's a hard one, but34900:26:06.539 --> 00:26:12.859it is critical that we be preparedto suffer the consequences. Yeah, now,35000:26:14.420 --> 00:26:18.009we know that in the end Godwill reward us, but there can35100:26:18.289 --> 00:26:29.009be dire consequences to any act ofcivil disobedience. So be clear that the35200:26:29.210 --> 00:26:34.039law that you are regarding as unjustand that you are going to disobey is,35300:26:34.160 --> 00:26:41.599is it truly a a law thatforces you to compromise? It's a35400:26:41.799 --> 00:26:47.750moral law, yeah, or animmoral law that causes you to compromise your35500:26:48.390 --> 00:26:52.230ability to honor and glorify God?Yeah, and if it is, yeah,35600:26:52.470 --> 00:26:57.829I think you have no choice butto to fight that. Yeah,35700:26:57.910 --> 00:27:03.500absolutely. Well, let's go intoDaniel, chapter six, I believe it35800:27:03.619 --> 00:27:06.619is. Yeah, Daniel Chapter Six. This is another story, of course,35900:27:06.660 --> 00:27:08.420we all know. My Name's Daniel, so Daniels. So that's your36000:27:08.460 --> 00:27:11.579favorite book, right, favorite.This nicely my favorite book of the Bible,36100:27:11.700 --> 00:27:15.890though, but it's one of myfavorite yes, and in the story36200:27:15.930 --> 00:27:19.329of Daniel Daniel in the lions den. When I tell people in my name36300:27:19.569 --> 00:27:22.809and they're like how I need toremember that, it's easy. Daniel the36400:27:22.890 --> 00:27:26.569license, just remember the guy inthe lions didn't right. Of course,36500:27:26.809 --> 00:27:30.680the stay of the story of Danielthe lions didn't begins with an unrighteous edict36600:27:32.599 --> 00:27:37.839from King Darius. In this situationwhere these men, apparently some of the36700:27:37.920 --> 00:27:41.279Council Darius, were jealous of Danielbecause he was favored by the king and36800:27:41.400 --> 00:27:45.910they convinced him to make up thisthis new law that you can't pray for36900:27:45.950 --> 00:27:48.269a certain amount of time. Ithink it was thirty days or something like37000:27:48.349 --> 00:27:56.589that, to any other deity orany other God or any other entity except37100:27:56.589 --> 00:28:00.619for the king. And and whenthis was passed, here's what it says37200:28:00.700 --> 00:28:04.539in Daniel, chapter six and verseeight. Now, when Daniel knew that37300:28:04.619 --> 00:28:08.180the writing was signed, so thislaw was passed, you know it was37400:28:08.259 --> 00:28:14.170signed, he went home and inhis upper room with his window open toward37500:28:14.210 --> 00:28:17.250Jerusalem. So he didn't do itin silence, he didn't do it behind37600:28:17.289 --> 00:28:21.930closed doors, he opened his windowtowards Jerusalem. So, and it's with37700:28:22.049 --> 00:28:25.490his window opened towards Jerusalem he kneltdown on his knees three times that day37800:28:25.769 --> 00:28:30.079and prayed and gave thanks before hisGod, as was his custom since early37900:28:30.160 --> 00:28:34.000days. Daniel apparently did this allthe time. This is his custom,38000:28:34.079 --> 00:28:38.279this is what he did. Neverhad a problem till they passed this law38100:28:40.000 --> 00:28:42.710and rather than saying wow, Imaybe I should obey this thing, maybe38200:28:42.710 --> 00:28:48.430I should go and hide and andpray in secret. I mean the Bible38300:28:48.509 --> 00:28:51.509says you should pray in secrets,what Jesus says. So I can justify38400:28:51.670 --> 00:28:53.670by just close step out of yourcustom, because obviously they're going to be38500:28:53.710 --> 00:28:56.660they know your custom, they're goingto be looking for here. You're setting38600:28:56.700 --> 00:29:00.539yourself up for failure here. DYeah, Daniel, what are you doing38700:29:00.660 --> 00:29:03.180here? Don't you know you shouldobey the governing authorities? And yet he38800:29:03.380 --> 00:29:07.819goes with his window open now,right, didn't believe it all. Right38900:29:07.859 --> 00:29:10.690after that, right right after theysaid it, he goes open the window.39000:29:10.730 --> 00:29:12.250I mean it says now when heknew. When Daniel knew, so39100:29:12.569 --> 00:29:15.690he knew this thing. So itwas like here's the here's the cause and39200:29:15.730 --> 00:29:18.089effects, and I found out thisthing. So he went rite home and39300:29:18.170 --> 00:29:22.490pray. Now I don't think itwas Daniel's motive at all, because you39400:29:22.569 --> 00:29:26.920look at this guy, who's justa humble man, love God, that39500:29:27.400 --> 00:29:30.319he was doing this for show.I mean open his window for show.39600:29:30.400 --> 00:29:33.240Knows, there's this customs we alwaysthey did, right, this is yeah,39700:29:33.240 --> 00:29:37.119he prayed and he prayed toward Rusalemthree times a day. Yeah,39800:29:37.160 --> 00:29:42.190he kept doing what he had doneand ultimately he's apprehended and he's thrown into39900:29:42.230 --> 00:29:45.069the lions den and, you know, by God's grace he was saved.40000:29:45.710 --> 00:29:49.029But he knew full well, knewthat he could be eaten by the Lions.40100:29:49.390 --> 00:29:56.140Yeah, and and yet he stilldid this act of civil disobedient right,40200:29:56.180 --> 00:30:00.940right, and he suffered the consequencesand in this case, as in40300:30:00.980 --> 00:30:06.619the case with the Hebrew midwives,God stepped in and saved him. Yeah,40400:30:07.289 --> 00:30:10.809it's sad. With Chad Rach Mescheckin a Bandigo, God's diving rescue40500:30:10.809 --> 00:30:14.769right from the fiery fern, right, but he doesn't always know, you40600:30:14.849 --> 00:30:18.849know, he doesn't always and Ithink we have to be prepared for the40700:30:18.970 --> 00:30:25.519fact that we may suffer. Andyou know, Jesus is a perfect example40800:30:25.640 --> 00:30:30.160of that. He he did notanswer Herod was Adhrod that was questioning him.40900:30:30.200 --> 00:30:34.319And he was and pilot and hewas just silent and he could have41000:30:34.519 --> 00:30:38.950rescued himself there, but he wouldnot answer you. The only answer gay,41100:30:40.069 --> 00:30:42.150just as Satans pilot was like,don't you know, I have the41200:30:42.190 --> 00:30:45.789power to set you free. Andhe says you have no power except that41300:30:45.910 --> 00:30:48.230which is given to you. Basically, you're under God's authority. Right,41400:30:48.269 --> 00:30:52.579ultimately, man put yourself in check. And you know what, honestly,41500:30:52.700 --> 00:30:57.500that is a great guiding principle aswell as well that statement by Jesus.41600:30:57.579 --> 00:31:02.299You would have no power unless itwas given to you by God. And41700:31:02.579 --> 00:31:04.609so you know, when we goforth, if we keep that in our41800:31:04.690 --> 00:31:11.930heart and mind, we remember thatwe serve the God of all power.41900:31:12.210 --> 00:31:18.369Yeah, and and it is toI mean that's that brings me to some42000:31:18.490 --> 00:31:21.599of the pastors that we were talkingabout that are sort of difficult. So42100:31:21.680 --> 00:31:25.119we can is there are some.Yeah, we had passages. We talked42200:31:25.119 --> 00:31:30.640about the civil civil disobedience passages,some of those at least, and you42300:31:30.720 --> 00:31:33.390know how God honored those people.And I believe, no matter what,42400:31:33.509 --> 00:31:37.269listen, if Shadwick Mischannak in aBANDAGO would have been consumed in the fiery42500:31:37.349 --> 00:31:41.470furnace. Still, God would havehonored them in eternity. Right. But42600:31:41.549 --> 00:31:44.950God honored them in that case bysaving them. The Hebrew midwise, in42700:31:44.990 --> 00:31:48.700the same and Daniel the same evenif. But their motive was not that42800:31:48.819 --> 00:31:51.660God's going to rescue me. Theirmotive was I'm going to honor God no42900:31:51.740 --> 00:31:55.180matter what. Honor them no matterwhat. But we have here in Roman43000:31:55.180 --> 00:31:59.380chapter thirteen. This is where mymind always goes when I'm thinking about governing43100:31:59.420 --> 00:32:04.369authorities and dealing with the government andthat sort of thing, and I'm kind43200:32:04.410 --> 00:32:07.690of give well, let's just readthe passage, okay, and Romans Thirteen,43300:32:07.730 --> 00:32:10.690verse one. Let every soul besubject to the governing authorities, for43400:32:10.769 --> 00:32:15.079there's no authority except from God,and the authorities that exist are appointed by43500:32:15.079 --> 00:32:20.319God. Therefore, whoever resists theAuthority resists the ordinance of God, and43600:32:20.440 --> 00:32:23.079those who resist will bring judgment onthemselves, for rulers are not a terror43700:32:23.119 --> 00:32:27.240to good works, but evil.Do you want to be unafraid of the43800:32:27.279 --> 00:32:30.269Authority? Do what is good andyou will have praise from the same,43900:32:30.150 --> 00:32:34.950for he is God's minister to youfor good, but if you do evil,44000:32:35.109 --> 00:32:37.630be afraid, for he does notbear the sword in vain, for44100:32:37.750 --> 00:32:40.549he is God's minister and Avenger toexecute wrath on Him who practices evil.44200:32:40.589 --> 00:32:44.700Therefore, you must be subject,not only too because of wrath, but44300:32:44.779 --> 00:32:50.259also for constant sake, for becauseof this you will pay taxes. You44400:32:50.420 --> 00:32:53.859also, you also pay taxes fortheir God's ministers attending continually to this very44500:32:53.980 --> 00:32:58.650thing, render taxes so basicly,he's talking about taxes. I don't think44600:32:58.650 --> 00:33:00.890that's the only context here. Wesaw tags. I think it's primary context44700:33:01.210 --> 00:33:05.930where's talking about taxes, and sosome Christians might ask the question, do44800:33:06.049 --> 00:33:08.529I need to pay my taxes?And Yeah, you do, and Jesus44900:33:08.569 --> 00:33:12.529even said that. Yeah, givethe seas as, those that are caesars45000:33:12.569 --> 00:33:16.000and right to God this thing.But how do we how do we view45100:33:16.039 --> 00:33:19.839this, this passage, in lightof what we're talking about, because we're45200:33:19.920 --> 00:33:25.160looking at Old Testament examples, andwe mentioned and we'll mention again, probably45300:33:25.200 --> 00:33:31.549we need to read those passages andRomans or acts. Sorry about these apostles45400:33:31.670 --> 00:33:37.269who disobeyed, and so they hadsome commands from governing authorities, and yet45500:33:37.309 --> 00:33:42.940this passage just telling us that weneed to obey those governing authorities. Yeah,45600:33:43.460 --> 00:33:49.299let me jump on to the firstPeter Passage right because I think it45700:33:49.380 --> 00:33:52.259ties in its pretty much the samethemes. Is What Paul's given enrollments.45800:33:53.700 --> 00:33:58.009But it says, and you knowthis is all those who are listen,45900:33:58.089 --> 00:34:00.170Peter. What First Peter Chapter Two? Okay, and you know I'm a46000:34:00.250 --> 00:34:04.609context guy. I don't like tojust read a passage out of its context.46100:34:04.730 --> 00:34:07.849But I won't read the greater contextof this passage because I think it's46200:34:07.849 --> 00:34:10.400pretty obvious. But for those whowant to just read first Peter, it's46300:34:10.480 --> 00:34:15.199very short. You'll get the contextof what Peter's talking about here, but46400:34:15.239 --> 00:34:17.679I'll jump into verse thirteen. Itsays therefore, and you know, when46500:34:17.679 --> 00:34:21.079there's a therefore, you should lookback and see what it's there for.46600:34:21.360 --> 00:34:23.159So I encourage you to look atthe context of this. But therefore submit46700:34:23.199 --> 00:34:28.110yourselves to every ordinance of Man forGod's sake, rather through the king of46800:34:28.190 --> 00:34:31.110supreme or to governors, as thosewho are sent by him for the punishment46900:34:31.110 --> 00:34:35.670of evildoers and for the praise ofthose who do good, for this is47000:34:35.710 --> 00:34:38.420the will of God that by doinggood, you may put the science ignorance47100:34:38.539 --> 00:34:43.900of foolish men as free. Yetnot using liberty as a cloak for vice,47200:34:44.099 --> 00:34:46.260but as bond servants of the Lord, Honor All people, love the47300:34:46.340 --> 00:34:51.500Brotherhood, fear God, honor theking. So again, here's here's a47400:34:51.619 --> 00:34:54.050context. Or we're dealing with obedienceto government. You know, Paul says,47500:34:54.090 --> 00:34:59.610submit yourself to every ordinance of Man. Peter says, submit yourselves to47600:34:59.650 --> 00:35:04.889every ordinance of Man. And we'retalking about ordinances, right, we're dealing47700:35:04.929 --> 00:35:09.960with what we believe to be someunjust ordinances here in Charlotte and looking around,47800:35:10.360 --> 00:35:15.199you know there's some unjust ordinances,some things. That calls prolife ministries47900:35:15.239 --> 00:35:19.760to have issues. Well, notjust even your life. Let's just look48000:35:19.800 --> 00:35:24.630at abortion. Yeah, abortion inand of itself is allowed my law.48100:35:25.030 --> 00:35:28.630Yeah, our country. Yeah,yes, I'm say, it's the it's48200:35:28.670 --> 00:35:30.510the law of the land, youknow. Right, Rudy weight, right,48300:35:30.750 --> 00:35:32.710but yeah, by the way,Ruby weight is not a law.48400:35:32.869 --> 00:35:38.420Right. The courts, because ofthe constitution, are not to make laws,48500:35:39.500 --> 00:35:44.059but they have in some senses,which is horrible. Right. That48600:35:44.179 --> 00:35:45.980could be a podcast for another day. That's because that would be along going48700:35:46.059 --> 00:35:52.449to go through. Yeah, butyeah, so we look at these ordinances48800:35:52.530 --> 00:35:55.809of man and we look at someof the hindrances that they cost us personally,48900:35:58.610 --> 00:36:01.809and we're like, we have todo what you know. Let's go49000:36:01.889 --> 00:36:05.800back to the to acts. Andthis is what they said in the book49100:36:05.800 --> 00:36:10.519of acts. Okay, they weretold by the governing authorities and acts chapter49200:36:10.719 --> 00:36:15.039four, I believe it is.And you know, they were preaching the49300:36:15.079 --> 00:36:21.349name of Jesus, they were healingpeople in the name of Jesus and ultimately49400:36:21.429 --> 00:36:25.070the Pharisees who were rulers, theywere in charge. Hmm, in some49500:36:25.230 --> 00:36:30.230ways. Now, they weren't incomplete charge because Romans, the Romans ruled49600:36:30.230 --> 00:36:35.940Jerusalem and and the whole area ofIsrael there, but they at least had49700:36:36.019 --> 00:36:40.579some authority and there at least youknow, religious and you know secular one49800:36:40.579 --> 00:36:46.530elsa secular bit governmental authorities. Andit says in verse thirteen of Acts Chapter49900:36:46.690 --> 00:36:52.090Four. Now and they it's thePharisees or the the Sahedron, so the50000:36:52.130 --> 00:36:55.090Pharisees is said to season and theother rulers there in Jerusalem, when they50100:36:55.090 --> 00:37:00.090saw the boldness of Peter and Johnand perceive that they were uneducated and untrained50200:37:00.130 --> 00:37:02.239men, they marveled and they realizethat they had been with Jesus. So50300:37:02.360 --> 00:37:07.079they recognize this thing about them thathad been with Jesus and seeing the man50400:37:07.119 --> 00:37:08.679who had been healed standing with them, they could say nothing against it.50500:37:09.480 --> 00:37:15.599But it basically what happens is theytake these guys into their authority, to50600:37:15.639 --> 00:37:21.789their custody, and they beat themactually for healing a man. Yeah,50700:37:21.829 --> 00:37:27.550for healing a man. And andit says this is them conversing with themselves.50800:37:27.789 --> 00:37:30.980But so that it spreads no furtheramong the people, let us severely50900:37:30.099 --> 00:37:36.460threatened them that they now, thatthey now they speak in the name of51000:37:36.539 --> 00:37:38.940Jesus. No more. So they'renot supposed to speak in Jesus name it.51100:37:39.300 --> 00:37:42.940So they called them a commanded themthat they should not speak nor teach51200:37:43.179 --> 00:37:45.010in the name of Jesus. ButPeter and John, and this is the51300:37:45.050 --> 00:37:51.050same Peter That wrote first Peter.Okay, so there's some context here and51400:37:51.449 --> 00:37:54.250there's some there's things that we needto reconcile in our understanding here, which51500:37:54.289 --> 00:37:58.570we'll talk about. But Peter andJohn answered and said to them whether it51600:37:58.719 --> 00:38:00.039is right, in the sight ofGod, to listen to you more than51700:38:00.119 --> 00:38:05.239God, you Judge Verse Twenty.I love this passage, for we cannot51800:38:05.639 --> 00:38:09.719but speak the things which we haveseen and heard. And so when they51900:38:09.719 --> 00:38:15.230had further threatened them, they letthem go, finding no way of punishing52000:38:15.269 --> 00:38:19.110them because of the people, sincethey all glorified God for what had been52100:38:19.150 --> 00:38:23.949done. And so this man's healed, God's glorify the Gospels preached. These52200:38:24.030 --> 00:38:29.900guys are ticked off. So theyarrest Peter and John and there threatened them.52300:38:30.019 --> 00:38:31.019I said, they beat them ifthey didn't in this pastor. I52400:38:31.059 --> 00:38:37.699think later on they actually do.Okay, and then they threatened them,52500:38:37.739 --> 00:38:39.500tell them to can't speak. No, no more speaking in the name of52600:38:39.539 --> 00:38:43.650Jesus. No, we're preaching thisGospel about this Jesus. Okay, we52700:38:43.769 --> 00:38:45.889don't hear the stuff anymore because we'regonna we're going to put you to death,52800:38:45.969 --> 00:38:50.730whatever they threaten them with. Yeah, and Peter and John's response is52900:38:50.969 --> 00:38:53.250you judge for yourself whether it's rightfor us to listen to you or to53000:38:53.369 --> 00:38:57.920God. For us, we're goingto listen to God. Yeah, we53100:38:58.039 --> 00:39:00.800can't help it. He's basically saying, we can't help it, we can't53200:39:00.840 --> 00:39:04.039help but speak the things which wehave seen, in which we have heard53300:39:04.119 --> 00:39:07.000what he's talking about. The DeathBear on resurrection of Jesus and the miracles53400:39:07.079 --> 00:39:13.309that Jesus had performed, this majestyof this Glorious Savior. We can't keep53500:39:13.309 --> 00:39:15.670our mouth shut about this thing.It's not just that we don't want to,53600:39:15.789 --> 00:39:19.829it's like we can't, we can'thelp we have to speak this this53700:39:20.389 --> 00:39:23.820truth about Jesus, and in thesame way with us and the application that53800:39:23.900 --> 00:39:28.940we're dealing with here in Charlotte.I mean, we've been struck, of53900:39:29.059 --> 00:39:31.739course, with the Majesty of Jesusand we can't help but preach the Gospel,54000:39:32.539 --> 00:39:37.380but also we've been, you know, dealt with the Holy Spirit for54100:39:37.500 --> 00:39:40.489what's happening in our city, thefact that little baby boys and little baby54200:39:40.530 --> 00:39:45.289girls are being murdered just minutes awayfrom our churches, from our homes.54300:39:45.969 --> 00:39:50.250Like we have to speak against thisthing. We have and we've seen the54400:39:50.409 --> 00:39:53.119effect of speaking against this. We'veseen MOMS choose life. We just had54500:39:53.400 --> 00:39:59.280the day after Christmas. Today wejust had a mom who had had an54600:39:59.320 --> 00:40:04.280abortion broken yeah, and was comingactually to the abortion clinic again, actually54700:40:04.320 --> 00:40:07.000hoping that we would be there right. Thankfully, by God's grace, we54800:40:07.119 --> 00:40:09.510were right and we shared the truthwith her. She chose life for that54900:40:09.630 --> 00:40:15.230baby and she's getting ministered to fromher previous abortion and, like man,55000:40:15.309 --> 00:40:16.829we've seen the result of this thing. We know what God can do.55100:40:16.989 --> 00:40:22.980We must speak this truth. Towithhold this truth would be a crime against55200:40:22.059 --> 00:40:27.900God and against these women. Yeah, ultimately you'll be held account by someone55300:40:28.059 --> 00:40:31.380to account. Yeah, it beheld to account by God for what you55400:40:31.579 --> 00:40:35.340have done or haven't done? Orwill it be held to account by,55500:40:36.289 --> 00:40:38.690you know, some Civic Authority,Civil Authority, for what you have done55600:40:38.730 --> 00:40:47.570or or not done? And certainlymy my preference is that my heart would55700:40:47.650 --> 00:40:53.400long to be held to account byGod and to have done what he has55800:40:53.519 --> 00:40:58.119commanded us to do. What orone of the things? And you know,55900:40:58.199 --> 00:41:01.320we're not not going to be ableto get into the depth of Romans,56000:41:01.360 --> 00:41:05.829chapter thirteen and all the back andforth arguments about that. Maybe we56100:41:05.869 --> 00:41:08.510will at some future podcast, maybehave someone on WHO's smarter than us about56200:41:08.510 --> 00:41:14.150this stuff. But one of thethings I will say is that in Romans56300:41:14.590 --> 00:41:17.900and in Peter What Peters talking about, you're dealing with, you know,56400:41:17.980 --> 00:41:23.219a literal empire, a monarchy whereyou have the highest level of government is56500:41:23.420 --> 00:41:28.820the emperor. Is the Roman emperor, and that's what you're dealing with.56600:41:28.940 --> 00:41:31.739That context, in the context we'redealing with here in the United States of56700:41:31.780 --> 00:41:36.849America. You know what the highestlevel of government is in this country,56800:41:37.849 --> 00:41:40.210the highest level of the highest authorityin this country, in our country?56900:41:42.289 --> 00:41:46.199Well, yes, I would assumeit's congress. President. No, no,57000:41:46.800 --> 00:41:51.519actually, some no, court,not a not gonna happen. No,57100:41:52.239 --> 00:41:55.599the constitution. Oh, of course, the constitution is what gives these57200:41:57.000 --> 00:42:00.789it's what lays out these different areasof government, these three branches of government57300:42:00.869 --> 00:42:04.710or all they wouldn't exist. Itwouldn't for the constitution. Now, it's57400:42:04.750 --> 00:42:07.829true that not necessarily everyone in governmentis going to abide or agree with that.57500:42:07.989 --> 00:42:12.789They're right kind of rewriting their ownlittle constantation. That's the that's the57600:42:12.869 --> 00:42:15.460issue. Yeah, so the highestlevel of government that we have to obey57700:42:15.460 --> 00:42:20.300in this country is the constitution,and there are things that are very plain57800:42:20.460 --> 00:42:23.260in the constitution, like the freedomof speech. Yeah, we shall not57900:42:23.380 --> 00:42:27.380be infringed upon. I mean,come on, you can't get more clear58000:42:27.539 --> 00:42:31.610than that. And yet these thereare government entities that try to circumvent or58100:42:31.650 --> 00:42:37.050usurp the authority that the constitution hasin this country and that creates a lot58200:42:37.130 --> 00:42:40.210of problems. Yeah, it's soone of the the appeals that I make.58300:42:40.289 --> 00:42:45.039You know, if I'm going togive out a pamphlet to a mom58400:42:45.119 --> 00:42:47.320that's going into an abortion clinic andI'm threatened with a CETACEAN for stepping into58500:42:47.360 --> 00:42:51.599the driveway or for stepping around apolice barricade or whatever. And this you58600:42:51.639 --> 00:42:54.800know well, the weird threats.One of our guys got jaywalking a couple58700:42:54.800 --> 00:42:59.429of weeks ago for walking across thestreet and given literature. It's like this58800:42:59.590 --> 00:43:02.309not in because there's yeah, crossthe crosswalk, because the crosswalk within a58900:43:02.349 --> 00:43:05.710mile and I have it. It'sfunny, but it stinks because we have59000:43:05.750 --> 00:43:07.630to get a quart over this,we have to fight this, we have59100:43:07.670 --> 00:43:10.309to get a lawyer in all this. It's ridiculous, right, but it's59200:43:10.349 --> 00:43:15.460like I have to do that ifI know it can save a baby's life.59300:43:15.980 --> 00:43:20.260And also I know according to theconstitution I have a right to speak59400:43:20.300 --> 00:43:24.539or giving literature is speech. Togive literature to somebody that asks for Yes,59500:43:24.739 --> 00:43:29.610I know I'm not violating my conscience. I'm honoring God first and foremost,59600:43:29.849 --> 00:43:31.369but I'm also I'm not violating thelaw of the land because it's the59700:43:31.409 --> 00:43:37.289constitution. Yeah, so there arecertainly constitutional portions of the Constitution, such59800:43:37.329 --> 00:43:43.360a slavery, that that I dothink, violate gods. Yeah, absolutely.59900:43:43.360 --> 00:43:46.840And so there are times when thehighest law of the land is immoral.60000:43:47.000 --> 00:43:51.320Yeah, and absolutely it is unjust. And then that, you know,60100:43:51.519 --> 00:43:54.750then God is, though, supreme. Yeah, above it all.60200:43:55.269 --> 00:43:59.590One of the things I would havea hard time with the the Romans Thirteen60300:43:59.630 --> 00:44:02.030finding like a whole to be ableto say, okay, you can,60400:44:02.789 --> 00:44:07.110you can kind of disregard that.But in the was it in the first60500:44:07.150 --> 00:44:13.179Peter? There's Peter beausage. Itsays fear God to write, and there60600:44:13.900 --> 00:44:17.539in the list of things was fearGod. And so in the list of60700:44:17.739 --> 00:44:22.579who were your to honor and obey, God is clearly mentioned fear God.60800:44:22.739 --> 00:44:27.730And of course, throughout the BibleGod's Word is Supreme. Yeah, so60900:44:28.130 --> 00:44:31.610when he's in the list and you'veyou can then kind of pick, well,61000:44:31.690 --> 00:44:37.570which one of my kind of honorand and if the laws of men61100:44:38.440 --> 00:44:42.840contradict the laws of God, Ithink you could make an argument in that61200:44:43.000 --> 00:44:46.800passage well, fear God is isthe most important. Yeah, so I61300:44:46.920 --> 00:44:50.719don't know if that's true in theRomans. Thirteen one, I didn't really61400:44:50.880 --> 00:44:52.349pick up any. Yeah, likeI said, it's impossible for us to61500:44:52.429 --> 00:44:55.710dig in the meat of that.But I will say just practically. You61600:44:55.829 --> 00:45:01.309know, the Apostle, peter isnot contradicting himself. When are whereas before,61700:45:01.349 --> 00:45:06.309he disobeyed and did it respectfully thegoverning authorities. I say we can't,61800:45:06.349 --> 00:45:07.099we have to speak in the nameof Jesus, even they were,61900:45:07.139 --> 00:45:13.179they were told not to. Yeah, and Paul of course himself knowing that62000:45:13.340 --> 00:45:16.099in many scenarios he could be arrested, and it was. You know,62100:45:16.219 --> 00:45:21.809he was told actually in acts lateron the governing authorities in Jurus. Some62200:45:21.929 --> 00:45:23.369didn't like Paul so much either.You know, I don't know if he's62300:45:23.409 --> 00:45:27.570directly told. Don't recall him beingdirectly told don't speak in the name of62400:45:27.610 --> 00:45:30.610Jesus, but he was arrested andultimately given over to the Romans, yeah,62500:45:30.730 --> 00:45:36.000for what seems to be an actof civil disobedience. So there's there's62600:45:36.000 --> 00:45:38.400some context that I think can easilybe, I consolid again, we're not62700:45:38.440 --> 00:45:43.639going to be able to do itright here, right now. That lets62800:45:43.639 --> 00:45:46.679us know that there are acts ofsizzle, civil disobedience, and we see62900:45:46.679 --> 00:45:51.789that, course, in the passage. We read in Daniel and in exodus63000:45:52.469 --> 00:45:54.550that there are times when, inorder to honor God, you have to63100:45:54.630 --> 00:46:00.550disobey governing a thorn. Yeah,yeah, but it does create, I63200:46:00.590 --> 00:46:05.420don't know if that's where you're going. It does create some questions about,63300:46:06.219 --> 00:46:08.260well, how far do you takethat? It does, it does,63400:46:08.420 --> 00:46:15.460and I think it's really important.Something that I was thinking about as I63500:46:15.739 --> 00:46:22.809was researching this subject was in allthe examples of civil disobedience from an individual63600:46:23.210 --> 00:46:30.690who loved the Lord in the Bible, do I ever see an example where63700:46:30.730 --> 00:46:36.519violence was used? Yeah, andI don't. I can't recall. And63800:46:36.639 --> 00:46:43.000in fact I think Jesus's example isclear that we don't respond with violence.63900:46:43.239 --> 00:46:46.869Maybe he's arrested, unjustly, arrestedfor crimes he never committed. Yeah,64000:46:47.150 --> 00:46:52.630in the garden of cassemone and andone of his disciples cuts off the ear64100:46:52.789 --> 00:46:57.590of one of slee exactly the opposite, right, yeah, he didn't even64200:46:57.630 --> 00:47:00.429grab a sword with Peter he rightly, he's the gas ere. Heals the64300:47:00.659 --> 00:47:09.139ear and and so I don't thinkof the things that were called not to64400:47:09.300 --> 00:47:15.090do in being civilly disobedient. Idon't think we're called to violence. Yeah,64500:47:16.409 --> 00:47:20.050I don't see that. Biblically,yeah, I don't either. And64600:47:20.329 --> 00:47:23.090of course that's where folks mind willgo. If you can just violate laws64700:47:23.969 --> 00:47:28.329with then wow, what's holding youback from violating whatever, any law?64800:47:28.369 --> 00:47:32.639Yeah, but what's holding this bagif you violate a law that you see64900:47:32.719 --> 00:47:37.360is unjust? Number one is youdon't just do it Willie Neilly. You65000:47:37.400 --> 00:47:42.000don't just do it off the cuffand just disregard the law. You've considered65100:47:42.119 --> 00:47:46.349the law, you've thought about whatthis thing might you know for the consequences65200:47:46.389 --> 00:47:51.789might be, but also the contextof this law and how it contradicts the65300:47:51.829 --> 00:47:54.510ord to God and the convictions ofyour heart. So you don't just do65400:47:54.630 --> 00:47:59.820it right off the cuff, Willieneely. It's something that you you have65500:48:00.019 --> 00:48:01.699well, you thought it through.Yeah, and you know, as I'm65600:48:01.739 --> 00:48:06.659thinking through, these three principles inthe middle one of respect. You know,65700:48:06.820 --> 00:48:09.619just again from our example on thesidewalk, not that we're a perfect65800:48:09.659 --> 00:48:17.809example by any means, but butwhenever there has been something proposed by the65900:48:17.969 --> 00:48:24.130officers out there as the law thatthey're you know, at least the law66000:48:24.130 --> 00:48:30.719of the day. We, Ithink, pretty uniformly respectfully approach them and66100:48:30.320 --> 00:48:35.800respectfully challenge. Well, can youshow us that? Yeah, we asked,66200:48:36.000 --> 00:48:38.079you know, show us. ShowUS where where they're always sad what?66300:48:38.320 --> 00:48:45.710And and and then we have oftenused, I think, creative ways66400:48:45.269 --> 00:48:53.389to abide by the law but stillbe able to do what we know we're66500:48:53.469 --> 00:48:59.139called to do. Yeah, soyou know. And an example on in66600:48:59.300 --> 00:49:04.780our situation is we're not allowed tocross a police barricade to hand out literature66700:49:05.099 --> 00:49:07.260to women pulling in, even ifthey roll down their window and reach for66800:49:07.340 --> 00:49:12.650it. So we're using grabbers nowand we and a baby from all use66900:49:12.690 --> 00:49:15.409the reach on the top right.And I think a week ago a baby67000:49:15.650 --> 00:49:21.369was literally the mom took the literaturefrom the grabber and and and read the67100:49:21.449 --> 00:49:24.719literature and drove out of that placein chose life for her baby. So67200:49:24.880 --> 00:49:31.039I think whenever possible you certainly wantto work within the confines of the law,67300:49:31.280 --> 00:49:36.639but that is not always possible.Yeah, it's not always possible,67400:49:36.760 --> 00:49:40.789but you God gives wisdom, Godgives us grace that the chief principle here67500:49:40.949 --> 00:49:45.230is we have to seek to honorGod. We have to fear the Lord.67600:49:45.230 --> 00:49:47.989Yeah, and if we would fearGod and God give us wisdom in67700:49:49.070 --> 00:49:52.750these situations, and if we haveto fall, follow lawsuit. That's part67800:49:52.789 --> 00:49:54.539of the law of the land inthis country. The way the constitution is67900:49:54.579 --> 00:49:58.579set up, we can actually suethe government for infringing on our rights.68000:49:59.099 --> 00:50:00.820We're doing that. So those whoare listening, please pray for us.68100:50:01.059 --> 00:50:05.500This is law suit. We woulda would be victorious in the city would68200:50:05.500 --> 00:50:08.929stop trying to hinder what we're doing. Yeah, but we have to honor68300:50:08.969 --> 00:50:14.769the Lord. But we have toalso understand there are sometimes consequences. Sometimes68400:50:14.769 --> 00:50:16.369you're going to get thrown in thefiery furnace or in the Lions Den.68500:50:16.610 --> 00:50:22.039God didn't always rescue you. Youknow, Jesus, ultimately it's different scenario,68600:50:22.039 --> 00:50:25.039because he was he was destined todie. But the apostles, they68700:50:25.079 --> 00:50:29.960were beaten, they were thrown inprison. Peter was actually later on in68800:50:30.159 --> 00:50:32.119acts, I think was chapter five, where he was thrown in prison.68900:50:32.199 --> 00:50:36.269Yeah, and he suffered. Yeah, and you know what? I think69000:50:36.269 --> 00:50:40.710it's maybe the greatest test of faiththat I have ever had in my life69100:50:42.230 --> 00:50:45.150is how much do you trust God? Yeah, do you know what God69200:50:45.349 --> 00:50:51.780says. Are you doing it?And if you're going to bear some harsh69300:50:52.019 --> 00:50:58.179and difficult consequences as a result,will you still obey God? Yeah,69400:50:58.340 --> 00:51:05.250and and if you do, it'sbecause you believe God. You believe he's69500:51:05.289 --> 00:51:12.530there. You REBOI, you believehe eternally rewards those who who obey and69600:51:12.690 --> 00:51:16.690follow and love him and you trustthat, no matter what happened, he69700:51:17.250 --> 00:51:23.320is in control and it will allbe used for his purposes. Yeah,69800:51:23.760 --> 00:51:29.480yeah, well, I think withthat will wrap this thing up. We69900:51:29.519 --> 00:51:32.829appreciate those who listen. We wouldlove if you reached out to us.70000:51:32.949 --> 00:51:38.590You can reach out to me viaemail and and just suggest maybe some subjects70100:51:38.630 --> 00:51:43.510that we can cover. May somemaybe some things per life, ministry issues70200:51:43.590 --> 00:51:46.219or whatever that you have questions aboutand you want us to talk through.70300:51:46.260 --> 00:51:51.139We'd love to do that. Myemail is d parks at cities for lifecom.70400:51:52.179 --> 00:51:54.980Vicky is v COSSI ORG at citiesfor lifecom. You can connect with70500:51:55.019 --> 00:51:59.619us on our website, CHARLOTTE DOTcities for Life Dot Org, and our70600:51:59.659 --> 00:52:06.570sidewalk counseling with training website is wwwdot sidewalks. The number four Lifecom we'd70700:52:06.570 --> 00:52:08.889love to hear from you. Guys. We appreciate those who listen and hope70800:52:08.929 --> 00:52:13.929that you had a blessed Christmas andwe will talk to you in the New70900:52:14.010 --> 00:52:27.400Year. Give me our love forlove, give me our loft for gratitude.71000:52:30.429 --> 00:52:37.909I know it will cost me mylife. Nothing's too precious. In71100:52:38.190 --> 00:52:39.230some met you